Why Pool is not a major sport.

[D C 6 Pocket]

This is reference to a post made by D C 6 Pocket (I think #41)



JB Cases - I want to hear what D C 6 Pocket has to say. I have not read one new idea on this thread other than from this guy. Not only does he have an idea, he bet his time and money on it. This alone deserves notice. He may not have the answer but he may have a partial answer. My ears are listening to any new idea.

After talking with the gentleman from IMG that came up with the idea and produced the ESPN show "The Worlds Strongest Man" contest, I realized just how complete the package must be to be successful. His advice to me was........Play 1 game, use 1 set of rules, make the game easy to understand, if your puting on a tournament - make sure the end has drama, make your pool game gender nuetral, if you can meet this challange you have a better chance than most. Soooooo when he was introduced to 6 Pocket he thought it had plenty of the right ingrediants, could be something they were interested in, I just needed to make the game popular.

When I went over how we would use the team format for college competition, he loved it and suggested we start there to gain popularty for the game. When I approached Budwiser, their reply was let me think about it, I think your idea has merrit we just have to figure out how it will help us sell more beer. The common thread with both compaines was that it is a score based game with all of the competitors playing the entire field, not each other 1 on 1.

I can tell everyone that reads or post here that I have went thru over 100k from investors and 2 1/2 years promoting 6 pocket and as of today 99% of the pool world has never heard of it. This year we will be working from a different direction with a new business plan and lets see what happens.

 

[gibson]

There are many games which are not athletic competitions but are referred to as sports. Golf and bowling have an athletic aspect to them but are limited. Pool is in the game category. Poker and Chess would be the same. Poker seems to have found an audience. Chess has a very elaborate world rating system and has no television coverage at all. Pool is a limited spectator sport and would be more appropriate to television than live. If you have ever attended a pool tournament as a spectator, you know that it is difficult to watch especially in the early stages of the tournament. I would love it if there was television coverage of the major pool tournaments. They are really not that expensive to cover compared with other events.

 

[Celtic]

My buddy says that what Pool needs is a Tiger Woods!

Pool cannot have a Tiger Woods until the game is changed such that the Tiger Woods with the highest skill in the game can actually have that skill dictate the outcome of their matches.

Me and a friend talked on this last night. Pool as a sport is simply too easy and too many people in the world have pretty much mastered the game. The skill is no longer what dictates who wins in a race to 11 between Archer, SVB, Orcullo, Yang, Hohmann, Pagulayan, Corteza, Appleton, Alcano, Souquet, Immonen, Deuel, Wu, and about 20 other world class players.

The thing that dictates matches between the above is normally luck on the break. Making a ball, not getting an unlucky kick, and not getting an unlucky hook off an otherwise successful break.

Why is this? Because on a 4 1/2 X 9 table playing 9-ball or even 10-ball the top players are all hitting the ceiling of hoe good this game can be played. They control the ball that well, they pot that well. The conditions the game is played on is simply too easy to properly test their skills.

It is like taking Tiger Woods, Phil Mikkelson, and the other PGA players and making them play golf on executive par 3 courses with the average hole length of 120 yards. Those guys will now be throwing darts and luck is going to be a far greater factor in who wins. You are going to get alot less dominance and alot more randomness in who now wins if you did the above.

And guess what, pool atm IS the par 3 exec course.

What could be done to change this? Tighter pockets for one would help. Pro's should play on no larger then 4 inch pockets. Table size would help. While smaller tables will be the standard for pool halls and the amature player I believe that the pro's should be switching to 5X10 tables, still with those 4 inch pockets. This would be a WAY harder game and the true top talents of the game are going to start to work their way out of the mass of players stuck at the top and really start to show themselves as one of the elite few, maybe even the Tiger Woods this sport needs.

ATM this sport cannot have Tiger Woods. Yes it would help to have a truly dominant player, having Mosconi as a legendary champion who the public wanted to see helped pool alot. The public like their Federers, their Tigers, their Ronnie O'Sullivans or Hendrys, the guys that truly stand above the rest and clearly dominate their sport in an era.

Pool as it exists right now is simply not a hard enough game to cause the cream to rise to the top. I have said it countless times and it remains true to this day. YEARS have gone by since I started saying this, and not alot has changed. We are going to 10-ball but that game in races to 9 or even 11 is not going to change the problem above because we are still playing the game on far too easy equipment.

