New case against smoking

[KRJ]

Hmmmm

http://www.smokersclubinc.com/modules.php?file=article&name=News&sid=518

And I would like to see scientific proof secondhand smoke studies showing it does cause damage. From credible sources!!

Ummm, is the Mayo Clinic credible enough source?

Second hand smoke contains thousands of toxic chemicals, including;
Benzene
carbon monoxide
chromium
cyanide
formaldehyde
lead
nickel
polonium

The dangerous particles in second hand smoke can linger in the air for hours. Breathing second hand smoke for a short time can irritate your lungs an reduce the amount of oxygen in your blood. Prolonged or repeated exposure to second hand smoke is all the more danagerous. There is also "third hand " smoke which is the residue that clings to a persons hair, clothing, cushions, carpeting, and other stuff, which poses risks to children.

I'm sure the Mayo Clinic will not deter one "denier" of the damages of second hand smoke, but I have already put those folks in the same group as those that say dinosaurs never existed, man never landed on the moon, and 9/11 was caused by the US government. It must be nice to go through life as an expert on everything but never really learning a damn thing.

 

[justadub]

I wuz wondering when you'd show up, RJ...

(I'm sitting this one out, heh.)

 

[KRJ]

Hmmmm

Absolutely spot on!


....nah that stuff is ok, as long as they don't have to smell any 'icky' smoke. Then a year later its "Gee, why did that bar/poolhall I used to like close down...?"

yeah, all the bars are closing... I haven't seen too many close yet...and the ones that do, of course, the piss poor economy had nothing to do with that... strange how the nice pool rooms with good food, great liquor and good equipment are staying open during the smoking bans in Chicago area.... some have closed do to lack of interest in pool or poor management but nothing to do with a smoking ban in Illinois......

 

[KRJ]

I wuz wondering when you'd show up, RJ...

(I'm sitting this one out, heh.)

I'm back baby !!! Hey Dub.... can't even remember what side of the fence you were on this issue....but I'm board at work and thus said my peace. I'm outta here for good now.... everyone enjoy kicking this dead horse...

 

[Rocky247]

HMMMM Still don't see the SCIENTIFIC PROOF! Mayo is NOT using Emperical Data in a study which the others did and proved the theory of second hand smoke false!! Only smokers.
As for your comment on going thrugh life...Better look in the mirrior before throwing the stones..apparently you can't substantiate(PROVE) that your theory is correct so you just try to discredit the messanger!Nice try!

 

[KRJ]

Hmmmm

That's too bad. I'm sure that if your friend hadn't smoked cigarettes he would have lived forever.

No, he would not have lived for ever, but the guy sitting next too him when he was smoking might have squeaked out another 20 or so years !!

The guy might not have lived in agonizing pain his last few years on earth either...... Yeah, smoking cuts a few years or decades for some off your life expectancy, but those last few years of chemo, radiation, shortness of breath, too weak to really get around, operations, depression, etc. can't be the way anyone wants to check out of here......

Quite sad to see really, and I've only seen it twice now. My mother and my 41 year old sister. Two heavy smokers. My sister had 3 agonizing years before she passed from lung cancer that spread to her brain and spine. Would not wish that on anyone.

 

[Spider1]

yeah, all the bars are closing... I haven't seen too many close yet...and the ones that do, of course, the piss poor economy had nothing to do with that.

16 years of bartending here, and saw bans come down in two states (WA '05, AZ '07), both BEFORE the economy hit the toilet. And we saw tons of closures in both places. In Arizona, we saw more closures in my area in the 1st year after the ban than we have in the 3 after the economy imploded. So what were you saying?

..strange how the nice pool rooms with good food, great liquor and good equipment are staying open during the smoking bans in Chicago area.... some have closed do to lack of interest in pool or poor management but nothing to do with a smoking ban in Illinois......

You'd be surprised. But then, people with an agenda seldom want to hear contrary information. Ask your local bartenders and bar owners. They will give you an earful.

 

[Falcon Eddie]

Ummm, is the Mayo Clinic credible enough source?

