Question on cost of table transfer and setup

How do you offend a customer by explaining part of the process and then giving them a discount if they want to help a little. Thats ridiculous!

I have supported my family for more than 10 years doing tables, I never said I was rich. Yet another assumption.

So just to be clear QE- you have never asked any of your customers to lend a hand at any time?
 
Last edited:
I personally do not accept help from customers. They may have good intentions and some may want to save a buck, but it is my ass on the line. I do not want to get hurt carrying slate with someone who can't keep a grip. When you work with someone for a long period of time you don't even have to talk to each other. You just know what the other is going to do.

As for customers doing our work. Not to long ago my wife asked me to fix the toilet. She said "It can't be that hard to fix" I responded with "If everyone said that about pool tables we wouldn't have a toilet to fix." It is simple The plumber fixes my toilet, I fix the plumbers pool table. Isn't that what stimulates the economy?

A semi-mechanical customer can easily move a table with help from friends. When the table is at the house, I will be happy to set it up. But I would much rather make the extra $$$ with the move.
 
today, 2 jobs scheduled with the minor assistance of the homeowner, no problems and happy to give a hand. My belief is that people when given the chance like to help. They like it more when you ask versus not. Everyone can do what they want but others should not say to others they are wrong just because they do it their way.

I have no issues with someone giving me a hand, if there strong enough to carry slate fine. Many times I even let the kids bring in little parts. They love it, also many times the parents make the kids help me, its nice to see people not stressing over BS like this. Really you guys may be missing out on some real fun. SO I guess every guy in here doesn't do what I do, thats good, real good, I like that!

NO offense, a fence to anyone.


YES, OTLB accepts help, also I accept food, coffee and tips and sometimes I get something special


In fact, I expect coffee or drink,, why do you think that is?
 
Last edited:
OTLB said:
today, 2 jobs scheduled with the minor assistance of the homeowner, no problems and happy to give a hand. My belief is that people when given the chance like to help. They like it more when you ask versus not. Everyone can do what they want but others should not say to others they are wrong just because they do it their way.

I have no issues with someone giving me a hand, if there strong enough to carry slate fine. Many times I even let the kids bring in little parts. They love it, also many times the parents make the kids help me, its nice to see people not stressing over BS like this. Really you guys may be missing out on some real fun. SO I guess every guy in here doesn't do what I do, thats good, real good, I like that!

NO offense, a fence to anyone.


YES, OTLB accepts help, also I accept food, coffee and tips and sometimes I get something special


In fact, I expect coffee or drink,, why do you think that is?
Click to expand...

John,
I let children be helpers too. But I draw a line at some point. One thing I do which people seem to like is explain exactly what we are doing and why it is beneficial in making their table play the best it can. I let them know I don't mind spectators or questions. It is almost like we put on a show for them. This really goes along way for customer relations.

As for letting a big strong looking guy help me. Looks don't mean a thing. I've had monsters who couldn't carry slate upstairs for s#*t. I trust my guy Oscar and he trust me. We can agree to disagree and I'll buy your first beer at SBE!
 
OTLB said:
today, 2 jobs scheduled with the minor assistance of the homeowner, no problems and happy to give a hand. My belief is that people when given the chance like to help. They like it more when you ask versus not. Everyone can do what they want but others should not say to others they are wrong just because they do it their way.

I have no issues with someone giving me a hand, if there strong enough to carry slate fine. Many times I even let the kids bring in little parts. They love it, also many times the parents make the kids help me, its nice to see people not stressing over BS like this. Really you guys may be missing out on some real fun. SO I guess every guy in here doesn't do what I do, thats good, real good, I like that!

NO offense, a fence to anyone.



YES, OTLB accepts help, also I accept food, coffee and tips and sometimes I get something special


In fact, I expect coffee or drink,, why do you think that is?
Click to expand...

John,

If this strategy works for you thats great! My experience with getting the customer involved with the hands on operations has not worked out very well and I therefore "TRY" to avoid it. It sounds like you've got it mastered
so "thats good, real good" and I'm happy for you! Could you now be happy for me, not wanting the customer to "help"?

Did you ever see the sign... Labor rate...$60 per hour.
If you help..$75 per hour.
Already started...$90 per hour...LOL:grin-square:

You expect coffee because you didn't bring your own. I accept coffee but don't expect it, or anything else that's not offered freely, including help.

Jay
 
OTLB said:
How do you offend a customer by explaining part of the process and then giving them a discount if they want to help a little. Thats ridiculous!

So just to be clear QE- you have never asked any of your customers to lend a hand at any time?
Click to expand...

Let me see, if I call someone to get a quote on replacing the tile in my bathroom, and the guy says, "well, I'd suggest that you tear up the old tile yourself, and then when I'm done you can grout it yourself... those things are pretty easy and you'll save some money", I would be offended.

