My Take on Speed Pool

9BallPaul

9BallPaul

Banned
Haven't paid much attention until the last few months, and have delayed this thread to make sure I'm ready to defend my opinions.

By accident, I caught the so-called national championship of speed pool today on ESPN, announced by Mitch Lawrence and Allen Hopkins. Watched an Irish kid pretty much destroy his opponent. In so doing, he exhibited all the skills required of regular pool games -- shotmaking, position, speed of stroke, poise, intelligence, etc. -- and added the new dimension of speed, a measure we find in many other sports.

Now consider spectator appeal: Any channel surfer can land on this broadcast and figure out what's required. It's captivating TV -- you want to hang around for the conclusion. To that, realize that's there's no need to understand any complicated rules, or to even identify the balls on the table. So the need for HDTV is lessened considerably -- as if you could find that anyway.

Mrs. 9BP, who indulges me once in a while by watching a pool match (and she never plays, even though there's a game room in the basement) was captivated she watched the whole show and understood it immediately. My guess is the general public might react similarly.

And the winner took home 40K. Far as I know, the Derby doesn't pay out that kind of dough.

I'm not a 24/7 forum hound, so I'm guessing this subject has been chewed upon before. Even so, I curious what others think.
 
I find it pretty dull, as do most serious players. Nonetheless, any pool on TV is a good thing, and if speed pool (and trick shot magic) get better ratings than regular tournament pool ---- well that matters. Still, I wonder whether non-pool people watching speed pool (or trick shot magic) are inspired enough by what they are watching to try the game.
 
9BallPaul said:
Haven't paid much attention until the last few months, and have delayed this thread to make sure I'm ready to defend my opinions.

By accident, I caught the so-called national championship of speed pool today on ESPN, announced by Mitch Lawrence and Allen Hopkins. Watched an Irish kid pretty much destroy his opponent. In so doing, he exhibited all the skills required of regular pool games -- shotmaking, position, speed of stroke, poise, intelligence, etc. -- and added the new dimension of speed, a measure we find in many other sports.

Now consider spectator appeal: Any channel surfer can land on this broadcast and figure out what's required. It's captivating TV -- you want to hang around for the conclusion. To that, realize that's there's no need to understand any complicated rules, or to even identify the balls on the table. So the need for HDTV is lessened considerably -- as if you could find that anyway.

Mrs. 9BP, who indulges me once in a while by watching a pool match (and she never plays, even though there's a game room in the basement) was captivated she watched the whole show and understood it immediately. My guess is the general public might react similarly.

And the winner took home 40K. Far as I know, the Derby doesn't pay out that kind of dough.

I'm not a 24/7 forum hound, so I'm guessing this subject has been chewed upon before. Even so, I curious what others think.
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Though the kid's name is Bobby McGrath (I get how you'd mistake him for Irish with that name), he's from the Peoria IL area. I've known Bobby for quite awhile, and he has a very good all around game (not just SPEED POOL). He has won the ESPN speed pool thing 2 years in a row, and the first year (2007) he also won the VNEA 9 ball Championship in Vegas. I know many on here belittle the whole speed pool thing, and that's fine, but he CAN play, and he just happens to be VERY good at playing VERY fast :thumbup:
 
trustyrusty said:
Though the kid's name is Bobby McGrath (I get how you'd mistake him for Irish with that name), he's from the Peoria IL area. I've known Bobby for quite awhile, and he has a very good all around game (not just SPEED POOL). He has won the ESPN speed pool thing 2 years in a row, and the first year (2007) he also won the VNEA 9 ball Championship in Vegas. I know many on here belittle the whole speed pool thing, and that's fine, but he CAN play, and he just happens to be VERY good at playing VERY fast :thumbup:
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I agree completely. He may not be Keith incarnate, he's a fine player in his own right. I'm still thinking that McGrath is an Irish name, and that's all I meant. Glad to know he's a Yank too.
 
Im sorry, but speed pool kind of makes me puke in my mouth. It takes a game of intense intellectual and physical skill and reduces it to beating balls around. Usually with a leave, but not necessary.


It does get viewers.


TV trick shot pool is as bad to me. Still, I respect the guys who can combine creativity, stroke and showmanship to make a living from the game we all love. I much prefer this live. I think the best live show is the guy who can clear an 8 ball rack when a 6 yr old safety breaks! I saw Grady Mathews do this once like 10 times in a row. I was hooked!
 
