U.S. Open payouts

In Canada we don't pay tax on winnings and that goes for everything we win, like loto, bowling, pool, darts etc...

If you claim your winnings in US, can you claim expense etc. I got some info from Jay the other day and have no idea how it works yet.

As a Canadian winning money, the US gov can take 30% taxes from me on winnings there? Whill the tax number get this all back or the TD doesn't take out the money?

The problem or reason as I understand Canada doesn't tax winnings are. People would start claiming the cost of losing... tickets, gas etc. Same with pool tournaments, I could deduct gas, entry, room, time playing, cue, case, chalk, glove, towel, pool table, balls depreciation etc, also, we can deduct for home office space/renovation. Are you able to claim all this since you are taxed?
 
Jason Robichaud said:
In Canada we don't pay tax on winnings and that goes for everything we win, like loto, bowling, pool, darts etc...

If you claim your winnings in US, can you claim expense etc. I got some info from Jay the other day and have no idea how it works yet.

As a Canadian winning money, the US gov can take 30% taxes from me on winnings there? Whill the tax number get this all back or the TD doesn't take out the money?

The problem or reason as I understand Canada doesn't tax winnings are. People would start claiming the cost of losing... tickets, gas etc. Same with pool tournaments, I could deduct gas, entry, room, time playing, cue, case, chalk, glove, towel, pool table, balls depreciation etc, also, we can deduct for home office space/renovation. Are you able to claim all this since you are taxed?
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Im not an accountant but I believe most of those things could be deducted against winnings. If you tried to deduct it against income earned on your real job, you'd probably get audited quick but i couldnt tell you the tax reason why. They'd probably tell you pool was just a hobby for you (cause you didnt earn anything) and therefore not deductible.
 
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Nostroke said:
Im not an accountant but I believe most of those things could be deducted against winnings. If you tried to deduct it against income earned on your real job, you'd probably get audited quick.
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Well, I'm sure most pro players would have way more expense than revenue, wonder how this works?
 
Jason Robichaud said:
In Canada we don't pay tax on winnings and that goes for everything we win, like loto, bowling, pool, darts etc...

If you claim your winnings in US, can you claim expense etc. I got some info from Jay the other day and have no idea how it works yet.

As a Canadian winning money, the US gov can take 30% taxes from me on winnings there? Whill the tax number get this all back or the TD doesn't take out the money?

The problem or reason as I understand Canada doesn't tax winnings are. People would start claiming the cost of losing... tickets, gas etc. Same with pool tournaments, I could deduct gas, entry, room, time playing, cue, case, chalk, glove, towel, pool table, balls depreciation etc, also, we can deduct for home office space/renovation. Are you able to claim all this since you are taxed?
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I cashed $2000 in a tournament in the US, they had me fill out a form and then nothing was deducted from the winnings and I was paid in cash. Not sure how this works. I also won $1000 on a slot machine and got paid the full amount also.
 
you can claim losses up to the amount of the 1099's you get for winnings. I got a 1099 for a poker tourney a few years back and I just claimed blackjack losses against it. Pretty simple.
 
Nostroke said:
I understand Savers and the tax implications just fine. There was only one thing i was unclear on which has now been cleared up.

I would advise anyone having a real good year who is making a substantial saver, to try to do it "Jays Way", i.e with the TD involved to avoid the negative tax ramifications. Most of the time, it would make no difference, as once travel, hotel etc has been deducted, there is no significant tax liability for pool players but this year in Mika's case, there surely will be.
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Nostroke, what you write makes perfect sense to me. :)

In an ideal world, that is the advice all players should heed. :wink:

In the heat of the battle, though, when the negotiations are being made about the infamous "saver," the tax implications are the furthest thing from anyone's mind. :grin-square:
 
D_Lewis said:
I cashed $2000 in a tournament in the US, they had me fill out a form and then nothing was deducted from the winnings and I was paid in cash. Not sure how this works. I also won $1000 on a slot machine and got paid the full amount also.
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I would like to learn more about this topic.

I had a couple gals freelance for me who live in Canada this year.