First of all, I'm offended because he didn't give me what I asked for, which was a quote for taking my bathroom from status quo to new tile, period.

Second of all, I'd be offended because if I want to save money, I will be the person who decides when, where and how I will do so.

Am I above asking my customers to "lend a hand"? Of course not. Sometimes I'll ask them to slide a shim under a leg while I lift the table.

And yes, when I give a quote for moving and a customer says it's way more than they have to pay, I tell them that transporting the table themselves and hiring me for the assembly is an option. One thing I have not and will not EVER do is move a table WITH the customer. It's a liability nightmare.

What I don't do is employ them (or their children) as laborers.
 
John, definitely understand where you're coming from. I have to agree with Pat's contributions on this one though.

The main thing to me (I can't believe no one has mentioned it) is this: I am insured and experienced. I'll also welcome people to move their own table, but the option I give them is to let them know that if THEY drop a piece of slate while moving it, they are replacing it. If I drop a piece of slate while moving it, I replace the slate. 99% of the time, I get paid to move the table. I don't do it just to be able to charge more, but the majority of people see the value in letting me do it.

Beside that, you guys all know as well as I do, if you haven't moved slate before, it WILL be heavier than you expect. We did a job for a family whose high school son was a competitive power lifter. The table was an 8' unbacked, 3/4" slate, 3-piece. Being a bit of a smartass, I picked up a piece myself and my helper followed suit. I told the kid to have at it if he wanted, but if he drops it, he pays for it. We got our pieces in the house and on the table and got to the van and the power lifter had not gotten past the back of the van. LOL It WILL catch you off guard, I don't care how strong you are.

Like you, I do try to save my customers wherever I can and feel it appropriate. If I'm moving a table, I always ask about a recover while it's apart to save them money vs. calling me to recover it another time and paying a separate trip.

I always tell my customers that if they need any accessories, I'll give them a good price and in most cases offer to pay shipping and drop-shipping fees. I like repeat business and I like people to know that I'm willing to help them where I can.

It's all about doing the right thing for your customers. I don't disagree with quoting them both prices, but I feel like if you don't mention insurance, you're not allowing them to make an educated decision.
 
Its good to let children help!


There have been hundreds if not thousands of times when a customer has offered their assistance to me and I have told them no thanks for various reasons. ON the other side there are times I do. Knowing when to ask and when not to is a skill that I have and use it. Hopefully you all know the right questions to ask but maybe you don't or don't take the time to ask.

Drawing the line is of course different for everyone.

But now that this has been identified as an issue I want all of you, all to remember it veary clearly in the future when you need a hand here or there. Remember you never ask the customer to give a quick hand etc. BS. Totally blown out of proportion as usual with my own threads.

Since, sense, cents, it may not be clear to you now perhaps it will be in the future. Our country was built on the way I think I do business. If I have an opportunity to save my customer some cash and still make good money, feel like there is no exposure for me, I'm going to ask for a hand all day long when appropriate. If you know me, you know I would never put a table or person at any risk period but its obvious that nobody in here really knows me, thats a fact. And I know alot of you don't want to, guess what? I don't care.

One job about 4 months ago a small boy about 12 asked me if he could help. I said I was all set. He looked dejected. He then told me how he was saving money to buy his parents Christmas gifts. In went the pliers in his hands. Thats how I do business.

All I can say is this:

I don't like to twist things around, like to keep it simple. Been in business and know yes know when to get help, and when not to. IF you know that your all set in business and in life.

Last week I went to recover a GC for a 72 year old man. That guy offered and he was pulling staples. Then of course after he made me coffee and then made me 2 cheesburgers for lunch. Yes I often get fed etc and the reason is I have gone out of my God Damn way for my customer. They see it and respond the same to me. I love it! If your not getting treated well by your customers this way, why is that????????????


If you think that people can't appreciate or get offended by being explained things, saving money, you should look for a steady paycheck job.

I often send people links to my threads here also. Their comments are really the ones that even keep me posting. I let them be the judge, certainly not anyone in the forum, no offense. My customer, thats all I care about. Their in good hands and have nothing to worry about.

So bla bla bla bla. Just remember if you say you don't get help don't counter yourself or at least remember who called you out on it. Me.

You let them help with this or that but not that or this. Again knowing when to ask for a hand is the key. I can only think of one time when I ever had a customer help me with slate up stairs and think I helped him more as he was an animal. I think he could have done it by himself but wanted him to be safe so I helped.
 
Last edited:
OTLB, like I said earlier, we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

I know you're a damn good mechanic. But on top of that you need to be a good business person. I learned a long time ago that you give the customer's what they ask for, not what you THINK they want.
 