Our tables don't have to be 6x12 snooker cut pockets. But they sure as hell need to be more then 4 1/2 X 9 tables with pretty bloody generous pockets like we play on now.

This sport cannot more to 5x10 tables and 4 inch pockets too soon IMO. It should NEVER have gotten away from that size of table back in Mosconi's era. It did so for the sake of pool rooms, and in doing that it killed the actual "sport" within this game. The timing of the slide of pool coincides exactly with the switch to smaller tables and a time period where dominance in this sport by the single elite player became alot less clear.

Let the pool halls keep the smaller tables, but get the pro's playing on conditions that they truly belong on. Let the occasional pro table in a pool hall let the amatures know what it is the pros are really playing on and how impressive they truly are at the game, just like snooker does.

<edit>

And realize, this would initially cause a little confusion, a little feedback both positive and negative from various parties, but after 3-4 years of playing professional pool solely on 5x10 tables the mass majoritty of people in the sport, both fans and players would be hugely in favor of sticking with the 5 x 10 tables with the 4 inch pockets. The level of pool playing ability at the top end level would actually increase hugely as the players are forced to now reach for new heights in an attempt to master the sport. ATM the top end guys are in stasis with almost nowhere to go. Do what I suggest above and pool players today will reach heights not yet seen.

 

[cajunfats]

Please see the post #21 in the Mens Pro Tour thread. It touches on some aspects of why Pool will always be a substantial recreational activity and not more unless a concept change occurs.

The same fans and enthusiasts have supported the industry for the past 40 plus years. The Billiard Manufacturing Industry built their successes with the recreational market. The Billiard Room Owners have supplemented their market by catering to the advanced and pro level player. It's all Business.

While the BCA Trade Association has assisted various aspects of player oriented ventures from time to time, their status as a 501(c)-3 organization prohibit certain activities.

Until pool can be inroduced as a secondary school level competitive "sport", we will not see advances in youth pool. While I advocate small clubs to cater to youth development, much like the Geman Club System, it must have advanced competitive stages as the players age to adulthood where they can play in leagues or tournaments.

As far as a "Pro Tour", as I stated in the post before, the concept of a Pool Organization must change. Not one of the previous models has worked.

Find 20 Investors to Buy 7 players, format them like the NFL et al,and just maybe we could see a paradigm shift towards a viable long term professional entity.

 

[Druid]

Pool cannot have a Tiger Woods until the game is changed such that the Tiger Woods with the highest skill in the game can actually have that skill dictate the outcome of their matches.

Excellent point. The top talent pool is saturated.

 

[JB Cases]

This is reference to a post made by D C 6 Pocket (I think #41)



JB Cases - I want to hear what D C 6 Pocket has to say. I have not read one new idea on this thread other than from this guy. Not only does he have an idea, he bet his time and money on it. This alone deserves notice. He may not have the answer but he may have a partial answer. My ears are listening to any new idea.

Where do you get the impression that I don't want to hear what he has to say?

My point was and is still that "pool" is too fragmented as it is. It seems to be the only activity where EVERYONE feels entitled to just make up the rules from event to event, to simply INVENT new games to play, to make a mockery of it in order to appease the ALMIGHTY "Television".

As for betting time and money my point there is that a lot of people do that BASED ON the "30 million players" statistic that is so often bandied about. I used to toss that statistic out to investors and bankers 15 years ago when pitching my ideas. It's sounds awesome when you run the numbers saying to your investors "if I only get 1% of those players buying my product then we will be rich, rich I tell you, rich!!!"

Only those players don't really exist do they? Not only do they not exist if they did they wouldn't be billiard consumers in any real or meaningful sense.

So my point is that we need to take a big reality pill and realize that there are NOT 30 million people "playing" pool. There are probably around 300-600 thousand in America who play on a regular basis in any organized way and of those PROBABLY only about 400,000 of them regularly buy pool products.

What do you all really want anyway?

I mean as a consumer of pool I personally have all that I could ever want. I get to see as much high level pool as I want to from any era that I wish to view it at.

I have the largest selection of gear possible in any sport. I have access to the state of the art in playing fields.

I have access to the professional players as a fan.

