Which company makes the best table?
Brunswick?
Olhausen?
Diamond?
Home use, 4 1/2 x 9' competition
Brunswick?
Olhausen?
Diamond?
Home use, 4 1/2 x 9' competition
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Better Table?
- Thread starter Runnintable
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In what regards isn't your answer going to be Diamond?
Absolutely depends on use
I'm not a table mechanic.
You're going to get different answers on this, but here's my take.
For brand new for commercial, I would go with Diamond (commercial series). They look better, you can get a one piece slate, and a quality commercial table retails for about 60% of a Brunswick Gold Crown - which looks a little dated to me). If you're going to buy a gold crown, I'd go with a used GCIII.
For brand new for home use, I like Olhausen (middle to high end tables only, none of the laminate or veneers). You also can't go wrong with a new (or slightly used commercial Diamond series). The Olhausen's can match any decor, the commerical Diamonds usually need to be in a man cave/garage. I guess it depends on if there is women who chooses such things as in my house, which is why I have Gold Simonis 860 cloth and not Tournament Blue).
For used (Antique) I love Brunswick's, especially 9 footers. My current table is a 9ft 1920's Brunswick Madison I picked up for $300 from a closed room and refinished (not restored, left all the cigarette burn marks for character): http://www.brunswickbilliards.com/our_rich_history/antique_tables/madison.html.
For 7ft. Bar sized/Coin-ops - most people rate Valley one piece slate tables the best. I guess Brunswick would also be a good choice, but probably a little more pricey.
So, the question, really is relative and very personal. If you can answer the following, you'll get specific experiences and recommendations from eveyone:
1 - Price Range?
2 - Home / Commercial use?
3 - Size of table (6, 7, 8, 8 pro, 9)...Ok, no one considers a 6 ft table a pool table, but some small bars have them.
4 - New / Used?
5 - Importance of quality of wood, playability and ability to match decor.
Or are you just taking a general poll on what everyone's favourite brand's are? I'm very partial to Diamonds (new), Brunswick (Antique), and Olhausen (new, hard wood furniture quality).
There are other quality tables out there that I'm not familiar with. Maybe someone else can weigh in here.
Diamond makes home use tables, I have no experience with them. Can anyone provide info on Diamond's home tables?
I'm not a table mechanic.
You're going to get different answers on this, but here's my take.
For brand new for commercial, I would go with Diamond (commercial series). They look better, you can get a one piece slate, and a quality commercial table retails for about 60% of a Brunswick Gold Crown - which looks a little dated to me). If you're going to buy a gold crown, I'd go with a used GCIII.
For brand new for home use, I like Olhausen (middle to high end tables only, none of the laminate or veneers). You also can't go wrong with a new (or slightly used commercial Diamond series). The Olhausen's can match any decor, the commerical Diamonds usually need to be in a man cave/garage. I guess it depends on if there is women who chooses such things as in my house, which is why I have Gold Simonis 860 cloth and not Tournament Blue).
For used (Antique) I love Brunswick's, especially 9 footers. My current table is a 9ft 1920's Brunswick Madison I picked up for $300 from a closed room and refinished (not restored, left all the cigarette burn marks for character): http://www.brunswickbilliards.com/our_rich_history/antique_tables/madison.html.
For 7ft. Bar sized/Coin-ops - most people rate Valley one piece slate tables the best. I guess Brunswick would also be a good choice, but probably a little more pricey.
So, the question, really is relative and very personal. If you can answer the following, you'll get specific experiences and recommendations from eveyone:
1 - Price Range?
2 - Home / Commercial use?
3 - Size of table (6, 7, 8, 8 pro, 9)...Ok, no one considers a 6 ft table a pool table, but some small bars have them.
4 - New / Used?
5 - Importance of quality of wood, playability and ability to match decor.
Or are you just taking a general poll on what everyone's favourite brand's are? I'm very partial to Diamonds (new), Brunswick (Antique), and Olhausen (new, hard wood furniture quality).
There are other quality tables out there that I'm not familiar with. Maybe someone else can weigh in here.
Diamond makes home use tables, I have no experience with them. Can anyone provide info on Diamond's home tables?
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Diamond home tables are impressive. Thick, heavy frame, brazilian slate, great playing rails and pockets, premium quality wood. All the home tables are made by one guy. Every little part has a serial number. They use minwax finish so if you need to match any furniture or touchup's just go to Home Depot. The manufacturers focus is on playability not decor, there not going to look as nice as the brunswick or olhausen. But there's no comparsion in playability or construction.
DIAMOND hands down! tight pockets, simonis cloth, lively rails, and the cocobolo looks awesome!!
