Why?

[Sloppy Pockets]

Because people are afraid of them therefore side pockets are a weakness to them. They do not understand that being able to pocket a ball equally well in any pocket allows for more shots options then always limiting your self to just certain pockets.

Who says they're afraid of them? I love side pockets. If the angle isn't too severe I find them to be softer than the corner pockets. They are like 10% bigger than the corners, you know, and with real shallow shelves.

But it ain't just about making the ball, it's about getting shape for the next shot. Making the ball in the side pocket can cause you to lose the CB on lots of shots. Where are you then?

I don't think the ease of pocketing a ball should be the main consideration in pattern selection. You should make the ball in the pocket that best enables you to get shape on the next ball. No use cinching a ball in the side if you lose the CB or leave yourself hooked on the next shot.

 

[Sloppy Pockets]

Yes, I do - but they undoubtedly "worked it all out" by trial and error, without benefit of clear rational explanations to guide their development. We don't have to do it the old fashioned way just because some pros had to do it that way.

Pat, I really can't tell if you are agreeing with me or disagreeing.

Of course, advanced knowledge is a huge plus in your developing skills. You obviously are a smart enough guy to know the difference between what you need to know and what you are curious to know.

I suspect that you a lot more curious about a lot of non-essential aspects of pool than most elite players are. These esoteric goodies may not affect your game, but they could wreak havoc on a world-class player like CJ who plays more from the right side of the brain.

These guys are the best in the world. It really is not important for them to be able to work their way through Dr. Dave's technical proofs.

 

[cookie man]

Do people really comment on you not taking long to stroke to perfect position?

Why are corner pockets more desirable than side pockets?

Cause Buddy Hall said so.lol.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

You obviously are a smart enough guy to know the difference between what you need to know and what you are curious to know.

I think it's smart not to assume that any knowledge is useless, or that there's such a thing as "too much" of it.

These esoteric goodies may not affect your game, but they could wreak havoc on a world-class player like CJ who plays more from the right side of the brain.

You think "too much knowledge" causes voices in his head that he can't shut up? Sounds like knowledge may not be the problem.

These guys are the best in the world. It really is not important for them to be able to work their way through Dr. Dave's technical proofs.

At the pro level the smallest advantage can be decisive, even knowledge you don't know you have.

pj
chgo

 

[Sloppy Pockets]

You think "too much knowledge" causes voices in his head that he can't shut up? Sounds like knowledge may not be the problem.

We all have extraneous thoughts (voices) running in the background of our consciousness. Even zen masters are unable to entirely shut off their thoughts at will. Try sitting meditation for 20 minutes and see how many random thoughts pass through your head. You might be surprised what's roaming around in there.

 

[CJ Wiley]

It's best to start with 10 minutes, then move up incrementally to 45 after a week/two

We all have extraneous thoughts (voices) running in the background of our consciousness. Even zen masters are unable to entirely shut off their thoughts at will. Try sitting meditation for 20 minutes and see how many random thoughts pass through your head. You might be surprised what's roaming around in there.

It's been reported that we average between 30k and 50k thoughts on an average day.

I have done a lot of anapana meditation, and you're right, it's even difficult to go 7-10 seconds without thinking about something abstract. It does get better with time, and the real breakthroughs with me have come after 45 minutes. I usually go an hour a day for three weeks, then have to take a break for awhile, it's about time to do another one now that you mention it.

For anyone that wants to try this make sure to set an alarm and commit to the time. It's best to start with 10 minutes, then move up incrementally to 45 after a week or two.

 

[duckie]

We all have extraneous thoughts (voices) running in the background of our consciousness. Even zen masters are unable to entirely shut off their thoughts at will. Try sitting meditation for 20 minutes and see how many random thoughts pass through your head. You might be surprised what's roaming around in there.

It is apparent you don't understand the point of meditation. It's not to stop thoughts but to learn not to place any value on them. Just to let them come and go. To not dwell on any thought, just let them come and go.

To sit and become aware of what is around you.

To count breaths.

Just to be.

Then again racing motorcyles and track days and riding extremely fast on tight twisty mountain roads has helped. Start of a race with 15 plus racers going for the same piece of track in the first turn, you got to be there and not thinking about laundry.

In these conditions you can be no where else. You cant have a wandering mind like is possible in a car just driving around.

And at times you got to be ahead,in your mind, of where you are on the road going fast.

But if youve never truely experince being in the moment, it can't be explained.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Me:
You think "too much knowledge" causes voices in his head that he can't shut up? Sounds like knowledge may not be the problem.

Sloppy:
We all have extraneous thoughts (voices) running in the background of our consciousness. Even zen masters are unable to entirely shut off their thoughts at will. Try sitting meditation for 20 minutes and see how many random thoughts pass through your head. You might be surprised what's roaming around in there.

So what part of it is from too much knowledge?

pj
chgo

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Because people are afraid of them therefore side pockets are a weakness to them. They do not understand that being able to pocket a ball equally well in any pocket allows for more shots options then always limiting your self to just certain pockets.

It has nothing to with the corners being more desirable but more about a person style of play which can not be applied to all. Their style pf play has the side pockets as a weakness whereas it is a strength to those than can use the side pocket whenever.

BTW, in straight pool, the side pocket can be used fora break shot.

Hi Duckie,

I feel this might not be the best example, Straight Pool, because some players prefer four of the six pockets wherever possible.

More food for thought?

1. As has been posted on this thread, some players need to learn how to use the sides without fear. These players need to hone their skills and work all six pockets.

