When to Move to a New and Better Team (long)

Get_A_Grip

Get_A_Grip

Truth Will Set You Free
Silver Member
I know that I'm probably not alone here -- but I play in two different leagues -- a slop league and a BCA league (both 8-ball).

I am by far, the best player on both teams. We took 1st in the slop league last year and this is my first year in the BCA 3-man 8-ball league.

The problem is -- on the BCA team -- my teammates are essentially C-players (but are in total denial about their level of play). The slop league is even worse. I joined both teams because I was asked by someone, and didn't really have any other connections to get onto a really good team -- so because I just wanted to play, I joined with these teams.

Recently, I have literally not even been able to watch my teammates play their games -- due to getting so frustrated with their missing very easy shots and not even knowing how to get position in routine situations. It has become painful to watch most of these games for me. So basically, I'm just not enjoying being on such weak teams anymore.

Just last night, someone from one of the top teams in the city league asked for my phone number and wants to know if I would be interested in joining their team. I told him that I definitely am interested in playing on a really strong team, so he plans to call me so that I can meet the team and "try-out". He also said that they would want me to go to State with their team and play (when my slop-league team also goes to State).

Problem is, I really don't want to play 3-nights a week -- but I also feel that it would be quite rude to just quit the other teams. In fact, I know that even if I decide to move to the new team next year, the players and Captain of my current teams will be mad at me and take it personal.

Is this a case, when I just need to do what is in "my" best interest and try to get off of the weak teams as soon as possible...and move to the much stronger team? Or should I take the high road....and stay on both weak teams until the bitter end....and just hope that the invitation to join the strong team will still be available next year?

If anyone has any personal experiences to share (with the good and bad outcomes) that will probably really be of help to me. (NOTE: I'm pretty sure that I will fulfill my commitment and stay on the weak teams until the end of the season. But I'm uncertain as to whether I will also join the strong team and go to State with them this year).

Thanks.
 
That is a tough one...I am not sure what I would do. I would probably see out the rest of the league with the weak teams and then tell them what you are going to do after the league so that they have ample time to replace you with another player. I am a competitive person by nature and would want to compete at the highest level with the better team because your slop team just goes to the state for fun whereas the good team would go to WIN.
 
I have been down a similar road. Mine was due to my captain and several members deciding to play out of another pool hall. I really liked where we were at and I made that clear but I felt alone in the matter so I followed my team. Half way through the session I had a talk with my captain(who is also a close friend) and asked if we could move back. He said that the rest of the team liked it there. The old place had 9 foot tables that were kept in good shape and the new place had bar tables with new cloth. I told him that I really like our team but I felt it was not helping my game to have to play on those small uneven crappy tables and if they were going to stay there that I would start another team out of our old place next session. Just be honest and straight foward. After he really thought about my reasons he changed his mind because he realized that he was not going to improve his game in those conditions either. But it kept our friendship laying it all on the line. In short I would say to go with the other team that your game would benifit from and hopfully your new teammates could also learn from you but keep you commitment to the other teams until the end of the session.
Good Luck
 
wbweld0 said:
That is a tough one...I am not sure what I would do. I would probably see out the rest of the league with the weak teams and then tell them what you are going to do after the league so that they have ample time to replace you with another player. I am a competitive person by nature and would want to compete at the highest level with the better team because your slop team just goes to the state for fun whereas the good team would go to WIN.
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Basically my thoughts as well. Finish out the sessions with your existing teams - to quit mid-session would be rude - but if you want to leave one team (or both) to play on a new team, and you feel this will make you happier, then by all means, do so.
 
Couldn't agree more.. a commitment is a commitment, but ultimately it's pointless to do something as a hobby that you don't enjoy. Finish out your season then go be happy.
 
Personal experience

IF you want to improve and have a chance of winning, play on the better team, or start your own. I have been on four teams since I began league four years ago. I have been the captain of two of them. Our goal is to always select teammates that really enjoy the game (not the bar) and want to improve (I mean like the 6 out improve, not learn how to make more shots improve).