So from a fan's perspective I don't see how pool can be much better than it is right now.

From a pro's perspective I can see how it needs to be a lot better. It's my contention however that to make pool a lot better than it is now is within the ability of the current players who think of themselves as professional players.

It's not the job of the fans to provide that platform.

From a billiard industry perspective we always want "more" business no matter what the current state of the business is.

So the way I see it is that the two groups who NEED for pool to be more popular and thus provide more stability are industry and professional players.

Neither of those two groups has any clue how to go about it, and seemingly no true desire to make it happen. However the industry keeps chugging along and the pros always find someplace to play and someone always steps up to broadcast them - so from a fan's point of view it's pool paradise, at least in this fan's mind.

So by all means, if you are someone with an idea about how to revolutionize pool and you want to sink your life savings into it then be my guest. If all you want is that 1% of the 30,000,000 million "players" to make your business work then go for it.

Sorry to be cynical but I went into this business 20 years ago with the same wide-eyed fresh off the bus dreamer attitude. In the intervening time I have seen nothing except the IPT that makes me believe that pool will ever be bigger than it is now.

To me the IPT was what I thought would lift pool to the national stage. And maybe it would have under different circumstances.

I know when I attended the IPT event between Sigel and Jones in Las Vegas I really felt like this was going to be something special.

Otherwise, all the events I have ever been to, including the prestigious US Open feel very loose and hastily put together. And don't get me wrong, most of them are done as well as the people running them possibly can do given their budgets and staff. But overall we don't produce a consistent product.

WHY, WHY haven't we seen the BCA, VNEA, APA league finals on ESPN?

They have hot dog eating contests, spelling bees, scrabble championships and now video game tournaments on ESPN.

WHY hasn't ANYONE been able to get the highest level amateur tournament in the world on TV? They have been running for 25 years. Through the boom times. So why not?

Answer that and you will know why "pool" is not going anywhere.

So be all ears - none of these ideas matter in the least because no one, NO ONE is willing to put the rubber to the road and make them happen in any way that will change anything.

 

[ridewiththewind]

Where do you get the impression that I don't want to hear what he has to say?

My point was and is still that "pool" is too fragmented as it is. It seems to be the only activity where EVERYONE feels entitled to just make up the rules from event to event, to simply INVENT new games to play, to make a mockery of it in order to appease the ALMIGHTY "Television".

As for betting time and money my point there is that a lot of people do that BASED ON the "30 million players" statistic that is so often bandied about. I used to toss that statistic out to investors and bankers 15 years ago when pitching my ideas. It's sounds awesome when you run the numbers saying to your investors "if I only get 1% of those players buying my product then we will be rich, rich I tell you, rich!!!"

Only those players don't really exist do they? Not only do they not exist if they did they wouldn't be billiard consumers in any real or meaningful sense.

So my point is that we need to take a big reality pill and realize that there are NOT 30 million people "playing" pool. There are probably around 300-600 thousand in America who play on a regular basis in any organized way and of those PROBABLY only about 400,000 of them regularly buy pool products.

What do you all really want anyway?

I mean as a consumer of pool I personally have all that I could ever want. I get to see as much high level pool as I want to from any era that I wish to view it at.

I have the largest selection of gear possible in any sport. I have access to the state of the art in playing fields.

I have access to the professional players as a fan.

So from a fan's perspective I don't see how pool can be much better than it is right now.

From a pro's perspective I can see how it needs to be a lot better. It's my contention however that to make pool a lot better than it is now is within the ability of the current players who think of themselves as professional players.

It's not the job of the fans to provide that platform.

From a billiard industry perspective we always want "more" business no matter what the current state of the business is.

So the way I see it is that the two groups who NEED for pool to be more popular and thus provide more stability are industry and professional players.

Neither of those two groups has any clue how to go about it, and seemingly no true desire to make it happen. However the industry keeps chugging along and the pros always find someplace to play and someone always steps up to broadcast them - so from a fan's point of view it's pool paradise, at least in this fan's mind.

So by all means, if you are someone with an idea about how to revolutionize pool and you want to sink your life savings into it then be my guest. If all you want is that 1% of the 30,000,000 million "players" to make your business work then go for it.