As an average pool fan I think this is what's wrong in general. They televise a person running around the table 100mph (secretly hoping they trip and skewer themselves with their cue) the worst part is they think they're watching pool.

Meanwhile they won't televise a professional game of pool newer than 2002 (trick shot shows don't count).

If they showcased the intricacies of pool people would appreciate it more instead of gimmick games.

I believe pool is like any other game/sport you like it or you don't.
 
I'm not a fan. I've got the TIVO set to record all billiards stuff and when I saw this on the list I erased it without watching. Just doesn't do it for me. Certainly some of the recent contenders have serious game, no doubt of that. Still...doesn't do it for me. I do appreciate it for any decent TV ratings it can get for the game of billiards in general. But I'm not really interested in watching it and can't imagine attending an event. Even if top pros played in it, it's just a novelty to me. That one that JL played in didn't add anything to it as far as I was concerned.


As far as it attracting enough non-pool viewers and inspiring them to take up the game, I don't think that will happen in significant numbers and honestly don't care if any of them take up the game, especially if that means they take up speed pool and commence to running around the tables at my local pool room. I'd settle for it to simply inspire them to watch regular pool matches on TV thereby increasing the ratings and attracting sponsors and networks to back more coverage of mainline big time professional pool.
 
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I don't care for speed pool... I think it's just a gimmick... I have respect for the guys that play it though
 
I guess I am in the minority here but I don't mind watching it. It only comes on once a year and I find it very entertaining.
 
I also have the Tivo set to record all billiards programs. I watched two racks of the speed pool match before deleting it. Boring.
 
It's neat, but I wish they'd spend that 40 or 50k somewhere else and reward someone who has more impressive skills. Shooting fast and still somehow playing correctly is a talent and maybe it's worth some money, but for that kind of money I'd rather reward the guy who sweats through 100+ balls in a straight pool tournament than a guy who has a good day whacking his way through a game of 8-ball.

Prizing speed in pool makes about as much sense as rewarding reflexes in a game of poker.
 
Not knocking any of the speed pool players out there, as I'm sure they are all pretty good real players, but I can't change the channel quick enough whenever it comes on. It is a total gimmick. Imagine how clownish speed golf would be? And to think that the winner makes more than the US Open champ or the All-Around winner at the Derby kinda makes me cringe. I know it has more appeal to the masses than say a Johnny Archer, lint -picking match, but it's not the way I'd like to see pool represented.
 
I posted my opinion on this about a year ago so I guess I should update it.

I still think Speed Pool is better than trick shots -- I realize there's a lot of tradition there, but it's not the kind of pool tradition I'm interested in. I guess it's a bit like the Harlem Globetrotters, or the circus -- not things I am interested in.

Speed Pool is better for me because, as the first post here suggests, it has all the elements of an actual game, it's just a lot faster. I feel like you get a pretty good bang for your buck -- an entire rack of shot-making in a couple of minutes, whereas in a regular match in a few minutes you might see 3 or 4 shots... and it's more than just banging the ball around, these guys run the table without missing (for the bonus time subtraction).

THAT said, I'd rather watch a proper match. I do think there's something to having poise at the table. Speed pool erases that (or at least compromises it -- some players appear to be more goofy than others).

So in summary:

"real" pool > speed pool > trick shots
 
This thread is timely. We were surfing the TV yesterday and came across Allen Hopkins' speed pool championship.

We watched the final round. I looked at my boyfriend, who plays very fast, and said to him, "Do you think you could beat this guy in speed?" He didn't respond to me, and I was thinking that maybe I was asking a dumb question.

Several minutes later, after a commercial, the TV showed them presenting the winner of the speed pool championship with a check for $40,000. All of a sudden, I got an answer to my inquiry, "I'm calling Allen. I want to be on the next one." LOL! :grin-square:
 
JAM said:
This thread is timely. We were surfing the TV yesterday and came across Allen Hopkins' speed pool championship.

We watched the final round. I looked at my boyfriend, who plays very fast, and said to him, "Do you think you could beat this guy in speed?" He didn't respond to me, and I was thinking that maybe I was asking a dumb question.

Several minutes later, after a commercial, the TV showed them presenting the winner of the speed pool championship with a check for $40,000. All of a sudden, I got an answer to my inquiry, "I'm calling Allen. I want to be on the next one." LOL! :grin-square:
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JAM, glad to hear that Keith doesn't have his nose in the air like so many of our posters. I'd love to see him take down a tourney. He's gonna have to get himself in shape first, I fear.

