Yet another one-pocket handicap question

BillPorter

BillPorter

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I would appreciate any of you seasoned one-hole players to weigh in with an opinion on which spot is better: two and stop or 9 to 7. By two and stop, I mean that the stronger player is limited to a run of two balls; after making the second ball, it's now my shot. This is different from "two and safe" in which the stronger player may run up to two balls and then play a safety. Thanks in advance for your comments!:)
 
In my opinion I would rather give up the 9 to 7 instead of the two and stop. Anyone that I feel that I could play with the two and stop I think would deserve something like 9 to 5. There is a world of difference between two and stop and two and safe. Playing 9 to 7 allows me choose how to give the table back to my opponent.

With two and stop many times I would have to pass on some makable balls because of not being able to locate the cue ball to a safe spot, thus taking the chance of giving up the game.
 
I would have to agree with the above poster. In my limited experience with 2 and stop I would have to say that I like 9-7 better. Most of the time I have played 2 and stop it ends up becoming 1 and duck, you can't pocket the second ball if you can't also duck on the same shot. I would say 3 and stop would be a little better to compare to 9-7.

But I am also not sure what my word is worth. I am having a terrible time figuring out if I can give this 1 kid the hit and pick 4. I can't even figure out what it would be worth in balls terms.
 
dabarbr said:
In my opinion I would rather give up the 9 to 7 instead of the two and stop. Anyone that I feel that I could play with the two and stop I think would deserve something like 9 to 5. There is a world of difference between two and stop and two and safe. Playing 9 to 7 allows me choose how to give the table back to my opponent.

With two and stop many times I would have to pass on some makable balls because of not being able to locate the cue ball to a safe spot, thus taking the chance of giving up the game.
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i believe your right on with your answer.
 
Hi Bill

Two and stop is awfully hard to give up, especially if the man receiving the spot knows how to use it. He can play table length banks or long, hard shots with impunity because the opponent can only make one or two.
Jew Paul robbed almost every great One Pocket player with that handicap. I broke even with him and he was amazed.
 
Grady said:
Two and stop is awfully hard to give up, especially if the man receiving the spot knows how to use it. He can play table length banks or long, hard shots with impunity because the opponent can only make one or two.
Jew Paul robbed almost every great One Pocket player with that handicap. I broke even with him and he was amazed.
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It appears that everyone agrees that two and stop is a much stronger spot than 9 to 7. This was my perception as well, but I wanted to get some opinions from seasoned one-pocket players. For sure it allows you to go for some aggressive shots that you would normally pass on. I even thought it might make sense to break the balls wide open on the break. Any thoughts on a wide open break if you are getting the two and stop?
 
Any kind of one stop or two stop where only ONE of the two players has to stop opens it up for a wide open break and a real tough game for the stopping player
 
Exactly! I'd rather give out 10/6 that play any stop type spot.

u12armresl said:
Any kind of one stop or two stop where only ONE of the two players has to stop opens it up for a wide open break and a real tough game for the stopping player
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It's strange, but

I lost four games in a row with the other player playing two and stop. I don't think I was playing the game in a very smart way. I changed the game to where I was getting 8 to 6 and got even pretty quickly. Somehow I just felt more confident with the 8 to 6 spot and played better.
 
BillPorter said:
I lost four games in a row with the other player playing two and stop. I don't think I was playing the game in a very smart way. I changed the game to where I was getting 8 to 6 and got even pretty quickly. Somehow I just felt more confident with the 8 to 6 spot and played better.
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I am puzzled. You should have had a better game with the him having to do the 2 and stop. Maybe you got to aggressive and thought it might have been to easy of a game.

I believe the odds will be greatly in your favor once you understand how to take advantage of the spot. Averages always show their true colors in the long run.

P.S. If you were doing an open break. I believe IMO that was a mistake. This leaves the balls too spread out and makes it eaisier for him to make the second ball and duck.
 
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I've never heard of "two & stop" before.

My question would be, why not just smash the rack, let your opponent run his 2 balls & then fire away at your hole?

Am i missing somthing here?
 
dabarbr said:
I am puzzled. You should have had a better game with the him having to do the 2 and stop. Maybe you got to aggressive and thought it might have been to easy of a game.
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Yes, I think you are correct about this. I somehow thought the spot gave me the nuts and that I didn't have to bear down and play a smart game. And I'm not a great shot maker/ball runner, so, effectively, I am often playing two and stop myself!:grin:
 
asn130 said:
I've never heard of "two & stop" before.

My question would be, why not just smash the rack, let your opponent run his 2 balls & then fire away at your hole?

Am i missing somthing here?
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Yes, you are missing a detail here. My opponent isn't going to make his second ball and simply let me start running balls into my hole. He is always going to shot his second ball in a way that leaves me with no open shot at my hole. Essentially, he is playing "one and safe," meaning that he is going to make one ball and then play safe, maybe making a second ball as he plays me safe.
 
dabarbr said:
In my opinion I would rather give up the 9 to 7 instead of the two and stop. Anyone that I feel that I could play with the two and stop I think would deserve something like 9 to 5. There is a world of difference between two and stop and two and safe. Playing 9 to 7 allows me choose how to give the table back to my opponent.

With two and stop many times I would have to pass on some makable balls because of not being able to locate the cue ball to a safe spot, thus taking the chance of giving up the game.
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Tap Tap, I agree. "Two and Stop" sure puts a damper on your game. Stops you from running balls, a big weapon in One Pocket. The Biggest!
 
BillPorter said:
Yes, you are missing a detail here. My opponent isn't going to make his second ball and simply let me start running balls into my hole. He is always going to shot his second ball in a way that leaves me with no open shot at my hole. Essentially, he is playing "one and safe," meaning that he is going to make one ball and then play safe, maybe making a second ball as he plays me safe.
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puckett wanted 8 to 4 from very good players if he played one and safe. he played it about as well as anyone.
 
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