Every year we have been division champion, and the reason I have started new teams afterwards is the handicap limit. All our players strive to get better and do.

If you just want to have fun, stay with your friends. If you want to compete, change.

Just my thoughts from seeing my game and about 7 others improve by the 6 out.
 
Good advise so far.

The one strange thing that I somewhat expect might happen -- is that the players/captain on the weak teams, being in denial as they are -- may actually not believe that the reason that I'm leaving is just to get on a stronger team -- because they view things very odd.

They seem to feel that because they are able to beat someone ONE single game -- that they are as good as the other player. (In fact they routinely tell me things like, "Oh that player, I've beaten him, he's not that good" -- when if fact they are talking about single games. Totally different mentality some people have about the game and about how to rate a player's speed).

They don't seem to realize that any one player can beat another player in any given game (it's another part of the reason that I can't relate to these players). Many of them really believe that they are MUCH better than they really are. They always make excuses for another team beating us, like -- they just got the lucky rolls (they look at me funny when I just tell them that they shot better and out-played us).
 
Get_A_Grip said:
They seem to feel that because they are able to beat someone ONE single game -- that they are as good as the other player.
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That will end the first time they ever bet with someone.
 
Here are a few of my thoughts, some have already been mentioned.

- finish out the season, to quit would be rude.
- playing with them next year when you're not into it wouldn't be doing anybody any favors, you'll play like crap and they'll know you're not happy playing with them.
- playing on a team where you're not the best player is nice. It gives you room to grow and also takes some of the "must win" pressure off of you.
- Some people are just in leagues to have fun, they don't take it as serious as some of us. There is nothing wrong with this and you shouldn't look down on them because of this. Just realize you're goals are different from thiers and perhaps it's time to part ways at the end of the season.
-you have to do what makes you happy while taking other peoples happiness into consideration.
 
Have you made an effort to make your team better?

get them together on a non league night where everyone can discuss the game as its being played. maybe they just don't see the patterns you see. during league telling them during a game is a coaching foul (at least in my league)

another option, our team has a fine jar that punishes you for bad play.

$.25 for a miss
$1 for a scratch
$5 for ball off table
$5 for missing with ball in hand
$1 for losing
$3 for losing to a girl
$1 for lowest score in the round
$5 and a round of drinks for lowest score of the night

One solution we are looking at for our team is hiring an instructor to spend an afternoon with the team. We might be able to do it with minimum out of pocket expense. due to our league check, we get 10 cents per point scored. as well as our fine jar.
 
softshot said:
Have you made an effort to make your team better?

get them together on a non league night where everyone can discuss the game as its being played. maybe they just don't see the patterns you see. during league telling them during a game is a coaching foul (at least in my league)

another option, our team has a fine jar that punishes you for bad play.

$.25 for a miss
$1 for a scratch
$5 for ball off table
$5 for missing with ball in hand
$1 for losing
$3 for losing to a girl
$1 for lowest score in the round
$5 and a round of drinks for lowest score of the night

One solution we are looking at for our team is hiring an instructor to spend an afternoon with the team. We might be able to do it with minimum out of pocket expense. due to our league check, we get 10 cents per point scored. as well as our fine jar.
Click to expand...

Actually, in the BCA league = No coaching; the slop league = only the captain can coach (which brings up another interesting problem, the captain routinely gives the players the "wrong" advise by telling them to shoot the wrong shots, etc.)

We do have a $1 penalty for loss of game and for a scratch -- but that's it. Man, my teams would go ballistic having to pay the "fines" that you propose. In one game last week, the captain missed with ball in hand, knocked the CB off the table, and lost the game. (Wait...had to EDIT, I forgot...in one game the guy had ball in hand twice....and no lie....missed BOTH shots!)

With our team, nobody even wants to pay the $1 penalties....and routinely nobody inforces the payment....so eveyone cheats, but of course ME and maybe one other player.
 
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Get_A_Grip said:
Actually, in the BCA league = No coaching; the slop league = only the captain can coach (which brings up another interesting problem, the captain routinely gives the players the "wrong" advise by telling them to shoot the wrong shots, etc.)