Here's a question for the critics: Which of pool's many skills is not in demand in speed pool? All this does is add another element. Not saying it should or would replace traditional games. It's just another in the many kinds of games we can play. And it pays.
 
sjm said:
I find it pretty dull, as do most serious players. Nonetheless, any pool on TV is a good thing, and if speed pool (and trick shot magic) get better ratings than regular tournament pool ---- well that matters. Still, I wonder whether non-pool people watching speed pool (or trick shot magic) are inspired enough by what they are watching to try the game.
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so heres the question: is speed pool good for pool? sjm i dont think its about getting pple who watch to try pool (isnt pool already the biggest particpant sport in the us?) but about getting pple to tune in and watch. thats what sponsors want-folks watching. speed pool is perfect for this-fast paced, easy to understand rules, good head to head competition and a nice payout.

for you pool snobs out there (speed pool is a gimmick) hasnt that been a knock on most games at one time? back in the day do you think that straight pool players may have said 9ball was a gimmick game. didnt mosconi refuse to play one pocket b/c he said it was a gimmick.

speed pool takes quite a bit of pool playing skill. i mean really have you tried to clear all the balls of the table in a minute? hell with the shape some of us are in it would probably kill us :)

i like watching (and occ playing) speed pool and i think could be good for the game as well. maybe we as a community be more supportive of something that can be good for the game.

brian
 
9BallPaul said:
JAM, glad to hear that Keith doesn't have his nose in the air like so many of our posters. I'd love to see him take down a tourney. He's gonna have to get himself in shape first, I fear...
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Oh, he's in shape all right. Just take a trip with him to any casino or horse racetrack and see how fast he moves. He's like a streak of light going by. :embarrassed2:

Interestingly, one time at a Glass City Open mini tournament, Keith drew Luc Salvas' name. The two of them finished the race-to-10 in minutes, while all other scores in the tournament were 3 to 1, 2 to 1, 2 to 2, 2 to zero, et cetera.

I have always thought Keith should slow down when he plays pool. He's notoriously fast and shoots instinctively sometimes, without thinking.

His game is the opposite of, say, a Nick Varner when it comes to time spent at the table analyzing a shot! I wish he'd slow down and play more slowly a la Nick, as I think he would help his game in the long run.

Speed pool? I saw those guys on TV. I actually believe Keith can give 'em all a run for the money. I have a video of him running a rack of 15 balls on a bar box, and you can still hear all balls rolling down the rails underneath the table as he's still shooting balls in. It is very loud and kind of cool. If I can figure out how to upload it to YouTube, I will do it. While one ball is fired in the pocket, you can hear two or three of them still rolling underneath the table. The noise of balls rolling under the table is constant, and it doesn't stop until all 15 balls are pocketed.
 
I think earl could do well in this thing too. He two-strokes everything already, his normal pace is quite quick. What separates him from a Luc Salvas (aside from general overall talent) is that when a shot demands some thinking, he'll give it some consideration. Of course all of that is done while standing up. Once he's down, he's committed to his gameplan and is still gonna two-stroke it usually.
 
9BallPaul said:
Here's a question for the critics: Which of pool's many skills is not in demand in speed pool? All this does is add another element. Not saying it should or would replace traditional games. It's just another in the many kinds of games we can play. And it pays.
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How about safety play and kick shots? How about we have the speed pool players play speed 10 ball, or speed straight pool... then, I'd watch it.
 
9BallPaul said:
JAM, glad to hear that Keith doesn't have his nose in the air like so many of our posters. I'd love to see him take down a tourney. He's gonna have to get himself in shape first, I fear.

Here's a question for the critics: Which of pool's many skills is not in demand in speed pool? All this does is add another element. Not saying it should or would replace traditional games. It's just another in the many kinds of games we can play. And it pays.
Click to expand...



Here's what they should do. Go ahead and play "speed pool", but first, fill the room with two feet of water(I would prefer TAR, lol), and make them wear Andre the giant's shoes. I also want them to wear prescription glasses that aren't theirs, shoot opposite handed, and do 17 push-ups between every shot. If they really want to add unnecessary, unrelated things to the game, at least make it fun to watch. I don't blame the guys that play it, everybodys gotta make that nut, but I think it is absolutely tragic that the money is going to things like this:(

ps I really would watch that, lol.
 
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