Why don't Pro Players have jobs?

[Johnnyt]

The more I think about a pro pool player not having a regular job or a business so he/she will be able to have money and still play in tournaments is BS. I believe almost all pros could own their own small business or work four ten-hour days and still have time to practice and be competitive. I don?t believe marriage is well suited for a pro player though. Johnnyt

 

[thebigdog]

The more I think about a pro pool player not having a regular job or a business so he/she will be able to have money and still play in tournaments is BS. I believe almost all pros could own their own small business or work four ten-hour days and still have time to practice and be competitive. I don?t believe marriage is well suited for a pro player though. Johnnyt

They don't work because they are pro's. Professional means that's what your profession is. Besides I don't think most pro players have much of a work ethic. Most of the pro players I have known, have always been proud of the fact that they never had to work a real job. Everyone is different, some people are adverse to waking up to an alarm clock and punching in everyday, others are adverse to having to sleep in their car because they got busted and wait for someone to back them in another game.

 

[sjm]

It can be argued that those pros that compete and also give pool lessons do work.

 

[Johnnyt]

It can be argued that those pros that compete and also give pool lessons do work.

Yes I would count that as work if they do it enough to make some kind of living...maybe min of 20K a year. Johnnyt

 

[Roy Steffensen]

I think I would consider a player a pro only if he has sponsors.

If a player can play a year without winning any tournaments, and not even make profit, but still be able to play in tournaments and use your weekdays to practise because of sponsors then you've got a real pro.

But how many players live like that, if any?

And, as "Spiderwebman" (don't remember his az-name) once wrote in another thread: How many pros actually try to get sponsors outside the poolworld? If I were good enough to compete on a higher level I would definitely spend a lot of hours, and even money, to make a nice brochure and website, with my stats, bio, shortterm and longterm goals etc, and visit every single company in town.

I would send emails and call the newspapers about every tournament I was going to enter + send them results and perhaps a picture directly after the tournament would finish.

If the pros were working like this, I bet there would be more of both press-interest and sponsors. Unfortunately most of the pros feel that other people should do that job for them... Pity...

EDIT: Companies that sponsor for example a soccerteam gets something in reward. Not only their logo on the venue, but also tickets ++. If I were good enough to be a pro, I would tell the companies that sponsored me that I would do a random draw of every sponsor and the winner would get 2 tickets to the World Championship or US Open or whatsoever, to come and cheer for me in person. Then I would use some of the sponsormoney to cover the trip and hotel for them. I would also make a deal with the local poolhall that every company that I could get into the poolhall would get their tabletime for free for one night if I gave them a poolexhibition and made a tournament for them. Then I could offer that to every company who sponsored me too, and the poolhall would get more customers and the company would suddenly get something in reward for helping me... Just my 2 cents...

 

[dimes33]

having a job or a "real" job would be almost impossible.most players i know leave thursday or friday to go to the tournaments and sometimes its not over until late sunday night so to make a long drive and be at work on monday would just be unrealistic to do every week...........keeping your game at that level is more work than most people know and more than most would be willing to do.

 

[Johnnyt]

I think I would consider a player a pro only if he has sponsors.

If a player can play a year without winning any tournaments, and not even make profit, but still be able to play in tournaments and use your weekdays to practise because of sponsors then you've got a real pro.

But how many players live like that, if any?

And, as "Spiderwebman" (don't remember his az-name) once wrote in another thread: How many pros actually try to get sponsors outside the poolworld? If I were good enough to compete on a higher level I would definitely spend a lot of hours, and even money, to make a nice brochure and website, with my stats, bio, shortterm and longterm goals etc, and visit every single company in town.

I would send emails and call the newspapers about every tournament I was going to enter + send them results and perhaps a picture directly after the tournament would finish.

If the pros were working like this, I bet there would be more of both press-interest and sponsors. Unfortunately most of the pros feel that other people should do that job for them... Pity...

EDIT: Companies that sponsor for example a soccerteam gets something in reward. Not only their logo on the venue, but also tickets ++. If I were good enough to be a pro, I would tell the companies that sponsored me that I would do a random draw of every sponsor and the winner would get 2 tickets to the World Championship or US Open or whatsoever, to come and cheer for me in person. Then I would use some of the sponsormoney to cover the trip and hotel for them. I would also make a deal with the local poolhall that every company that I could get into the poolhall would get their tabletime for free for one night if I gave them a poolexhibition and made a tournament for them. Then I could offer that to every company who sponsored me too, and the poolhall would get more customers and the company would suddenly get something in reward for helping me... Just my 2 cents...

I have to agree with most of that. Johnnyt

 

[lodini]

having a job or a "real" job would be almost impossible.most players i know leave thursday or friday to go to the tournaments and sometimes its not over until late sunday night so to make a long drive and be at work on monday would just be unrealistic to do every week...........keeping your game at that level is more work than most people know and more than most would be willing to do.

