Many pool players to return to pool

SUPERSTAR said:
I meant, give it 24 hours for the DSN settings to update for all the sites.
Then they will be down and everyone will be experiencing it.
Not just here and there.
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Ah, you mean DNS, per chance? (Domain Name/Naming System)

Although, if the site were truly shutdown via court order, they'd reconfigure the web service right at the HTTP source (the Apache or IIS servers) that those DNS records point at, so that the displayed web page itself is immediately changed. They wouldn't merely change the DNS records to point somewhere else, when everyone knows 24 hours have to go by before "everyone" sees the change. When Judge Wapner says, "cease operating 'now'," he means "NOW!" :D

-Sean
 
ftp site works

Just spent a couple hours playing poker on FullTilt with no issues. My account there works fine but of course that is an internal account.

I believe that all of the poker games are actually played on ftp sites. The internet won't affect that a whole lot I don't believe. Existing players may be fine until they try to move money around. The real question is whether the criminal charges will stick. If they do then internet poker is dead in the US for all practical purposes.

Of course DC just legalized internet gambling, for DC. Interesting timing to bust the competition . . .

Hu
 
supergreenman said:
This is rediculous, people from around the world used those sites. I really don't think it's the United States place to impose it's morals on the world.

Countries that live in Glass Houses Decorated by Vegas lights shouldn't throw stones.
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Deleted original post. Mistake about Vegas being behind this.
 
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Haven't been on in awhile, when I started pokerstars it needed to update my software, after that here's what I got:

ps.jpg

The party is over. :sorry:
 
supergreenman said:
This is rediculous, people from around the world used those sites. I really don't think it's the United States place to impose it's morals on the world.

Countries that live in Glass Houses Decorated by Vegas lights shouldn't throw stones.
Click to expand...

Errm, money laudering, bank fraud. Sounds like organized crime types of things, it is no surprise that poker sites might be a nice way for people to launder money and if the crime that is taking place to create that money "Prostitution, human trafficing, drugs" and the like are taking place in the USA they certainly not only have the right, but an obligation to deal with this.

Money that needs to be laundered is not normally coming from nice places, or are you totally cool with organized crime rings that deal in forcing children into prostitution and feel that no government should go after the illegally gained funds as a way to help stop the acts that create those funds?

Shutting down money laundering avenues is a very important aspect of dealing with organized crime.
 
If they are going to indict the guys at pokerstars it should be for my lost wages and emotional distress. :thumbup: I stopped counting the times my AA lost to Q7, or AK lost to AQ. Yeah, I gotta go there, once it cost me over $40K (final 5 of the $11/rebuys). My KK lost to A-3 when the final board read 333-7-3. Fixed, and obviously greedy, the only thing worse than poker sites is how fixed and greedy the US govt. is.
 
think they are talking about the internal shuffle

Celtic said:
Errm, money laudering, bank fraud. Sounds like organized crime types of things, it is no surprise that poker sites might be a nice way for people to launder money and if the crime that is taking place to create that money "Prostitution, human trafficing, drugs" and the like are taking place in the USA they certainly not only have the right, but an obligation to deal with this.

Money that needs to be laundered is not normally coming from nice places, or are you totally cool with organized crime rings that deal in forcing children into prostitution and feel that no government should go after the illegally gained funds as a way to help stop the acts that create those funds?

Shutting down money laundering avenues is a very important aspect of dealing with organized crime.
Click to expand...

I think the claims of money laundering comes from the internal shuffle, not where the players got their money. Could be wrong but that is the way I understand it. Of course it isn't money laundering when huge corporations use the same type of shuffle to avoid paying billions in taxes and even claim over three billion in tax credits this year in GE's case.

Funny world!

Hu
 
While this sucks for poker sites it is a huge boost for Vegas. I like Las Vegas and I would like to see more crazy hotels that have man made lakes, canals, pirate ship battles, and the like.

If gamblers cannot do it at home any longer then they will be making more trips to Vegas and this will lead to bigger and better stuff to see when I am there.

They are probably going to need ALOT bigger poker rooms in alot of the casinos though because alot of players now like to play the game and now they are going to have to get their fix live in a casino or at home games.
 