QuickEdward said:
OTLB, like I said earlier, we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

I know you're a damn good mechanic. But on top of that you need to be a good business person. I learned a long time ago that you give the customer's what they ask for, not what you THINK they want.
Click to expand...

So now your saying I'm not a good business person?

When it comes to pool tables I will tell the customer what they want, especially when I know they don't.

So we disagree on that also, thats fine.

fyi, you mentioned that you asked for help from a customer to place a shim under the leg or something, YIKES what happened if they got their finger squished? Plus-there is no need to ever help with that aspect of the job if you have the right tools and are following the proper methods.

Really, no offense but my track record in business speaks for itself on my resume and in my bank account. I do take offense by you suggesting otherwise.
 
Last edited:
OTLB said:
Really, no offense but my track record in business speaks for itself on my resume and in my bank account. I do take offense by you suggesting otherwise.
Click to expand...

If you want to be offended, then be offended. I stand by my opinion that telling a customer that they should do something they've asked YOU to quote is a poor business tactic, as is employing them as manual labor.

The fact that you make money, or that people give you cheeseburgers doesn't mean anything. Lots of people in this world make money. Obama makes 400k a year. That doesn't mean he's doing a good job.
 
QuickEdward said:
If you want to be offended, then be offended. I stand by my opinion that telling a customer that they should do something they've asked YOU to quote is a poor business tactic, as is employing them as manual labor.

The fact that you make money, or that people give you cheeseburgers doesn't mean anything. Lots of people in this world make money. Obama makes 400k a year. That doesn't mean he's doing a good job.
Click to expand...

Didn't want to be offended, you offended me clearly by your comments by saying if I wanted to be a "good business person".

The mere fact that a customer does cook for me, give me tips, make me coffee and treats, invites me back for parties and more, means everything. Hard for you to understand that I guess.

If you want to banter with me get it right. Where did I ever "tell" or say that when a customer calls that I "tell" them they have to help me as a requirement? only review the job and decide at that point what the options and or opportunities are. My customers clearly, clearly appreciate the fact that I give them options. Its also clear yours don't. You can stand where you want but your going to be standing in the same spot while I'm out working the old fashioned way.

Thank you for comparing me to The President of the United States!
 
Comparing me to any man that has or had the hardest job in the world is a compliment and I will take it.

You now clearly indicate that you said it as an insult and I figured you did. Getting a point across to you is almost as hard as being President.

Since your being so friendly with me and now want to say negative things about the President of the United States of America, go for it!

Hope all your customers see how you feel about The President and remember half of them voted for him so not only have you just offended me again, you offended them as well.

You want to be a good business person, I'll give you some good advice. You shouldn't say bad things about someone who is trying to lead our country out of trouble as it doesn't help him or us. Thought you were smarter than that.

Now if half of your customers see your comment you just lost half your business. So, yeap, I'm right again.
 
Time to take this thread to NPR-:wink:

Since it's been alot of posts since the original poster has been around, I'm going to assume that he's been taken care of, or has called Donny since that's in his area anyway-

I don't care who voted for who, or whom, or whatever, I care about if their table's been done correctly, if it plays better than when I got there, and if there is a way to do my job better as I go.
NO matter how I feel about who is in the white house, if they want their table fixed, I'll do theirs too- simple.
Customer service and ability. Good business practices and reputation can only come about after you've excelled at the first two.
After that you're on your own.
And for the record, I rarely let a customer do any kind of lifting, carrying, or anything else.
For the most part, there's a reason I was called to come do the job, and it wasn't because they wanted help doing it-
But occasionally there are those exceptions, and you know when they are-
Gotta get back to work, have fun fellas!
 
OTLB said:
Comparing me to any man that has or had the hardest job in the world is a compliment and I will take it.

You now clearly indicate that you said it as an insult and I figured you did. Getting a point across to you is almost as hard as being President.

Since your being so friendly with me and now want to say negative things about the President of the United States of America, go for it!

Hope all your customers see how you feel about The President and remember half of them voted for him so not only have you just offended me again, you offended them as well.

You want to be a good business person, I'll give you some good advice. You shouldn't say bad things about someone who is trying to lead our country out of trouble as it doesn't help him or us. Thought you were smarter than that.

Now if half of your customers see your comment you just lost half your business. So, yeap, I'm right again.
Click to expand...

Of course you're right. One only need look at your posts to see that you're never wrong. You're the best business man and table mechanic in the universe.
 
OTLB said:
another compliment thank you, what billiard company do you own or work for?
Click to expand...

A legitimate one.

  • One with insurance - that requires we do the job for the customer, not with the customer.
  • One that sends a full crew out to do the job.
  • One that doesn't suggest that the customers do the job themselves.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top