No love for Cooper tables?
Diamond, made in California.
Diamond, made in California.
More important, who's setting it up?:thumbup2:
Not a mechanic, but I would rank them like this:
Diamond
Brunswick
Olhausen
The Brunswick is a really good table, but I can't think of one single area where it is better than the Diamond, yet the Diamond has features superior to the Brunswick.
If you have the choice, Diamond is the better choice. The only criteria I could think of which would make someone want the Brunswick are the aesthetics of the table. They don't like how the Diamond looks. If they said the Brunswick plays better or is more consistent or higher quality or whatever, they'd have no basis for those opinions.
But, value is in the eye of the beholder. To each his own, and it's your $$$$ to spend.
Diamond
Brunswick
Olhausen
The Brunswick is a really good table, but I can't think of one single area where it is better than the Diamond, yet the Diamond has features superior to the Brunswick.
If you have the choice, Diamond is the better choice. The only criteria I could think of which would make someone want the Brunswick are the aesthetics of the table. They don't like how the Diamond looks. If they said the Brunswick plays better or is more consistent or higher quality or whatever, they'd have no basis for those opinions.
But, value is in the eye of the beholder. To each his own, and it's your $$$$ to spend.
details to question
I am in the market for a Home Table
I am trying to go for a 4 1/2 x 9 ft.
Playability is the #1 factor. Table does not have to be new.
I have played on GC's and have a few opportunities to buy a used one from a few pool halls in my area.
I also have played on Diamond smart table (barbox) in Vegas. Excellent table. Never played on their Commercial Pro-am 4 1/2X9'
I have an Olhausen Dealer near my house called Century Billiards.(NY)
I like their Coronado Table (mission design).
I am in the market for a Home Table
I am trying to go for a 4 1/2 x 9 ft.
Playability is the #1 factor. Table does not have to be new.
I have played on GC's and have a few opportunities to buy a used one from a few pool halls in my area.
I also have played on Diamond smart table (barbox) in Vegas. Excellent table. Never played on their Commercial Pro-am 4 1/2X9'
I have an Olhausen Dealer near my house called Century Billiards.(NY)
I like their Coronado Table (mission design).
If playability is #1 on your list, then that cuts you down to either a Brunswick GC or a Diamond. Diamond does have some used/reconditioned Professionals as well as some tournament used ProAm's available for sale. As far as price goes, a GC in good condition modified to todays playability is going to run you about the same cost as the Diamond....depending on who does the work.
Glen
PS. I can help you with the Diamond should you decide to look in that direction
Diamond Bar Table
Recently played at a pool hall that put in 2 Diamond Bar tables.
So I played a few sets. Corner pockets are definitely tighter than a Valley, which is fine with me. The table had simonis on it.
What concerns me is the rails they definitely were not lively and since the table is NEW cannot blame on age.
Is this similar to the full size Pro-Am table.
I have to say I am used to the Brunswick bumpers and rails.
Recently played at a pool hall that put in 2 Diamond Bar tables.
So I played a few sets. Corner pockets are definitely tighter than a Valley, which is fine with me. The table had simonis on it.
What concerns me is the rails they definitely were not lively and since the table is NEW cannot blame on age.
Is this similar to the full size Pro-Am table.
I have to say I am used to the Brunswick bumpers and rails.
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I would have to ask the history of the Diamond tables and who's worked on them in the past, because that makes a difference as to how a table can play...by the time you get to it to form your first impressions of how a Diamond table plays
Glen
Diamond
Sorry the table I played on was new.
Recently installed within last month, I have no idea who did work.
Pool hall is located in Queens, NY.
Was not a humid day, I played yesterday the 9th of June. Did follow a very humid weekend here though.
Does diamond use same rubber on full size? Pro-Am
I do like the Diamond Tables I am starting to lean their way. The footprint overall is smaller than a GC, which is a plus. I have reservations about the rails and bumpers.
Sorry the table I played on was new.
Recently installed within last month, I have no idea who did work.
Pool hall is located in Queens, NY.
Was not a humid day, I played yesterday the 9th of June. Did follow a very humid weekend here though.
Does diamond use same rubber on full size? Pro-Am
I do like the Diamond Tables I am starting to lean their way. The footprint overall is smaller than a GC, which is a plus. I have reservations about the rails and bumpers.
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Yeah right, that's why I was a little taken back by this new Diamond bar table.
If the full size plays anything like this I dont want it. Question I had was whether anybody knows if manufacturer uses similar rubber on full size.
But like Cobra said could be installation.
Thank you.
to answer your question, yes, the Diamond 9-footers have Artemis Cushions and everything else uses the Diamond Black cushion. If your under the impression that Diamond play slow, that's not the case. Maybe you should ask the players in the main forum.