2. I sometimes take off non-rotation racks as "outside in". Balls sitting close to the sides tend to be on the outside of that oblong circle. Other runs become "inside out" or "just shoot 'em" but it depends on paths to be cleared.

3. I'm no geometer, but it's hard to imagine an object ball that can be cut, not banked, to a side pocket that also wouldn't have a larger shape zone for the cue ball when moved to the equivalent position near a corner pocket. Players sometimes choose an "easy" key ball in the corner rather than a "correct" key ball in the side when faced with two possible choices in a sequence--especially non-precise players who struggle with shaping the cue ball.

As an aside, I've heard some interesting comments on Willie Mosconi lately, that he took more corner pocket break shots then we heard about growing up, and less side pocket shots. Sides or corners, of course, they (publicly) sank 37 times for him in one inning, a "long time ago on an 8-footer far away"! I think I would have cut the table's cloth free to make a blanket of it for my use at home...

 

[Sloppy Pockets]

It is apparent you don't understand the point of meditation. It's not to stop thoughts but to learn not to place any value on them. Just to let them come and go. To not dwell on any thought, just let them come and go.

To sit and become aware of what is around you.

To count breaths.

Just to be.

Then again racing motorcyles and track days and riding extremely fast on tight twisty mountain roads has helped. Start of a race with 15 plus racers going for the same piece of track in the first turn, you got to be there and not thinking about laundry.

In these conditions you can be no where else. You cant have a wandering mind like is possible in a car just driving around.

And at times you got to be ahead,in your mind, of where you are on the road going fast.

But if youve never truely experince being in the moment, it can't be explained.

Duckie, I've probably sat in meditation more hours than you've played pool. I'm pretty well aware of what mediation is supposed to do for you.

Yes, in the beginning you are supposed to just sit and pay attention to your breathing (or mantra, koan, etc.) while you learn to just watch your thoughts pass, but that's just Meditation 101. The long term goal (as if there really are "goals" in zen) is to quiet the mind and become truly awake. That, my friend, is a lifetime of work.

I will agree with you on the motorcycle thing, though. Nothing like racing racing 90 MPH through a badly banked curve with random patches of grease and gravel strewn around to make you live "in the moment". Been there, done that plenty, but that was a lifetime ago. There are gentler ways to the center.

 

[CJ Wiley]

Feelings and emotions are difficult to control, although they are influenced

Duckie, I've probably sat in meditation more hours than you've played pool. I'm pretty well aware of what mediation is supposed to do for you.

Yes, in the beginning you are supposed to just sit and pay attention to your breathing (or mantra, koan, etc.) while you learn to just watch your thoughts pass, but that's just Meditation 101. The long term goal (as if there really are "goals" in zen) is to quiet the mind and become truly awake. That, my friend, is a lifetime of work.

I will agree with you on the motorcycle thing, though. Nothing like racing racing 90 MPH through a badly banked curve with random patches of grease and gravel strewn around to make you live "in the moment". Been there, done that plenty, but that was a lifetime ago. There are gentler ways to the center.

There's a huge break-though in our mental {inner} life when trained to ObSeRvE our thoughts, rather than let them influence our emotional state. Feelings and emotions are difficult to control, although they are influenced directly by our attitudes.

I learned from a friend that does the retreats where they mediate 9 hours a day (one hour at a time) - this is too extreme for me, an hour a day is plenty, even then, I have trouble doing more than 3 weeks at a time.

Yesterday I overheard someone that was doing 8 minutes a day and thought it was a lot.....and it is, of course the only way to find out is to actually do it.

 

[Sloppy Pockets]

So what part of it is from too much knowledge?

Well, that depends on the person. For an idiot like me, about 3.2%. For a smart guy like you whose brain is stuffed with knowledge? Well, it could be a lot. An awful lot.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Well, that depends on the person. For an idiot like me, about 3.2%. For a smart guy like you whose brain is stuffed with knowledge? Well, it could be a lot. An awful lot.

lol - that round goes to Sloppy Pockets.

pj
chgo

 

[CJ Wiley]

Anyone can pocket balls as well as anyone else, when they put in the time and effort

Or I should say what but I have a simple but serious question.

What stops PJ from being able to pocket balls as effectively as CJ?

Anyone can pocket balls as well as anyone else, when they put in the time, dedication, and effort.

Whether it's using TOI, CTE, or some other system, "if it's possible in this world, it's possible for anyone in it"......and such is life. 'The Game {of LIFE} is the Teacher'

 

[(((Satori)))]

Anyone can pocket balls as well as anyone else, when they put in the time, dedication, and effort.

Whether it's using TOI, CTE, or some other system, "if it's possible in this world, it's possible for anyone in it"......and such is life. 'The Game {of LIFE} is the Teacher'

I have seen you show respect for Napoleon Hill from time to time. I have always been a believer in his principles too and they seem to be similar to what you are saying here. Desire, faith, and persistence are 3 biggies imo.

 

[CJ Wiley]

the unlimited power of the subconscious mind in all of us

I have seen you show respect for Napoleon Hill from time to time. I have always been a believer in his principles too and they seem to be similar to what you are saying here. Desire, faith, and persistence are 3 biggies imo.

Yes, the essence of all human existence is what we allow to be our dominating thoughts. If someone is filled with thoughts of worry, guilt, negativity, or envy, these thoughts become their masters.

Napoleon Hill did research that led to outstanding breakthroughs in technology - the unlimited power of the subconscious mind in all of us......there are no exceptions, we just have to "real eyes" this wisdom is true.

Playing a game like pool at it's highest levels is only a "scratch on the surface" of what our minds are capable of.