Sighting ... which method do you think is best?

[dr_dave]

We have had a lot of threads about aiming over the years, and recently there seems to be a lot of interest in "sighting." There seems to be several generally accepted approaches to sighting, all of which seem reasonable to me. Which method do you think makes the most sense for most people? Or does it really matter? As long as you sight consistently, wouldn't you learn to judge how to make each shot based on the "picture" your brain "sees," as long as your brain "sees" the same "picture" each time you have the same shot?

FYI, some background information and resources concerning sighting can be found here:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/aiming.html#sighting​

I look forward to seeing how the poll turns out, and I hope all of the instructors and players out their will share their views on the topic.

Regards,
Dave

 

[whitewolf]

Ghost ball method. Keep it simple stupid. Where is the poll?

 

[dr_dave]

Ghost ball method.

Ghost-ball is an aiming method, not a sighting method.

Keep it simple stupid.

Agreed. I think KISS should be applied both to aiming and sighting.

Where is the poll?

It should be there now. When I first hit the submit button, one of the choices was too long, so I had to make a change and resubmit the poll. Do you see it now?

Thanks
Dave

 

[pooltchr]

Sighting down the cue is an absolute necessity. While there are plenty of aiming systems, in the end, you have to know where you are sending the cue ball. And the best way to know where the cue ball is going to go, is to see where the cue is going to be going, reletive to the cue ball.

Steve

 

[dr_dave]

Sighting down the cue is an absolute necessity. While there are plenty of aiming systems, in the end, you have to know where you are sending the cue ball. And the best way to know where the cue ball is going to go, is to see where the cue is going to be going, reletive to the cue ball.

I agree. Personally, I don't like placing my "vision center" anywhere but over the cue. But based on all of the hype about PERFECT AIM recently, it seems like not everybody agrees with this "conventional wisdom." Now, sometimes I'll temporarily shift my head and close one eye to get a different "look" at my aim (e.g., with thin cuts or when I need to narrowly miss an obstacle ball), but during the final set and stroke, I like to have my "vision center" over the cue. I'm curious to see what other instructors and experienced players think about this.

Regards,
Dave

 

[sr 9ball]

thanks dave. these r the answeres i was looking for.
thin cuts look good from edge to edge. but the rest looking down the shaft.

 

[dr_dave]

thanks dave. these r the answeres i was looking for.
thin cuts look good from edge to edge. but the rest looking down the shaft.

With thin cuts, I like to close my outside eye and shift my head to sight edge-to-edge with my inside eye to check my alignment, but I still prefer committing to my final line with my "vision center" over the cue. But it seems like a lot of people like the edge-to-edge vision-center sighting on thin cuts. In fact, options 2 and 3 of the poll both suggest this method with thin cuts.

I'm really surprised nobody has selected option 3 yet. Gene's thread has received tens of thousands of hits, and it seems like hundreds of people have purchased his DVD, but nobody has selected his option yet.

Regards,
Dave

 

[Joe T]

With thin cuts, I like to close my outside eye and shift my head to sight edge-to-edge with my inside eye to check my alignment, but I still prefer committing to my final line with my "vision center" over the cue. But it seems like a lot of people like the edge-to-edge vision-center sighting on thin cuts. In fact, options 2 and 3 of the poll both suggest this method with thin cuts.

I'm really surprised nobody has selected option 3 yet. Gene's thread has received tens of thousands of hits, and it seems like hundreds of people have purchased his DVD, but nobody has selected his option yet.

Regards,
Dave

Hey Dave, I like to use my outside eye when cutting balls especially thin ones the same way you described, ending with both over the cue. Done it on and off for years.

 

[sammi sam]

Just an idea.

We use hand to control the cue, we need to stroke on track then hit many as we can.

We maybe keep that muscle memory to transmit our brain.

It's just a thought.

best regards

 

[dr_dave]

Hey Dave, I like to use my outside eye when cutting balls especially thin ones the same way you described, ending with both over the cue. Done it on and off for years.