Sorry to be cynical but I went into this business 20 years ago with the same wide-eyed fresh off the bus dreamer attitude. In the intervening time I have seen nothing except the IPT that makes me believe that pool will ever be bigger than it is now.

To me the IPT was what I thought would lift pool to the national stage. And maybe it would have under different circumstances.

I know when I attended the IPT event between Sigel and Jones in Las Vegas I really felt like this was going to be something special.

Otherwise, all the events I have ever been to, including the prestigious US Open feel very loose and hastily put together. And don't get me wrong, most of them are done as well as the people running them possibly can do given their budgets and staff. But overall we don't produce a consistent product.

WHY, WHY haven't we seen the BCA, VNEA, APA league finals on ESPN?

They have hot dog eating contests, spelling bees, scrabble championships and now video game tournaments on ESPN.

WHY hasn't ANYONE been able to get the highest level amateur tournament in the world on TV? They have been running for 25 years. Through the boom times. So why not?

Answer that and you will know why "pool" is not going anywhere.

So be all ears - none of these ideas matter in the least because no one, NO ONE is willing to put the rubber to the road and make them happen in any way that will change anything.

I agree that, I too, thought that the IPT would finally be able to elevate the game to a more mainstream level, such as poker has enjoyed in the last 10 or so years. I believe the concept was sound...just a shame that the leadership wasn't. For the first time in a long time, players from all over, pros and amateurs alike were excited...in a big, big way. TV coverage was decent enough, and it was a game that even the local yocals could wrap their heads around...8 Ball. Was a big disappointment to me when the wheels came off.

Lisa

 

[Celtic]

I agree that, I too, thought that the IPT would finally be able to elevate the game to a more mainstream level, such as poker has enjoyed in the last 10 or so years. I believe the concept was sound...just a shame that the leadership wasn't. For the first time in a long time, players from all over, pros and amateurs alike were excited...in a big, big way. TV coverage was decent enough, and it was a game that even the local yocals could wrap their heads around...8 Ball. Was a big disappointment to me when the wheels came off.

Lisa

IMO one of the big problems was the odd and convoluted round robin tournament format. They should have went with a simple double elimination format, race to 9 in the early rounds, 11 in the final 32-8, 13 in the final 8-4, and races to 15 for the B final and final.

As much as I think they got a ton of things right, the game being 8-ball, the use of larger tables, the slow cloth, the production values, I think they really missed the ball on their format and the way tie breakers and the like were decided, that aspect of the events was an absolute mess.

 

[duty supt]

Hey, I would like to see some weekly pool and billiard TV programs. Maybe high dollar matches or top players just shooting it out to prove who is the best. Its a great sport and needs to be in the public view much more than it is today.

 

[ceebee]

I agree & have said so many times.

Someone lately made a statement that we need a "well known personality or meg-high roller" to get the interest started.

Success follows success...

 

[ridewiththewind]

IMO one of the big problems was the odd and convoluted round robin tournament format. They should have went with a simple double elimination format, race to 9 in the early rounds, 11 in the final 32-8, 13 in the final 8-4, and races to 15 for the B final and final.

As much as I think they got a ton of things right, the game being 8-ball, the use of larger tables, the slow cloth, the production values, I think they really missed the ball on their format and the way tie breakers and the like were decided, that aspect of the events was an absolute mess.

Sure, it could've used some 'fine tuning'...but it was the best chance we had of possibly breaking the glass ceiling...just wish someone more trustworthy and viable than KT would have been at the helm.

 

[neal916]

man, I had a friend (co-worker) come out to shoot pool with me and as I'm running out a rack of 8 ball, he goes "you're pretty good" to which I replied "not too bad" and after the rack he asked if I knew any trick shots.... needless to say im not going out shootin with him anymore.

Oh and another thing, when you tell someone Oh im going out to shoot pool or to the pool hall, you hear them say "Im great at that, I would be you any day". The comment doesn't urk me it's the lack of respect for the game; it goes to show the common public believes pocketing a ball is the hardest part of the game. It's the tiny intricacies that make our game so great. Stuff you can't explain.

 

[rossaroni]

he asked if I knew any trick shots.... needless to say im not going out shootin with him anymore.

So, you don't know any trick shots then?

 

[Paul Schofield]

Where do you get the impression that I don't want to hear what he has to say?