Second hand smoke contains thousands of toxic chemicals, including;
Benzene
carbon monoxide
chromium
cyanide
formaldehydelead
nickel
polonium

The dangerous particles in second hand smoke can linger in the air for hours. Breathing second hand smoke for a short time can irritate your lungs an reduce the amount of oxygen in your blood. Prolonged or repeated exposure to second hand smoke is all the more danagerous. There is also "third hand " smoke which is the residue that clings to a persons hair, clothing, cushions, carpeting, and other stuff, which poses risks to childrent.

I'm sure the Mayo Clinic will not deter one "denier" of the damages of second hand smoke, but I have already put those folks in the same group as those that say dinosaurs never existed, man never landed on the moon, and 9/11 was caused by the US government. It must be nice to go through life as an expert on everything but never really learning a damn thing.

Man I was right there with you...but you had to bring up 911..perfect piles of towers falling at the exact same speed. Those nuts and bolts holding everything together just failing (melting ) at the exact same time for that to occur must be billions upon billions to one . Everything else I'm with you.

 

[Spider1]

I think secondhand smoke is bad for you.

But I also think to get into a bar you must be 21 in every state, which makes you (in theory) an adult able to pick which sorts of businesses you frequent, and probably able to turn and walk out of a place you don't like and go find one more to your liking.

Free market, vote with your wallet.

 

[Neil]

................

 

[Falcon Eddie]

No, he would not have lived for ever, but the guy sitting next too him when he was smoking might have squeaked out another 20 or so years !!

The guy might not have lived in agonizing pain his last few years on earth either...... Yeah, smoking cuts a few years or decades for some off your life expectancy, but those last few years of chemo, radiation, shortness of breath, too weak to really get around, operations, depression, etc. can't be the way anyone wants to check out of here......

Quite sad to see really, and I've only seen it twice now. My mother and my 41 year old sister. Two heavy smokers. My sister had 3 agonizing years before she passed from lung cancer that spread to her brain and spine. Would not wish that on anyone.

Sorry for your loss of mother and sister. I was not even going to respond to the moron who posted that.

 

[KRJ]

Hmmm

Man I was right there with you...but you had to bring up 911..perfect piles of towers falling at the exact same speed. Those nuts and bolts holding everything together just failing (melting ) at the exact same time for that to occur must be billions upon billions to one . Everything else I'm with you.

yeah, the govt had the building wired with explosives, but if only they could somehow convince a couple of loony birds to fly into the towers so they could explode it a few hours later.....to make it look like a "terrorist plot".... sorry my friend, the US govt just ain't that smart and/or creative.
The nut and bolts did not fail. The actual steel beams holding each floor failed.

No building was ever built to withstand a few tons of jet fuel burning for over an hour. Once metal weakens, it twist and bends, and then once it fails, thus the weight and material the metal was holding has no where to go but down, and the weight of an entire floor falling on another floor then falling on another one. Just like domino's....but this might need it's own thread....

 

[KRJ]

hmmm

I generally like your posts, but we are on opposite ends on this issue. IF you really want the truth about smoking and smoking bans, the truth is out there, please do some research instead of listening to only one side.

Just to give you an example of how the hospitals pad their data, several years ago I had an overdose of isocyanate. I almost died from it twice. At the hospital, I told them what the problem was, and the doctor said he first had to fill out a survey. The FIRST question he asked me was "Do I smoke?". The second question was "Have I ever been around anyone that smoked?"

Well, it doesn't take a genius to see where that survey was going. I talked to the doc about it, and he agreed that it was all B.S., but they were mandated to point any respiratory problems to smoking. Now, due to that chemical, my lungs are about shot. But, I have no recourse because I smoke. The chemical isn't even listed in any of my health records that I know of! But, smoking is!

No worries Neil. But regardless if they misclassified your illness, it does not dismiss the science behind second hand smoke. It's nasty stuff. I'm not sure the Mayo Clinic would really have an agenda to verify that second hand smoke is dangerous.... they having nothing to gain by saying and verifying it is in fact dangerous. I'm I guessin we are all in agreement that the Mayo Clinic is one of, if not the best, research hospital in the world.