The money laundering charge perhaps could be a private bank in St George, Utah, the Sunfirst Bank was being used to process internet poker transactions, the group was looking for 3 or 4 more banks to handle payments.
 
Everyone who was playing on there knew what they were doing were illegal.

I have to say that all the people who thought they were being slick by "bypassing" the system, going to walmart and using prepaid cards, using a specific bank because it allowed deposits, etc. now have to pay up. Word is that the next round will be subpoenas of records to see who was actually breaking the law in the us and the IRS is very interested in this as well as DOJ.

One other possible word is that people involved in this (if they return to the us or if they are in an extradition country will offer up that list of all members and real names/ addresses to do what is called "downward departure" in Fed Courts and make their sentences much lighter. Similar to what govt did with RIAA and MPAA and turning IP addresses into real names, except there were no implications of gross tax evasion with those cases.

Now we get to see weeks of posts from people crying because they lost all their loot on something which they should have never been doing.
 
Since I have spent the last couple hours online reading about what is going on, and also have some personal knowledge about the state of online poker in the United States I thought I would tell my understanding of the current situation.

Since it would be extremely impractical to try to impose a law making it illegal for U.S. Citizens to play poker online, the strategy of the DOJ was to make it illegal for U.S. Financial institutions to do business with Online gaming sites, this was the primary intention of the UIGEA legislation. The result of this legislation if successfully imposed would be that no one would be able to deposit or withdraw thus making playing worthless. To get around this legislation the poker sites utilized a strategy of jumping from one payment processor to another very quickly so that no one could be exposed. They would pay many small companies money to act as an intermediary between the player and the site by disguising payments and cashouts as sales of merchandise of any kind ranging from things like jewelry to golf balls. Most players really had no idea this was going on since they probably pay little attention to the fact that their deposits were to some random company name like RJC enterprises or J&J associates (made up names that resemble some of the many used) and not to "Poker Stars" or "Full Tilt." Similarly checks would come from random company names, in almost all cases a different company name would be on every check. Even if you got more than one check in a week they would often each have a different company name on them. It is this method of payment processing that is the reason for the indictment. It is my understanding that the F.B.I. recently impersonated several of these payment processors to make their case, and also are relying on testimony from some former employees of the poker sites. Even though some people in certain states are able to log in to certain poker sites it is my understanding that within 24 hours it will not be possible for anyone in the U.S. to play real money poker online at Pokerstars, Full Tilt or Ultimate Bet/Absolute. Even if you were able to, it sounds like the assets of these sites have been frozen so you would not be able to get paid even if you won.
 
The players knew exactly what was going on. They knew what they were doing was illegal, why were there so many sites dedicated to how get around the funding issues. That's why you had hundreds of threads about people selling money from one site to another side because funding was so hard to do.


fried rice said:
Since I have spent the last couple hours online reading about what is going on, and also have some personal knowledge about the state of online poker in the United States I thought I would tell my understanding of the current situation.

Since it would be extremely impractical to try to impose a law making it illegal for U.S. Citizens to play poker online, the strategy of the DOJ was to make it illegal for U.S. Financial institutions to do business with Online gaming sites, this was the primary intention of the UIGEA legislation. The result of this legislation if successfully imposed would be that no one would be able to deposit or withdraw thus making playing worthless. To get around this legislation the poker sites utilized a strategy of jumping from one payment processor to another very quickly so that no one could be exposed. They would pay many small companies money to act as an intermediary between the player and the site by disguising payments and cashouts as sales of merchandise of any kind ranging from things like jewelry to golf balls. Most players really had no idea this was going on since they probably pay little attention to the fact that their deposits were to some random company name like RJC enterprises or J&J associates (made up names that resemble some of the many used) and not to "Poker Stars" or "Full Tilt." Similarly checks would come from random company names, in almost all cases a different company name would be on every check. Even if you got more than one check in a week they would often each have a different company name on them. It is this method of payment processing that is the reason for the indictment. It is my understanding that the F.B.I. recently impersonated several of these payment processors to make their case, and also are relying on testimony from some former employees of the poker sites. Even though some people in certain states are able to log in to certain poker sites it is my understanding that within 24 hours it will not be possible for anyone in the U.S. to play real money poker online at Pokerstars, Full Tilt or Ultimate Bet/Absolute. Even if you were able to, it sounds like the assets of these sites have been frozen so you would not be able to get paid even if you won.
Click to expand...
 
u12armresl said:
The players knew exactly what was going on. They knew what they were doing was illegal, why were there so many sites dedicated to how get around the funding issues. That's why you had hundreds of threads about people selling money from one site to another side because funding was so hard to do.
Click to expand...

