I saw a couple plain sneakies posted recently that were nothing "too special" in my eyes(nice wood though) but were listed for damn near a G.....Too rich for my blood...I get what your driving at mr mash.....
PFD Studios Purpleheart wrapless
- Thread starter Monstermash
- Start date
I saw a couple plain sneakies posted recently that were nothing "too special" in my eyes(nice wood though) but were listed for damn near a G.....Too rich for my blood...I get what your driving at mr mash.....
Trade straight up for a used cube of Kamui chalk?
What do you mean by inflated pricing?
No matter who the cuemaker is the market place decides the ultimate price on cues.
If there are a whole bunch of buyers that want a cue by a cuemaker and because of the popularity of his cues and the prices go up...I think that is awesome.
I have been collecting cues for about 30 years and YES I own what you would call " Inflated Price" cues... and many of them.
I don't see the problem...actually it makes me feel most excellent.
If you work hard, work smart and make a lot of money....buy lot's and lot's of the inflated price cues.
As far as the 'Hype" Searing is concerned....he has "Earned" a fabulous reputation of the quality,innovation and playability of his cues and excellent secondary market value.. That is the reason his cues are in demand.
Did you ever stop to think that the reason people "hype" SEARING CUES... because pool players and collectors love his cues and that's all that matters and let the prices go where they may.
As far as the challange... the market place....period. As you probably know the secondary market on PFD Cues is not stellar to say the least...it is obvious why you have started this thread.. I don't think it will create any more desire for PFD Cues and increase their secondary market value and if in time I am shown to be wrong I will acknowledge my error.
You are 'Hyping" PFD in this thread... Actually I think you have started a very negative thread much to the discredit of PFD Cues. I doubt Paul would like you dragging the names of other cuemakers down because of their popularity and market demand and as you say market.. I mean "Hype Pricing". Buyers are only gonna pay what they are gonna pay...period!
By the way if you have noticed I haven't made any negative comments towards Paul's cues, workmanship or have rated his cuemaking versus anyone. The buyers decide.
There are a lot of people that have talent...but there are only a few that have the "It" factor ( that special something that attracts popularity) and Searing has it!!
Finally...the more cuemakers that are fortunate enough to achieve the 'Hype Factor"...bless them all.....the more the hype goes up , the more they can charge for their new cues and make more money....there are some that are really under paid. I wish ALL cuemakers that really work at being excellent and innovative reap the rewards of their efforts.
Remember class....the buyers decide's!!
Hype...Hype.....Hype.....Hype....oh yeah...
And to all a good night!!!!!!
Wow, there for awhile I thought I woke up on the Twilight Zone. I completely understand the point you are making, and to a certain degree I agree with you. I think Paul is towards the top of any high end cuemaker list. I have had a hand full of PDF cues and have LOVED every one of them.
Hi Mash,
Just pointing out the obvious but not everyone gets it and sometime mistaken it for hype. Buyers in the market does determine pricing and the market is not at all stupid as it will eventually reach equilibrium when it correct itself. Buyer don't just buy on quality but brand as well...and both seem to go hand in hand most of the time.
Sure you can have a few dealers/collectors hoarding all the cues of one builder and just buy them at crazy prices to try and establish precedent for one of their cues. But as soon as someone who buy them at crazy price start to realize that he can't re-sale them for what ever reason...you think there's still going to be buyers lining up to grab these cue? If they still are, you know it's not hype but real demand.
With the hype game...you just need to make sure you get out before the market realize it's a hype. Hyping a cue in the end will hurt the builder more than it helps, it might fatten the pocket book of some dealers in the short term but long term it can destroy the builder.
When the builder start to charge crazy $$$ for their cue to try to maintain the profit margin of the dealers...that when you run into problem. When a cue from a builder retails for 5K but really only bring 2K in the market...that when the builder will get hurt. Why would someone order a 5K cue when he can get it on the secondary market for 2K? When that happens, the hype is over and the cue brand begin to drift slowly back into it true value. When this happens...the builder will probably be out of business at this point or decide to go on ebay sell them to the mass at realistic prices.