My point was and is still that "pool" is too fragmented as it is. It seems to be the only activity where EVERYONE feels entitled to just make up the rules from event to event, to simply INVENT new games to play, to make a mockery of it in order to appease the ALMIGHTY "Television".

As for betting time and money my point there is that a lot of people do that BASED ON the "30 million players" statistic that is so often bandied about. I used to toss that statistic out to investors and bankers 15 years ago when pitching my ideas. It's sounds awesome when you run the numbers saying to your investors "if I only get 1% of those players buying my product then we will be rich, rich I tell you, rich!!!"

Only those players don't really exist do they? Not only do they not exist if they did they wouldn't be billiard consumers in any real or meaningful sense.

So my point is that we need to take a big reality pill and realize that there are NOT 30 million people "playing" pool. There are probably around 300-600 thousand in America who play on a regular basis in any organized way and of those PROBABLY only about 400,000 of them regularly buy pool products.

What do you all really want anyway?

I mean as a consumer of pool I personally have all that I could ever want. I get to see as much high level pool as I want to from any era that I wish to view it at.

I have the largest selection of gear possible in any sport. I have access to the state of the art in playing fields.

I have access to the professional players as a fan.

So from a fan's perspective I don't see how pool can be much better than it is right now.

From a pro's perspective I can see how it needs to be a lot better. It's my contention however that to make pool a lot better than it is now is within the ability of the current players who think of themselves as professional players.

It's not the job of the fans to provide that platform.

From a billiard industry perspective we always want "more" business no matter what the current state of the business is.

So the way I see it is that the two groups who NEED for pool to be more popular and thus provide more stability are industry and professional players.

Neither of those two groups has any clue how to go about it, and seemingly no true desire to make it happen. However the industry keeps chugging along and the pros always find someplace to play and someone always steps up to broadcast them - so from a fan's point of view it's pool paradise, at least in this fan's mind.

So by all means, if you are someone with an idea about how to revolutionize pool and you want to sink your life savings into it then be my guest. If all you want is that 1% of the 30,000,000 million "players" to make your business work then go for it.

Sorry to be cynical but I went into this business 20 years ago with the same wide-eyed fresh off the bus dreamer attitude. In the intervening time I have seen nothing except the IPT that makes me believe that pool will ever be bigger than it is now.

To me the IPT was what I thought would lift pool to the national stage. And maybe it would have under different circumstances.

I know when I attended the IPT event between Sigel and Jones in Las Vegas I really felt like this was going to be something special.

Otherwise, all the events I have ever been to, including the prestigious US Open feel very loose and hastily put together. And don't get me wrong, most of them are done as well as the people running them possibly can do given their budgets and staff. But overall we don't produce a consistent product.

WHY, WHY haven't we seen the BCA, VNEA, APA league finals on ESPN?

They have hot dog eating contests, spelling bees, scrabble championships and now video game tournaments on ESPN.

WHY hasn't ANYONE been able to get the highest level amateur tournament in the world on TV? They have been running for 25 years. Through the boom times. So why not?

Answer that and you will know why "pool" is not going anywhere.

So be all ears - none of these ideas matter in the least because no one, NO ONE is willing to put the rubber to the road and make them happen in any way that will change anything.

Where you see no hope, I see opportunity. Don't be so darn bitter. I have been involved with this game for more than 40 years in almost every manner, shape, and form. I still have passion. I am not ready to take the gas pipe.

 

[neal916]

So, you don't know any trick shots then?

Lol i can make your money disappear, does that count? hahaha

 

[JB Cases]

Where you see no hope, I see opportunity. Don't be so darn bitter. I have been involved with this game for more than 40 years in almost every manner, shape, and form. I still have passion. I am not ready to take the gas pipe.

Bitter? Hardly. I am a realist in this case. If you look through my posting history on this subject you will see that I have almost always taken the pollyanna approach full of hope and optimism.

The truth is hard to face.

And that truth is that pool will never be a "major" sport because there are no major investors who are willing to take it there.

There is no angel investing billionaire to take the reins. No superstar promoter to line up the sponsors, and no group of professional players who are willing to WORK on a product that they can sell.

If it happens then great, as a pool fan I will continue to eat up the world class play that they serve up. As an industry person I will gladly service the increased business and will surely pitch in with sponsorship where I am able, as I always have done.