I'm not sure I understand what you are suggesting here. The inside eye is the one closest to the thin-cut edge-to-edge line. Are you saying you shift your head to align the outside eye with the inside edge-to-edge line, and then re-center your vision over the cue before shooting? Or are you suggesting you sight the outside eye through the outside edges of both the CB and OB? But then your line of sight won't be parallel to your aiming line (or the cue) anymore, right? Please explain.

Thanks,
Dave

 

[Joe T]

I'm not sure I understand what you are suggesting here. The inside eye is the one closest to the thin-cut edge-to-edge line. Are you saying you shift your head to align the outside eye with the inside edge-to-edge line, and then re-center your vision over the cue before shooting? Thanks,
Dave

Yes to this one

 

[Fatboy]

Dave,

this was a tough one to answere, i picked the 2nd choice, thats what i learned over 20 years ago, JA also showed me what he does(only one time for 10 mins and it was the 2nd choice),

the last choice about being lined up good is important and IMO not a sighting method, when i do catch a gear-it is much higher than my normal game-the spread between normall and high gear in my case is much farther apart that most players, I have only seeen a couple others over the years with the normal to high gear difference like I have. I only mention this because when I do catch that gear, I'm awalys lined up good. That factor alone the "Line-up" gets me the big gear. For Earl it is statee of mond for him to hit his high gear(IM NOT PICKING ON HIM) I'm pointing out that some people catch gears for different reasons. Lineing up isnt a sighting method.


I would be glad to speak to you about this if you like any time 702-241-8000, thanks Eric



Edit: Thanks for all your work all these years

 

[duckie]

Ghost-ball is an aiming method, not a sighting method.

Agreed. I think KISS should be applied both to aiming and sighting.

It should be there now. When I first hit the submit button, one of the choices was too long, so I had to make a change and resubmit the poll. Do you see it now?

Thanks
Dave

You've got to be kidding. There is no difference between sighting and aiming.


I can sight down a rifle barrel or I can aim down a rifle barrel, all the same.


Where is "just see the shot?"

 

[dr_dave]

The inside eye is the one closest to the thin-cut edge-to-edge line. Are you saying you shift your head to align the outside eye with the inside edge-to-edge line, and then re-center your vision over the cue before shooting?

Yes to this one

That seems like a large head shift or turn to me when I try it. Do you do this because it helps you see the line better? Maybe by turning your head, you turn the inside eye away from the line so much that the outside eye can see the line better? I accomplish this by using the inside eye with a more subtle head shift, and temporarily close the outside eye to give the inside eye a better look at the line. Do you see other benefits to using the outside eye instead? Also, are you turning your head to bring the outside eye into the line or mostly shifting your head and/or body sideways?

Thanks,
Dave

 

[dr_dave]

Dave,

this was a tough one to answere, i picked the 2nd choice, thats what i learned over 20 years ago, JA also showed me what he does(only one time for 10 mins and it was the 2nd choice),

the last choice about being lined up good is important and IMO not a sighting method, when i do catch a gear-it is much higher than my normal game-the spread between normall and high gear in my case is much farther apart that most players, I have only seeen a couple others over the years with the normal to high gear difference like I have. I only mention this because when I do catch that gear, I'm awalys lined up good. That factor alone the "Line-up" gets me the big gear. For Earl it is statee of mond for him to hit his high gear(IM NOT PICKING ON HIM) I'm pointing out that some people catch gears for different reasons. Lineing up isnt a sighting method.

Thank you for your insightful comments.

I would be glad to speak to you about this if you like any time 702-241-8000, thanks Eric

Thanks for the offer.

Edit: Thanks for all your work all these years

You're welcome ... and thank you.

Regards,
Dave

 

[dr_dave]

You've got to be kidding. There is no difference between sighting and aiming.