Right on... My 9-5 lifestyle prevents me from even becomming a "good" player... I'd love to travel to more tournaments and practice 10 hours a day, but I am lucky if I can make to the poolhall 3 times a week for just a few hours.

And anyway, professional athletes in other sports don't have "real" jobs. If you are good enough to be a professional pool player, I would think pool would have to the take place of a "real" job. And the rest of us will just have to go to work, and try to contain our jealousy.

 

[Roy Steffensen]

I have to agree with most of that. Johnnyt

The problem with it is that then the poolplayers must wake up earlier, dress nicely, go to a lot of meetings and actually be door-salesman... Selling a product that is hard to sell, but not impossible.

Unfortunately it won't happen yet, it's more comfortable for a poolplayer to complain about the lack of sponsors and interest from the media while sitting in the bar waiting for a fish...

 

[lodini]

I think I would consider a player a pro only if he has sponsors.

If a player can play a year without winning any tournaments, and not even make profit, but still be able to play in tournaments and use your weekdays to practise because of sponsors then you've got a real pro.

But how many players live like that, if any?

And, as "Spiderwebman" (don't remember his az-name) once wrote in another thread: How many pros actually try to get sponsors outside the poolworld? If I were good enough to compete on a higher level I would definitely spend a lot of hours, and even money, to make a nice brochure and website, with my stats, bio, shortterm and longterm goals etc, and visit every single company in town.

I would send emails and call the newspapers about every tournament I was going to enter + send them results and perhaps a picture directly after the tournament would finish.

If the pros were working like this, I bet there would be more of both press-interest and sponsors. Unfortunately most of the pros feel that other people should do that job for them... Pity...

EDIT: Companies that sponsor for example a soccerteam gets something in reward. Not only their logo on the venue, but also tickets ++. If I were good enough to be a pro, I would tell the companies that sponsored me that I would do a random draw of every sponsor and the winner would get 2 tickets to the World Championship or US Open or whatsoever, to come and cheer for me in person. Then I would use some of the sponsormoney to cover the trip and hotel for them. I would also make a deal with the local poolhall that every company that I could get into the poolhall would get their tabletime for free for one night if I gave them a poolexhibition and made a tournament for them. Then I could offer that to every company who sponsored me too, and the poolhall would get more customers and the company would suddenly get something in reward for helping me... Just my 2 cents...

My 9-5 job just happens to be selling corporate sponsorships for a professional sports team. You definitely have the right idea. I've been asking around and trying to get a sense of how sponsorships are sold and activated in the pool world, and there is a definite imbalance between the amount of money a tournament/tour/individual player is asking for and the benefits awarded to the sponsor for supporting them.

Your idea about inviting the sponsor to a big event is great... but what about this? Your sponsor runs a consumer promotion in which the winner receives the invite to the big event. Could be as simple as "enter to win" by going to a retail location (getting people in the stores is key to having them buy products) or online. This provides great branding, gets the general public excited, and drives traffic to the company's stores or website. Big corporate sponsors would be much more willing to be involved in pool if sponsorships were handled like they are in the bigger professional sports.

But until that happens, something that I feel is being missed right now is that a lot of big corporations have budgets specifically set aside for "grassroots marketing" efforts, and love to contribute to local/amateur events and players of all sports without seeking a lot in return. There is a huge area for pool to grow in sponsorships outside of pool-related companies.

 

[sjm]

Obviously, it can be done, if one wishes to, and not at the expense of excellence over the glorious green felt.

Steve Mizerak was a seventh grade English teacher in New Jersey while he was winning four straight US Open 14.1 championships. Irving Crane had his car dealership in Rochester, NY, while he was one of the superstars of pro pool. Tom Jennings was a college professor of mathematics in New Jersey while winning the 1976 and 1977 US Open 14.1 championships.

Closer to home, AZB columnist Melissa Herndon works full time yet just finished third in the most recent WPBA event in Floirida.

 

[cuechick]