But sorry, the "hope" train has left the building for a few years now.

It's not bitter. Just real.

We should be happy for what we have. The Derby City Classic, the BCA Pool Leagues, The US Open, numerous small tours.

You're open to new ideas?

How about the N.U.T.S. tour, nationwide with a path to the pros? Great idea right? Mike Janis was really passionate about it and tried hard to get people on board. REJECTED!!!!!

UPA? Solidarity for the players - no one will get stiffed anymore - FAIL

IPT????? - No comment.

And on and on and on and on and on and on..................

Mark Griffin would like do lead, no one wants to follow.

If I had the money then I would flat out OWN professional pool. That's right, I would OWN it from the amateur level to the pros. I would either buy out or compete against the APA to the point that I had the largest league in the country. I would run my own pro tour and sign the pros to exclusive contracts like the UFC or WWF. There would be no democracy, I would be a dictator and that's that.

Because the other way doesn't work.

As Ben Franklin says, "what serves wishing and hoping for better times when we may make these times better through our own diligence?"

So until people are willing to make things happen, they won't happen and no amount of hope will change that.

You want an idea? Here is one.

The AZB Pro Tour Investment Fund.

Supposedly we are 10,000 strong here. Of course that's a fantasy number just like 30,000,000 players is. But even so I think that the combined wealth of active AZB members who actively post is pretty strong. Granted there are a few heavyweights here who skew the average upwards.

So how much MONEY do you think it would be possible to raise if the members of AZB INVESTED in a startup fund for a new professional tour?

Could we get one million dollars together? 5 million? Who will run it?

I am being a little mean right now but we do have at least one member who calls himself a rising star in the financial world and compares himself to Warren Buffett. Maybe he can manage such a fund?

So how about WE run the pro tour and WE own pro pool. I am in for a thousand to start with? After all there is supposed to be strength in numbers right?

Anyone else?

Let's see in another thread someone asked the question if Tim Scruggs were to come out of retirement would you order a cue? I believe that he got something like 300-500 cues spoken for in a matter of weeks. Those would be cues with a conservative average price of about a $1000 each.

So if a small number of AZB members can collectively pledge 3-500,000 for pool cues then what should we be able to achieve if trying to fund a pro tour?

The difference however is that the buyers of the cues would see a tangible investment and have practically zero chance to lose money. Investing in (betting on) a Pro Tour???? Well that's a bit riskier now isn't it.

Face reality. No one outside of us cares. No one. You don't think that people are pitching the networks on shows ALL THE TIME?

It took the founder of the World Poker Tour 8 years to get his product on TV. 8 solid years of knocking on doors before the TRAVEL CHANNEL took a shot on it. The Travel Channel???

The UFC was broke and bankrupt and had to go through some major upheaval to get where they are now.

Pool has NO ONE willing to put in that work.

Speaking of work - I have to get back to mine. I hope you're right and I am wrong.

 

[D C 6 Pocket]

Why Change - Why New

For the past 50 years that I know of, most tournaments have been a clone of each other. By this I mean the promoters today still pick games and run the tournament that allow the folling to happen..........

Player 1 breaks and runs out the set and player 2 never gets to shoot.

Player 1 misses and leaves player 2 hooked and when player 2 kicks and misses player 1 takes ball in hand and runs out....(player 1 lucky)

Player 1 gets out of line for their next shot and rather than take the risk they play safe.....(player 2 unlucky)

Player 1 shoots at one ball, misses that ball but lucks in another one and runs out.......(player 2 unlucky)

Do you see player 2 starting to get a little testy?

In golf when Tiger shoots a 63 from the back tees and I shoot an 85 :grin-square: from the mens tees, I can imagine how good he is and have a way to compare. When you see 2 players on a TV tournament playing under the current format and the set score ends up 9 to 3, how does this give the recreational player/amatuer a way compare?

Is pressure knowing you are playing Johnny Archer to win or knowing you have to shoot a 66 on the last day of the tournament to win....like Tiger

Most all tournaments are bracket elimination which does not create much drama for the finals......I will explain.

No matter what shade of lipstick you put on a pig, it's still a pig!