I think there is a difference between aiming and sighting, but I'd like to hear what others think about this. To me, aiming is the processes of figuring out where the line of the shot needs to be to make the ball. Sighting has to do with where and how you align your vision to help ensure the cue ends up along the necessary line of the shot. I can see how some people might do these things naturally and together, but I also think many people do better aiming while standing and sighting while down in the stance.

I can sight down a rifle barrel or I can aim down a rifle barrel, all the same.

Agreed, but I think shooting pool is very different from shooting a gun.

Where is "just see the shot?"

I think that works for many people, but some (if not many) people still aim before they sight, IMO.

Regards,
Dave

 

[Joe T]

That seems like a large head shift or turn to me when I try it. Do you do this because it helps you see the line better? Maybe by turning your head, you turn the inside eye away from the line so much that the outside eye can see the line better? I accomplish this by using the inside eye with a more subtle head shift, and temporarily close the outside eye to give the inside eye a better look at the line. Do you see other benefits to using the outside eye instead? Also, are you turning your head to bring the outside eye into the line or mostly shifting your head and/or body sideways?

Thanks,
Dave

I know I do it to reduce the parallax effect of falling on a cut shot, who wants to see like 4 edges right.
I also do it with the stick angled on the same line as the outside eye to the shot and then pivot both back out together so its not like a shift cuz they go together. I think you can see me do this on one of me videos, the Colin workout on the long far away cuts, hey where is Colin?.
I think I may prefer the outside eye because the vision of that eye would be angled in towards the ob rather than away from it, not saying the other way doesn't work.

 

[dr_dave]

I know I do it to reduce the parallax effect of falling on a cut shot, who wants to see like 4 edges right.
I also do it with the stick angled on the same line as the outside eye to the shot and then pivot both back out together so its not like a shift cuz they go together. I think you can see me do this on one of me videos, the Colin workout on the long far away cuts,

If it's not too much trouble, could you provide a link to the video and a time stamp? I'd like to see what you are describing.

hey where is Colin?.

He posted a message on one of the monster aiming threads a couple of weeks ago, so he still lurks periodically; but it sounds like he is too busy (and maybe too sane) to spend lots of time on AZB.

I think I may prefer the outside eye because the vision of that eye would be angled in towards the ob rather than away from it, not saying the other way doesn't work.

That makes sense. Thank you for your posts. It is refreshing to see a respected instructor and player actually contribute insight and discussion on AZB. I appreciate your contributions.

Regards,
Dave

PS: Did you ever follow-up with Nick at BD about becoming an instructional columnist? You would be a great addition to the magazine. If there's anything I can do to help, please let me know (by PM or e-mail).

 

[dr_dave]

Sighting down the cue is an absolute necessity. While there are plenty of aiming systems, in the end, you have to know where you are sending the cue ball. And the best way to know where the cue ball is going to go, is to see where the cue is going to be going, reletive to the cue ball.

Steve,

Thanks again for contributing. You, Joe, and Scott always seem willing to share your ideas, opinions, and insights. I'm sure many people appreciate you guys for this, being respected instructors.

Regards,
Dave

 

[Joe T]

If it's not too much trouble, could you provide a link to the video and a time stamp? I'd like to see what you are describing.

He posted a message on one of the monster aiming threads a couple of weeks ago, so he still lurks periodically; but it sounds like he is too busy (and maybe too sane) to spend lots of time on AZB.

That makes sense. Thank you for your posts. It is refreshing to see a respected instructor and player actually contribute insight and discussion on AZB. I appreciate your contributions.

Regards,
Dave

PS: Did you ever follow-up with Nick at BD about becoming an instructional columnist? You would be a great addition to the magazine. If there's anything I can do to help, please let me know (by PM or e-mail).

youtube down for maintenance will post later.
You're welcome, don't have much time either but can't resist sometimes. You do a pretty sporty job of posting yourself.
Talked with Nick and if he adds someone I'm in the running, not sure if I want another hat to wear right now anyways. Maybe after I get a more consistent golf swing?