There are many pros that work other jobs, there was even a thread about this not so long ago. However, there are many pros who have made a very good living just through pool. The smart ones, know that tournament winnings alone will not do it. Sponsorship and appearances can round it out to be a very, very good living. Jeanette Lee, has been one of the more savvy players, developing her image, so that she has been able to parle her status into lucrative appearances (from private parties too big events) as well, commentating on ESPN, a book and other commercial endeavors. She was even the subject of a pinball game, which I am sure she had a piece of. She is even embarking on a chain of pool halls using her name.
Other female players that have been able to do this include Allison, Jennifer Barretta, Sarah Ellerby and Ewa Lawrence (to name a few). Of course, in the Philippines, Efren is a huge star, with beer & battery companies sponsoring him. Here is the U.S., the men have a tougher time without a strong, unified tour but still Johnny Archer and a few others have done pretty well.
Pool is a full time job for these pros. Success is not just about talent and playing, it is also about how you market yourself and the savvy players have done this well. When you see a pro at a booth at an expo she or he is working, when Allison shows up at the APA events and signs autographs for hours on end, she is working. When Jennifer Barretta goes to some little pool hall in the mid west and plays challenge matches, she's working. When Ewa or Dawn sits in, to commentate a match on ESPN, they are working.
Most recently, Kelly Fisher has banded together with some other female pros to start their own pool related company, Kwikfire, selling cues and other pool related stuff.
IMO: being a pro and making your living exclusivly from pool is very hard work; but certainly a rewarding one, when you get to do what you love.

 

[Tokyo-dave]

Based on my own personal experience, although I wouldn't say it's impossible, it's very difficult, and in my case impossible to keep the game up while working a full time 'real' job. Before my two year old was born, I was an upper rank amateur here in Japan. This included winning a couple large amateur titles, and getting as far as 3,4 rounds in some pro events. I had the game to take and pass the pro aptitude test here in Japan that would give me my tour card and the 'title' of being a pro. Then with the birth of my child, my nights playing pool went from 5,6 nights a week to 1. And my game has dropped considerably.
If you were to take a world class player that has played at that level for more than 10 years, I think it's possible for him to still play world class pool with less practice time. But a newer player, that has played world class, or national class pool for only 1,3 years will lose his game if you take away the practice time.
I know that for myself, I would need at least two months of practice of 7 hour sessions and at least 5 days a week to get my game back. But I don't have the time or the money for the table time, and any game that I got back, would need at least 3 nights a week of 3,4 hour sessions just to maintain. Again, don't have the time or the money to keep such a schedule.
dave

 

[JoeyA]

The problem with it is that then the poolplayers must wake up earlier, dress nicely, go to a lot of meetings and actually be door-salesman... Selling a product that is hard to sell, but not impossible.

Unfortunately it won't happen yet, it's more comfortable for a poolplayer to complain about the lack of sponsors and interest from the media while sitting in the bar waiting for a fish...

Roy, your insight on this is impressive. I believe if you were a professional pool player, you would find a sponsor. You have the right attitude (and potential elbow grease).

Joeya

 

[JoeyA]

My 9-5 job just happens to be selling corporate sponsorships for a professional sports team. You definitely have the right idea. I've been asking around and trying to get a sense of how sponsorships are sold and activated in the pool world, and there is a definite imbalance between the amount of money a tournament/tour/individual player is asking for and the benefits awarded to the sponsor for supporting them.

Your idea about inviting the sponsor to a big event is great... but what about this? Your sponsor runs a consumer promotion in which the winner receives the invite to the big event. Could be as simple as "enter to win" by going to a retail location (getting people in the stores is key to having them buy products) or online. This provides great branding, gets the general public excited, and drives traffic to the company's stores or website. Big corporate sponsors would be much more willing to be involved in pool if sponsorships were handled like they are in the bigger professional sports.

But until that happens, something that I feel is being missed right now is that a lot of big corporations have budgets specifically set aside for "grassroots marketing" efforts, and love to contribute to local/amateur events and players of all sports without seeking a lot in return. There is a huge area for pool to grow in sponsorships outside of pool-related companies.

I LIKE YOUR IDEAS.

You got me to thinking about our own local market. Here in New Orleans (actually the surrounding area/suburbs) have good league participation.

A potential sponsor could send out flyers to the league operators (who would put them into the TEAM's weekly envelope, FREE OF CHARGE) advertising a FREE TRIP TO DERBY CITY CLASSIC OR THE U.S. OPEN and could make it as all expense paid as they choose to. League players tend to have jobs, spend money and that's what the big corporations like, potential customers with money.

While I don't play in any of the leagues any longer, I wouldn't hesitate to visit a merchant who was giving away a trip to one of those destinations. Ooooh, what about a trip to the World Pool Championship?

If I keep thinking about this, I might wind up telling one of my customers about this. One of my customers has a new virtual golf game that plays all of the major courses and they could invite golfers and the like for a trip to a big tournament when a customer plays the game.

But I like the idea of a company going after but not affiliated with the particular target audience (pool players).

I would love for this thread to morph into ideas for programs that might help get sponsors on a local basis to promote pool in any way shape or form.

Any ideas for a pool trip promotion?