I would like to work more with them. However, I am unclear about the tax implications.

I went to the USA IRS website, and it is confusing.

From what I gather, I do not give them a 1099. Does that mean I can still claim it?

Furthermore, I saw some mumbo jumbo on the IRS website about Canadian papers to be filed and filled out. It's too much for me to comprehend.

Here's a snippet of what I found out online:

You have to get them to withdraw it (which is quite complicated, they have to explain the situation to the IRS), give them a completed Form 8233 and have them issue 1042-S instead, then they have to give a completed 1042 to the IRS at the end of the year which lists all the payments on 1042-S they gave you. IRS publication 515 explains to employers how to do this.

Form 8233 (which informs them of your tax treaty claim) is absolutely essential else they have to do 30% non-resident alien tax withholding.

Phone the non-resident dept. of the IRS in PA for information on completing Form 8233 as it is open-ended and you will not be able to complete it without help - you have to specifically state which part of the tax treaty you are claiming under and why you qualify under it.

You will also have to complete a Form 1040NR and an 8840 at tax time (in addition to all the Canadian tax forms). On your T1 you will need to claim a foreign tax credit for the tax you paid in the US, so you don't get taxed twice. However you will have to pay a little bit of tax on top of the US tax because our rates are higher.

However if you ever move your tax home to the US and carry on working in Canada your tax situation will get very complex indeed so at least from a paperwork standpoint you're better off doing it the way I've just described. If you move your tax home to the US you run into problems with the CRA, because they won't believe that a Canadian working in Canada for any length of time is a non-resident taxpayer.
 
corvette1340 said:
you can claim losses up to the amount of the 1099's you get for winnings. I got a 1099 for a poker tourney a few years back and I just claimed blackjack losses against it. Pretty simple.
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That is correct for GAMBLING Winnings but I dont think Pool tournament winnings are considered gambling winnings. Maybe Poker tournament winnings are not either-don't know.
 
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JAM said:
Nostroke, what you write makes perfect sense to me. :)

In an ideal world, that is the advice all players should heed. :wink:

In the heat of the battle, though, when the negotiations are being made about the infamous "saver," the tax implications are the furthest thing from anyone's mind. :grin-square:
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Im glad someone understands me.:wink:
 
D_Lewis said:
I cashed $2000 in a tournament in the US, they had me fill out a form and then nothing was deducted from the winnings and I was paid in cash. Not sure how this works. I also won $1000 on a slot machine and got paid the full amount also.
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I haven't played many events in the states. $1200 was the most and they just paid cash. I want to play in more events and in case I win more than $1200 I want to find out the standard practice.
 
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Jason Robichaud said:
I haven't played many events in the states. $1200 was the most and they just paid cash. I want to play in more events and incase I win more than $1200 I want to find out the standard practice.
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It was for the APA singles in Las Vegas, they had a form and just had me fill it out before the tournament even started. Maybe they made a mistake when they paid me out in cash but I also know another guy who finished higher than I did and was paid $9000 by cheque without any deductions.
 
Nostroke said:
That is correct for GAMBLING Winnings but I dont think Pool tournament winnings are considered gambling winnings. Maybe Poker tournament winnings are not either-don't know.
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a friend of mine won a big pool tourney in Minnesota several years back and claimed blackjack losses against his pool winnings which was like 5 or 6 thousand. He did this after talking to a tax pro so I'm pretty sure it was legit. In my case, I didn't talk to anyone and just counted the losses off on my own, lol.

If that poker tourney is all I have to worry about when it comes to tax write offs then I'm doing good.
 
corvette1340 said:
a friend of mine won a big pool tourney in Minnesota several years back and claimed blackjack losses against his pool winnings which was like 5 or 6 thousand. He did this after talking to a tax pro so I'm pretty sure it was legit. In my case, I didn't talk to anyone and just counted the losses off on my own, lol.
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That surprises me.
 
Jason Robichaud said:
In Canada we don't pay tax on winnings and that goes for everything we win, like loto, bowling, pool, darts etc...