Diamond bar table
Thank you.
I just played during lunch on a Diamond bar table (new condition).
I got a better impression of the rails and bumpers today.
They are lively, specially the softer the hit. Closer to the pocket gets a little thuddy.
Better you are the better they play. I guess that's why they call them tables for players by players. Table is definitely not for bangers!
Love to play on a full size before I buy though.
Thank you.
I just played during lunch on a Diamond bar table (new condition).
I got a better impression of the rails and bumpers today.
They are lively, specially the softer the hit. Closer to the pocket gets a little thuddy.
Better you are the better they play. I guess that's why they call them tables for players by players. Table is definitely not for bangers!
Love to play on a full size before I buy though.
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If you're used to having to smash the ball on banks to get the angle and action you want, then it will seem odd at first on a Diamond with Artemis cushions. There should be no reason to shoot a bank and get a "thud" ..I assume that refers to hitting a bank with such force as to compress the cushion as far as it will compress, transferring shock into the subrail creating the thud sound.
You can get lots of speed and action with the rebound angle you expect with lower speed.
Too many tables out there have dead or dying rails, wrong cushion height, varying cloth tension on bed and cushions and other factors (worn balls vs. newer)....that crappy conditions become "normal" to many players.
Then they play on a brand new Diamond Pro-Am, with Simonis 860HR, stretched right, Artemis cushions, a nice new set of Aramith Super Pro balls...whole 9 yards and the game all of a sudden is very different. It's a taste of tournament condition table. It's how it should be. But we take what we can get.
A lot of older players who grew up on other tables would complain about the Diamond and it's always, always "the cushions play funny" ...they don't. They are just more efficient.
What a difference new cushions and good cushions can make! I used to be used to fairly dead rails. Having to really pound the ball to get around the table. Up north I played on a properly set up GC with new cushions. What a huge difference. Effortless. I almost felt like it was cheating. It felt odd, like this table isn't as good or legit because it's doing things for me. As if I'm not earning it. The action off the rails was just awesome. You could hit the balls smoother and cleaner with lower speed and get great rebound. Then I played on a brand new Pro-Am 9'..even better. Played fantastic. As good as it gets. You can learn better speed control this way, since you know what you're getting out of the cushions. Predictability.
Took a little to get over that feeling. Spoils you quick. Then, all other conditions are just terrible. It's the table's fault :wink:
Certain position routes that burned into my brain as tough, were 2x easier on a properly set up table. There are just some shots, which are inherently tough, that become extremely low percentage on dead cushions. Not worth attempting. That said, you can do more on a good table. Or do the same, with less effort.
I'm spoiled now. Becoming a table snob. I just can't enjoy pool on a bad table. Ignorance is bliss. :grin-square:
You can get lots of speed and action with the rebound angle you expect with lower speed.
Too many tables out there have dead or dying rails, wrong cushion height, varying cloth tension on bed and cushions and other factors (worn balls vs. newer)....that crappy conditions become "normal" to many players.
Then they play on a brand new Diamond Pro-Am, with Simonis 860HR, stretched right, Artemis cushions, a nice new set of Aramith Super Pro balls...whole 9 yards and the game all of a sudden is very different. It's a taste of tournament condition table. It's how it should be. But we take what we can get.
A lot of older players who grew up on other tables would complain about the Diamond and it's always, always "the cushions play funny" ...they don't. They are just more efficient.
What a difference new cushions and good cushions can make! I used to be used to fairly dead rails. Having to really pound the ball to get around the table. Up north I played on a properly set up GC with new cushions. What a huge difference. Effortless. I almost felt like it was cheating. It felt odd, like this table isn't as good or legit because it's doing things for me. As if I'm not earning it. The action off the rails was just awesome. You could hit the balls smoother and cleaner with lower speed and get great rebound. Then I played on a brand new Pro-Am 9'..even better. Played fantastic. As good as it gets. You can learn better speed control this way, since you know what you're getting out of the cushions. Predictability.
Took a little to get over that feeling. Spoils you quick. Then, all other conditions are just terrible. It's the table's fault :wink:
Certain position routes that burned into my brain as tough, were 2x easier on a properly set up table. There are just some shots, which are inherently tough, that become extremely low percentage on dead cushions. Not worth attempting. That said, you can do more on a good table. Or do the same, with less effort.
I'm spoiled now. Becoming a table snob. I just can't enjoy pool on a bad table. Ignorance is bliss. :grin-square:
could be a loose rail bolt. With the Diamond's I see alot of loose rail bolts, they really need to be torqued down.