(Sorry about the attempted hi-jacking)

Professional pool players don't have time for much else and would need a job that pays them when they are away from work playing pool. If you find a job like that, let me know and I will apply.
JoeyA

 

[Roy Steffensen]

Your idea about inviting the sponsor to a big event is great... but what about this? Your sponsor runs a consumer promotion in which the winner receives the invite to the big event. Could be as simple as "enter to win" by going to a retail location (getting people in the stores is key to having them buy products) or online. This provides great branding, gets the general public excited, and drives traffic to the company's stores or website. Big corporate sponsors would be much more willing to be involved in pool if sponsorships were handled like they are in the bigger professional sports.

Very, very nice idea. For example: The player gets a sponsorshipcontract with the local bookstore, and because the player has sent a lot of results to the press the last months the newspapers find it interesting that the poolplayer they have been writing about suddenly has got a sponsor. So they write about the deal, and the sponsor and the player says in the interview that every customer that buys more than 2 books during the next 2 months will be a part in the lottery and win 2 tickets to the US Open 9-ball Championship, where they can watch the best poolplayers in action + root for the local hero.

Of course there should also be flyers of this, and I think that the pro could easily hand out a lots of flyers to poolplayers, friends and also got permission to leave them on different bars/caf?s in town.

EDIT: Maybe the bookstore would start to sell some poolbooks too

But until that happens, something that I feel is being missed right now is that a lot of big corporations have budgets specifically set aside for "grassroots marketing" efforts, and love to contribute to local/amateur events and players of all sports without seeking a lot in return. There is a huge area for pool to grow in sponsorships outside of pool-related companies

Yes, there is a huge area for pool to grow in sponsorships, and yes, the companies are eager to contribute to local sportsactivities.

So the message to all proplayers should be: Get in contact with your local newspaper, send them results of all tournaments you enter, buy a nice suit (or use the one you used at the IPT-tournaments), make a website and a nice brochure and start visit your local companies!

 

[lodini]

Very, very nice idea. For example: The player gets a sponsorshipcontract with the local bookstore, and because the player has sent a lot of results to the press the last months the newspapers find it interesting that the poolplayer they have been writing about suddenly has got a sponsor. So they write about the deal, and the sponsor and the player says in the interview that every customer that buys more than 2 books during the next 2 months will be a part in the lottery and win 2 tickets to the US Open 9-ball Championship, where they can watch the best poolplayers in action + root for the local hero.

Of course there should also be flyers of this, and I think that the pro could easily hand out a lots of flyers to poolplayers, friends and also got permission to leave them on different bars/caf?s in town

I love the thoughts... very creative. One thing to be aware of is that there are a lot of legalities to watch out for. For example, said bookstore would not be able to legally mention the US Open 9-ball Championships in their promotion without being a sponsor of the event itself (being a sponsor of a participating player isn't enough) and obtaining the rights. Same reason you can't legally promote a sweepstakes with the prize being a trip to the Super Bowl unless you are an NFL sponsor. (But they can say "win a trip to the "Big Game"") Just something to watch out for... keep your lawyers handy!

 

[Johnnyt]

OK I agree it would be hard for most players that go to a tournament a week to work full time, but they could work part time. Some of the things most of the players could do are

Car salesman (really almost any kind of selling.

Players are good at selling/woofing/hustling.
.
Pool lessons

Selling pool products from a web site or from their car or from catalogs.

Buy or start a small poolroom with winnings or other business that trusted family or friends could run while they?re away at tournaments.

I?m not saying that it?s right that they have to work, but they have to in other sports too until they make enough money in their sport. Bowling and Golf are two of them that come to mind. Johnnyt

PS: Some great ideas have come out of this thread so far. I hope some of the pros or their friends are reading it.

 

[PoolSharkAllen]

The smart ones, know that tournament winnings alone will not do it. Sponsorship and appearances can round it out to be a very, very good living.
Other female players that have been able to do this include Allison, Jennifer Barretta, Sarah Ellerby and Ewa Lawrence (to name a few). Of course, in the Philippines, Efren is a huge star, with beer & battery companies sponsoring him. Here is the U.S., the men have a tougher time without a strong, unified tour but still Johnny Archer and a few others have done pretty well.
Success is not just about talent and playing, it is also about how you market yourself and the savvy players have done this well.

Even Johny Archer is having a harder time making ends meet with sponsorships. According to the August issue of Billiards Digest, "Since the beginning of the year, Archer has lost several sponsorship deals representing a major chunk of his income." He's now down to one sponsor, CueStix. That's a primary reason why Archer has opened a pool hall in Georgia, to fall back on another source of income.

 

[Johnnyt]

Even Johny Archer is having a harder time making ends meet with sponsorships. According to the August issue of Billiards Digest, "Since the beginning of the year, Archer has lost several sponsorship deals representing a major chunk of his income." He's now down to one sponsor, CueStix. That's a primary reason why Archer has opened a pool hall in Georgia, to fall back on another source of income.

Yes I saw that too. It's one of the reasons I started this thread. Johnnyt