How about this concept...........you play a game where every player gets exactly the same chance to win as every other player in the tournament. Whoever you are playing with at your table has no effect on your chances to win, it's just you and the equipment. You get 10 chances to post your best score just like every other player in the tournament. There is no defense so you are required to shoot and pocket a ball even if you do get out of position (shame on you professional players). Talk about pressure, just imagine its the last day of the tournament and when you bend over the table to break your first rack you must shoot a 146 to win. You are playing the entire field during the tournament, not a single player elimination. On the last day and the last round there are 20 players playing at the same time shooting their best score and the score board changes with the completion of every rack until the winner is determined. This is the drama I was refering to 20 players playing at the same time, doing their best to shoot their highest score and the score board constantly changing until the last ball is pocketed.

This is a brief explination of what 6 Pocket is all about, I have a detailed business plan for 5 seperate business using this concept that several investors (business men, not in the industry) have bought into.

Now if i could only get the billiards community to buy into this concept.

 

[jimM]

Description?

Is there a description of this game anywhere, with the rules? If not, that would help.

It is difficult to tell if it is a good idea until one can read the rules.

 

[D C 6 Pocket]

Is there a description of this game anywhere, with the rules? If not, that would help.

It is difficult to tell if it is a good idea until one can read the rules.

Yes sir, go to 6Pocket.com and on the lower right click on the league logo and when it takes you to that page on the top nav bar select the rules. Any thing you may not understand, let me know and I will answer your questions.

Thanks

 

[JB Cases]

For the past 50 years that I know of, most tournaments have been a clone of each other. By this I mean the promoters today still pick games and run the tournament that allow the folling to happen..........

Player 1 breaks and runs out the set and player 2 never gets to shoot.

Player 1 misses and leaves player 2 hooked and when player 2 kicks and misses player 1 takes ball in hand and runs out....(player 1 lucky)

Player 1 gets out of line for their next shot and rather than take the risk they play safe.....(player 2 unlucky)

Player 1 shoots at one ball, misses that ball but lucks in another one and runs out.......(player 2 unlucky)

Do you see player 2 starting to get a little testy?

In golf when Tiger shoots a 63 from the back tees and I shoot an 85 :grin-square: from the mens tees, I can imagine how good he is and have a way to compare. When you see 2 players on a TV tournament playing under the current format and the set score ends up 9 to 3, how does this give the recreational player/amatuer a way compare?

Is pressure knowing you are playing Johnny Archer to win or knowing you have to shoot a 66 on the last day of the tournament to win....like Tiger

Most all tournaments are bracket elimination which does not create much drama for the finals......I will explain.

No matter what shade of lipstick you put on a pig, it's still a pig!

How about this concept...........you play a game where every player gets exactly the same chance to win as every other player in the tournament. Whoever you are playing with at your table has no effect on your chances to win, it's just you and the equipment. You get 10 chances to post your best score just like every other player in the tournament. There is no defense so you are required to shoot and pocket a ball even if you do get out of position (shame on you professional players). Talk about pressure, just imagine its the last day of the tournament and when you bend over the table to break your first rack you must shoot a 146 to win. You are playing the entire field during the tournament, not a single player elimination. On the last day and the last round there are 20 players playing at the same time shooting their best score and the score board changes with the completion of every rack until the winner is determined. This is the drama I was refering to 20 players playing at the same time, doing their best to shoot their highest score and the score board constantly changing until the last ball is pocketed.

This is a brief explination of what 6 Pocket is all about, I have a detailed business plan for 5 seperate business using this concept that several investors (business men, not in the industry) have bought into.

Now if i could only get the billiards community to buy into this concept.

Do you honestly think that golf is just about the player against the course?

What's really different to what you describe and Equal Offense which has been around for 20 years at least?

Pressure is not only knowing you have to beat Johnny Archer but you have to do it on 4.25" pockets in front of the crowd, on AccuStats with Mike Sigel and Buddy Hall critiquing your game as you are playing.

I feel that pocket billiards does not need to have another game competing for attention. However as a person who is in this business I realize that any attention is better than no attention so I welcome any game that's played on a pool table, using pool balls and cues, and requires all the skills that a champion pool player must develop to be a champion.

Anything that gets more people playing is great for the activity and the industry.

I just don't feel that it's the current competitive formats that are broken. Only how we present them.

To use your pig analogy, a chocolate cake with green icing is still a chocolate cake.