Would prototypes of a "production cue" be considered "custom"?

B

BFC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Would prototypes of a "production cue" be considered "custom"?

I see these from time to time on ebay and other auction sites, and sometimes in private sales. The descriptions people use varies greatly...

For example, you see some Meucci's floating around out there which are prototypes of later-released production lines. They ARE slightly different from the later released production ones. e.g. a prototype or three may have been made, the mfg makes adjustments, and releases the line.

Would you consider those prototype variations to be "custom cues" - in the general sense of the word? Or... perhaps a "1 of 1" production cue?

I'm just trying to find the best way to describe these prototype cues... so as to convey their uniqueness (e.g. apart from the later released production runs) but also as to not mislead e.g. they aren't really custom "hand made" cues.

Looking forward to your thoughts.
 
This has been discussed. Few times in the past and there are various ideas on the subject.

I remember when you could call Meucci, ask for a few changes to their ordinary catalog cues, pay the difference and have a one off cue. By definition as stated before, that makes it custom. Schon has always been the same way.
 
mattb said:
This has been discussed. Few times in the past and there are various ideas on the subject.

I remember when you could call Meucci, ask for a few changes to their ordinary catalog cues, pay the difference and have a one off cue. By definition as stated before, that makes it custom. Schon has always been the same way.
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This helps point me in the right direction... in the case you mentioned about ordering variations on a catalog item, you would call that a "Customized Production Cue" not a "Custom cue" or "custom production cue" - big difference between "customized" and "custom" in this context.
 
No idea what the first responder said, as he is on ignore.

But, a custom and prototype are different.

A custom is a cue you design from the ground up, with help from the cuemaker. Hopefully, you visit him, design the cue, select designs, points, veneers, joint rings, buttsleeve design, material, buttplate material, and everything else. Also, ferrule materials, whether Ivory, Juma, Malamine, Ivorine 3, Ivorine 4, Aegis, Fiber, or other material.

Prototype, it doesn't mean anything. It's the first of a cue line design.

Please don't confuse the two. It's been done too often here.

All the best,
WW
 
BFC said:
I'm just trying to find the best way to describe these prototype cues...
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IMHO the best description is in fact the word "prototype".

Not sure why you are looking for something more descriptive. I think it says everything.

Are looking for perhaps the word "unique"? It might apply and it might not.





.
 
A prototype is just what the term implies.......It is not a custom, intentionally made and constructed cue with a specific final design in mind.
A prototype is "the original model of something from which later forms are developed, patterned and reproduced." Go visit a custom cue-maker
and you will see the difference immediately. I think the argument gets waged because folks that don't have a custom made cue think they can
label something they already have as being such. If it makes them feel better then so be it but when they go trying to sell it, don't come back
crying the blues that you can't get the price you want or the ad gets criticized for being misleading.......You can label an anteater an elephant
because it does have a trunk but it will never pass for one at any zoo or animal exhibit.
 
Bavafongoul said:
A prototype is just what the term implies.......It is not a custom, intentionally made and constructed cue with a specific final design in mind.
A prototype is "the original model of something from which later forms are developed, patterned and reproduced.
Click to expand...

Correct.

All the best,
WW
 
Bavafongoul said:
A prototype is just what the term implies.......It is not a custom, intentionally made and constructed cue with a specific final design in mind.
Click to expand...

I don't think that describes a custom very well.

"Intentionally made with a final design in mind" would describe just about any cue.

To be fair, many highly respected custom makers produce numerous non-custom cues. I often point out Gina. Many of them are straight catalog designs...not customs.

But indeed...a prototype is generally not a custom.




.
 
Thanks all, this helps frame it for me. So in terms of coming up with a classification for cues e.g. ... "build-method classification" we could do:

- Custom Made Cue
- Production Cue (from a line of cues, standard, e.g. from a catalog) - potentially split out to "mass production cue" (as many as can be sold) vs "limited run production cue" (usually marked with a serial number, small run with a known size from the start e.g. #1 of 100 etc.)
- Customized Production Cue (Note "customized" instead of "custom made" - e.g. is a standard design from the catalog, but buyer selected or changed options either from a list of options or other custom/personalization request)
- Production Prototype (pre-production cues which are prototypes, may slightly differ from the final design put into production)

Am I missing anything major or does anything here not make any sense? Does any of the above break down nicely into further groups?

Now if we could just get all of the people posting cues on ebay and craigslist to stop calling EVERYTHING "antique" or "rare" or "custom" ... They almost all have one of those words and the cues for sale are almost never any of those things.
 
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At least we're on the same page about prototypes.I couldn't come up with a simple statement about what a custom cue is.
Ergo, I respectfully defer that definition and description to others but it sure enough doesn't include provision for prototypes.
 
For custom made cues - is it worth making distinction between actual orders from a customer e.g. customer orders, then you make it, vs. a custom cue maker making a couple cues of his/her own design, then offering them for sale?

Also... to further define custom - could you say that it means only one exists? e.g. unique. Could there be more than one identical cues, and they still be considered "custom cues"? (other than a specific customer orders a set etc)? Examples?

What about a distinction between "production cues" (large production runs, generally produce as many as can be sold) and "limited run production cues" (limited production runs, usually with a set, smaller number produced e.g. run of 10, 50, 100, 250, etc... where the cue is numbered etc.) ?
 
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WildWing said:
No idea what the first responder said, as he is on ignore.

But, a custom and prototype are different.

A custom is a cue you design from the ground up, with help from the cuemaker. Hopefully, you visit him, design the cue, select designs, points, veneers, joint rings, buttsleeve design, material, buttplate material, and everything else. Also, ferrule materials, whether Ivory, Juma, Malamine, Ivorine 3, Ivorine 4, Aegis, Fiber, or other material.

Prototype, it doesn't mean anything. It's the first of a cue line design.

Please don't confuse the two. It's been done too often here.

All the best,
WW
Click to expand...

I don't see why you feel the need to brag about it,
I can ignore you without help from my computer:)

Dale
 
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