We do have a $1 penalty for loss of game and for a scratch -- but that's it. Man, my teams would go ballistic having to pay the "fines" that you propose. In one game last week, the captain missed with ball in hand, knocked the CB off the table, and lost the game. (Wait...had to EDIT, I forgot...in one game the guy had ball in hand twice....and no lie....missed BOTH shots!)

With our team, nobody even wants to pay the $1 penalties....and routinely nobody inforces the payment....so eveyone cheats, but of course ME and maybe one other player.
Click to expand...

You can tone down the fines make the $5= $1 and the $1= $.25 and $.10 for a miss. on our team if you come away from the table with anything but a run out someone is shaking the fine jar.
 
This is tough to say delicately, but IF I were on a league team, if my captain missed with BIH twice in one game, I'd have to find another team. There comes a point in your improvement when you realize that you're not even playing the same game as those bangers.
 
I agree with one of the other posters in that you should try to make the team you're on a better team. Not only will they appreciate your endevours on their behalf you will be richly rewarded in help them to become better. If you care - so will they. They probably don't know some of the theory and the execution in order to become better. It's like teaching a child to do something or to do something better. Pretty soon you have friends for life along with better pool playing team mates. Once they SEE and UNDERSTAND how to carry out a few shots it will carry over to other parts of their game. When you see them improve you will be proud. Which is more important? How did you learn?
 
Dawgie said:
I agree with one of the other posters in that you should try to make the team you're on a better team. Not only will they appreciate your endevours on their behalf you will be richly rewarded in help them to become better. If you care - so will they. They probably don't know some of the theory and the execution in order to become better. It's like teaching a child to do something or to do something better. Pretty soon you have friends for life along with better pool playing team mates. Once they SEE and UNDERSTAND how to carry out a few shots it will carry over to other parts of their game. When you see them improve you will be proud. Which is more important? How did you learn?
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Isn't it possible that his teammates aren't interested in improving or learning the game. Most players of that sort want to believe that they're just naturally talented, and practicing would be completely wasted. JMO.
 
Educate your teammates...
If they are unrealistic about their skill levels, make a point of burying them when you practice with them... try to beat them up... sooner or later they will realize that you are way ahead of them... let them know what level you consider yourself (even state your skill level as lower than it is to show them how far behind they are the top players) and then they may have a more realistic assessment of their own skills.


"a try-out" for the other team???

I look at it as, if they are asking you to play on their team... they feel your skill is high enough to play on their team... you are not "auditioning" for them... they are auditioning for you... don't sell yourself short... if they are asking you to play for their team they already know how you play and know what kind of character you have.
 
Shortside K said:
"a try-out" for the other team???

I look at it as, if they are asking you to play on their team... they feel your skill is high enough to play on their team... you are not "auditioning" for them... they are auditioning for you... don't sell yourself short... if they are asking you to play for their team they already know how you play and know what kind of character you have.
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Agreed, to a point. I've gone shopping for players before and I've always asked more than I need. Usually it's just to see who shows up.
 
Just give both current teams plenty of notice that you won't be back next session so they can shop for a replacment as well.Finish the current sessions and move on.
 
Good advice

Thunderball said:
Just give both current teams plenty of notice that you won't be back next session so they can shop for a replacment as well.Finish the current sessions and move on.
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Playing on a losing team or with just learning players becomes like having a weekly root canal scheduled. Pool, like most things, has unspoken levels that players fall into. You, simply, are at a higher level, and need to move on.

After awhile, the fun resides and winning becomes a main factor when you get so good. It is not fun to lose all the time, and anyone who says it is, is a liar. Our country was built on competition, and it is the way we make our way in life.

Just think of it as getting a better job. Would you worry about all the old employees that much, or think about your future. Don't intentionally alienate any of the old players, just tell them you are moving on to a more competitive team, and leave it at that. They will get over it, eventually.

Stay friendly with them, and drop by to see how they are doing now and then.
 
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