If a person needs to make a thread on a pool forum in order to deposit money on a poker site, than that person does not know what is really going on or was doing so to hide the fact that they were not playing on their own account. Up until earlier yesterday there were plenty of easy ways to deposit other than player to player transfers. That is not really relevant though because I was only speaking to the average players relative knowledge regarding the methodology of the poker sites to get around the UIGEA legislation. I was not trying to speak to the legality or ethical implications of a person playing online poker, I was only hoping to be informative regarding the facts of the current situation.
 
As of the time of this writing -- 6:30 a.m., Eastern Time -- Poker Stars and Full Tilt are both in full swing.

However, as I perused the sites, there were only European playes playing.

Full Tilt has a letter that comes up explaining the situation.

It looks as if only the American players are affected. I don't get it.

Casinos are loving this right now. :wink:
 
fried rice said:
Since I have spent the last couple hours online reading about what is going on, and also have some personal knowledge about the state of online poker in the United States I thought I would tell my understanding of the current situation.

Since it would be extremely impractical to try to impose a law making it illegal for U.S. Citizens to play poker online, the strategy of the DOJ was to make it illegal for U.S. Financial institutions to do business with Online gaming sites, this was the primary intention of the UIGEA legislation. The result of this legislation if successfully imposed would be that no one would be able to deposit or withdraw thus making playing worthless. To get around this legislation the poker sites utilized a strategy of jumping from one payment processor to another very quickly so that no one could be exposed. They would pay many small companies money to act as an intermediary between the player and the site by disguising payments and cashouts as sales of merchandise of any kind ranging from things like jewelry to golf balls. Most players really had no idea this was going on since they probably pay little attention to the fact that their deposits were to some random company name like RJC enterprises or J&J associates (made up names that resemble some of the many used) and not to "Poker Stars" or "Full Tilt." Similarly checks would come from random company names, in almost all cases a different company name would be on every check. Even if you got more than one check in a week they would often each have a different company name on them. It is this method of payment processing that is the reason for the indictment. It is my understanding that the F.B.I. recently impersonated several of these payment processors to make their case, and also are relying on testimony from some former employees of the poker sites. Even though some people in certain states are able to log in to certain poker sites it is my understanding that within 24 hours it will not be possible for anyone in the U.S. to play real money poker online at Pokerstars, Full Tilt or Ultimate Bet/Absolute. Even if you were able to, it sounds like the assets of these sites have been frozen so you would not be able to get paid even if you won.
Click to expand...

This makes sense. We usually wait until we have $1,000 before we cash in, so that we get the check sent via FedEx for free.

Each time we have received a $1,000 check from Poker Stars, it came from a different bank. A few banks I can remember on the checks came from California, Maryland, Canada, and Arizona. It seems as though Poker Stars keeps moving their banks that pay out. :grin-square:

The checks always cashed, so that was a treat.
 
absolute

JAM said:
As of the time of this writing -- 6:30 a.m., Eastern Time -- Poker Stars and Full Tilt are both in full swing.

However, as I perused the sites, there were only European playes playing.

Full Tilt has a letter that comes up explaining the situation.

It looks as if only the American players are affected. I don't get it.

Casinos are loving this right now. :wink:
Click to expand...

JAM,

I checked my state law, legal for me to play in private. The law is written just like the 2006 Fed law focusing on the gaming providers. I played on Absolute just a few hours ago. WOW was it fishy without the US players! Stayed just long enough to make sure it worked and still did mighty fine. Don't know if I'll get my money out but the account works.

FullTilt has me and I suspect all US players Catch-22ed. As always I can't get on the site without doing an upgrade when they have one. They also won't give me the upgrade, keep saying try later but I'll bet "later" never comes for US players. Been up all night for other reasons and haven't been able to upgrade despite repeated efforts.

Hu
 
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