Probably never going to agree, but I have smoker friends who will NOT smoke in the house with their kids and grand kids...even they know. I may not like "smokers" but everyone has the right to choose what to do....just don't infect me in the process.

 

[KRJ]

Hmmmm

You'd be surprised. But then, people with an agenda seldom want to hear contrary information. Ask your local bartenders and bar owners. They will give you an earful.

Ummm yes, talk to them every week where I play pool. Not one team dropped out of our league.... we have 16 teams in one pool hall every Thurdsday when the smoking ban took affect. The ban took affect two years ago. It's a little slower than they want right now but he will tell you point blank folks just are not spending money like they use to. Even though we didn't lose one team to the smoking ban, they are spending a few less bucks due to the economy.

 

[KRJ]

Hmmmm

I think secondhand smoke is bad for you.

But I also think to get into a bar you must be 21 in every state, which makes you (in theory) an adult able to pick which sorts of businesses you frequent, and probably able to turn and walk out of a place you don't like and go find one more to your liking.

Free market, vote with your wallet.

There is also a reason why there is a restroom at the bar too. So I can go do my business in privacy without disturbing the other patrons. Thus, why we have a back door to the outside for smokers, so they can go do their nasty habit in private as well.

It's win win for everyone. Otherwise, next time you are shooting the money ball I might have to drop a deuce in the side pocket !!!

 

[DrGonzo]

Probably never going to agree, but I have smoker friends who will NOT smoke in the house with their kids and grand kids...even they know. I may not like "smokers" but everyone has the right to choose what to do....just don't infect me in the process.

You're right. Everyone SHOULD have the right to choose what to do, however, you want to use government to tell me what I can and can't do. If I want to have a bar where my customers can come and smoke, I should be able to do that...It's my bar, they are adults, and they are using a legal substance. I want people to be able to smoke, people who are their want to smoke, patrons who DONT want to smoke don't have to come to my bar.

What ever happened to the assumption of risk? Should I be able to sue Jack Daniels after I drink my liver away?

 

[Spider1]

You're right. Everyone SHOULD have the right to choose what to do, however, you want to use government to tell me what I can and can't do. If I want to have a bar where my customers can come and smoke, I should be able to do that...It's my bar, they are adults, and they are using a legal substance. I want people to be able to smoke, people who are their want to smoke, patrons who DONT want to smoke don't have to come to my bar.

DING DING DING


Wish I could rep you again.

 

[Spider1]

Ummm yes, talk to them every week where I play pool. Not one team dropped out of our league.... we have 16 teams in one pool hall every Thurdsday when the smoking ban took affect. The ban took affect two years ago. It's a little slower than they want right now but he will tell you point blank folks just are not spending money like they use to. Even though we didn't lose one team to the smoking ban, they are spending a few less bucks due to the economy.

Ok, now ask them about their non-league business.

 

[measureman]

You're right. Everyone SHOULD have the right to choose what to do, however, you want to use government to tell me what I can and can't do. If I want to have a bar where my customers can come and smoke, I should be able to do that...It's my bar, they are adults, and they are using a legal substance. I want people to be able to smoke, people who are their want to smoke, patrons who DONT want to smoke don't have to come to my bar.

What ever happened to the assumption of risk? Should I be able to sue Jack Daniels after I drink my liver away?

This is why I drink Jim Beam Black. That Jack Daniels will kill you.

 

[the420trooper]

Sorry for your loss of mother and sister. I was not even going to respond to the moron who posted that.

OK, genius...I come from a long line of cigarette smokers. Just about every family member that has died during my lifetime has died from lung cancer. So it's not like this subject has no personal relevance to me.

Do I blame tobacco for that? Of course not! Grandma and grandpa knew what they were doing, and they suffered the consequences of their own actions.

In our supposed "land of the free", shouldn't we be free to kill ourselves with unhealthy behaviors if we choose to? If you answer no, then where do we draw the line at how much we're willing to be restricted by the nanny state?

You know, salt is bad for you, too.