If you claim your winnings in US, can you claim expense etc. I got some info from Jay the other day and have no idea how it works yet.

As a Canadian winning money, the US gov can take 30% taxes from me on winnings there? Whill the tax number get this all back or the TD doesn't take out the money?

The problem or reason as I understand Canada doesn't tax winnings are. People would start claiming the cost of losing... tickets, gas etc. Same with pool tournaments, I could deduct gas, entry, room, time playing, cue, case, chalk, glove, towel, pool table, balls depreciation etc, also, we can deduct for home office space/renovation. Are you able to claim all this since you are taxed?
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If you have a Federal Tax ID number it is the same as having a Social Security number and the promoter/tournament director CANNOT take the 30% out of your winnings. You will get paid in full just like a U.S. citizen. You are then required to file a U.S. income tax return before the next April 15th deadline and pay any applicable taxes. Of course, expenses are fully deductible.

If you fail to file a return, you can find yourself having problems entering the United States. The IRS has long arms and they reach everywhere!
 
jay helfert said:
If you have a Federal Tax ID number it is the same as having a Social Security number and the promoter/tournament director CANNOT take the 30% out of your winnings. You will get paid in full just like a U.S. citizen. You are then required to file a U.S. income tax return before the next April 15th deadline and pay any applicable taxes. Of course, expenses are fully deductible.

If you fail to file a return, you can find yourself having problems entering the United States. The IRS has long arms and they reach everywhere!
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ok thanks Jay. I think there is another form I can file to get all money tax free. I will have to check
 
Jason Robichaud said:
ok thanks Jay. I think there is another form I can file to get all money tax free. I will have to check
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That would be the smoke and mirrors form.

Seriously-You may get some tournament money without deductions for taxes but that means nothing as far as your tax liability. That is determined at year end by the amount of money you earned in the US that year. If it over 20K or so and you dont have offsetting deductions, you are going to owe. There is also a minimum amout over which you must file a tax return. It used to be $7500 I believe but that could have changed.
 
JAM said:
I remember one year a well-known player at an unnamed tournament won the whole shebang. :)

Meanwhile, he was getting staked to play in the tournament. He also made savers with three different players along the path up the tournament chart. He ended up winning the tournament, and after the cheese was cut up, it was HIM who pocketed 10 percent of the first-place tournament payout. LOL

As soon as he won, he was surrounded by four guys that never left his side until the TD paid him. It was kind of funny to watch. :grin-square:
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So this is how tournament payouts go. I guess a smaller piece of a big payout is better no piece of a big payout. I doubt the payouts in big tournaments will ever get any better due to the lack of big sponsors. The closest the men got to good money was when RJ Reynolds sponsored the (PBT) Camel tour and the top man of the PBT decided to sue RJ Reynolds which spelled the end of the big sponsors.......

James
 
I have to fill out a 1040NR form. I do have to track expenses etc and that is deducted as refund.

Something that was interesting, money are not deducted from people from some countries (taxes are not deducted from winnings because of a treaty) Austria, Czech Republic, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Hungary, Ireland, Italy, Japan, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Russian Federation, Slovak Republic, Slovenia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Tunisia, Turkey, Ukraine, and the United Kingdom. Mika would be winning tax free
 
D_Lewis said:
I cashed $2000 in a tournament in the US, they had me fill out a form and then nothing was deducted from the winnings and I was paid in cash. Not sure how this works. I also won $1000 on a slot machine and got paid the full amount also.
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not singling you out at all, but so all know, if the shite hit the fan, and you have tax problems, they can use stuff posted in forums against you. i would never post anything like "i won 5k and never paid taxes on it." perhaps i worry too much, but just food for thought.
 
enzo said:
not singling you out at all, but so all know, if the shite hit the fan, and you have tax problems, they can use stuff posted in forums against you. i would never post anything like "i won 5k and never paid taxes on it." perhaps i worry too much, but just food for thought.
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I am starting to think we can win up to 10,000 in a year before not getting a complete refund. Still trying to find the exact amount.
 
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