When the hype is justified, you'll know. Eg. Try putting up a 6 pts with veneers Southwest cue today for 2K and see how fast it will be gone.
Regards,
Duc.
Just pointing out the obvious but not everyone gets it and sometime mistaken it for hype. Buyers in the market does determine pricing and the market is not at all stupid as it will eventually reach equilibrium when it correct itself. Buyer don't just buy on quality but brand as well...and both seem to go hand in hand most of the time.
Sure you can have a few dealers/collectors hoarding all the cues of one builder and just buy them at crazy prices to try and establish precedent for one of their cues. But as soon as someone who buy them at crazy price start to realize that he can't re-sale them for what ever reason...you think there's still going to be buyers lining up to grab these cue? If they still are, you know it's not hype but real demand.
With the hype game...you just need to make sure you get out before the market realize it's a hype. Hyping a cue in the end will hurt the builder more than it helps, it might fatten the pocket book of some dealers in the short term but long term it can destroy the builder.
When the builder start to charge crazy $$$ for their cue to try to maintain the profit margin of the dealers...that when you run into problem. When a cue from a builder retails for 5K but really only bring 2K in the market...that when the builder will get hurt. Why would someone order a 5K cue when he can get it on the secondary market for 2K? When that happens, the hype is over and the cue brand begin to drift slowly back into it true value. When this happens...the builder will probably be out of business at this point or decide to go on ebay sell them to the mass at realistic prices.
When the hype is justified, you'll know. Eg. Try putting up a 6 pts with veneers Southwest cue today for 2K and see how fast it will be gone.
Regards,
Duc.
I'm sorry, but I completely disagree with you. The fact that Searing makes a GREAT cue has little to do with why they are so expensive on the secondary market. It has everything to do with a few select people selling YOU and a few others on how much better they are than cuemaker A, B, or C. That is my point on all of this. I heard that a plain jane Searing recently sold for around $3800. Come on, Really? Really? You mean to tell me that his cues are THAT much better? If you are, then you really have no concept of what makes a good cue. I'm sorry to inform you but Dennis doesn't know some magical formula that makes is cues that much better than everyone else's.
As far as my challenge, you just don't get that either. The marketplace doesn't creat the pricing it's only a few people telling you that they are deserving of the price they are selling for.
Consider this, if I won the lottery and I gave every member of this forum $4000 to go buy a cue. It can be any cue from any maker, but they can only buy one cue. How many are going to run out and buy a plain jane cue for that $4K? My guess is very few. Why? Because there are better values in the market. The reason why some people spend that kind of money on a cue is because they want the status. They pay for the right to say "I own a cue from X". It has zero to do with the cue being worth what they paid for it. Obviously you fall into this catagory.
Monstermash, while I agree with your general point that hype drives the market, to some degree, I think build quality drives hype and then it's up to people to decide if it's "worth" it to them. Picasso might not have been that much better than dozens of other artists working at the same time, but if he was a smidgen better and no one else was better than him, that's why he's at the top of the heap and that's why his painting command the most money someone is willing to spend on a painting. If Searing is the best (not something I can confirm personally, just saying "if"), then the guy willing to spend $4k on a PJ spends it on his. If Sugartree (just for example) is next, then the guys willing to spend $2k on PJs go to him, and so on. Most people, though, really couldn't tell the difference between a $4k PJ Searing and a $500 PJ from any of a hundred or more competent to very good builders, but then those aren't the people paying $4k for a Searing.
If I were given $4k to buy a cue and couldn't keep the difference, I would max out that $4k in resale value, so there's an excellent chance I would buy a Searing if given the chance. A $4k Searing can be turned around and sold for $4k almost instantly, or, if I have to hold onto it for a year, maybe even $4500 or $5k, who knows. A $4k brand new cue dripping with ivory and silver and inlays from a builder who's maybe 99% as good, or even 100% as good just without the hype (say, Searing has cornered the market on $4k PJ buyers, so someone else newer doesn't have a chance) I would probably have to work a lot harder to sell it for $3k. So, in short, I think a lot of people, at least people for whom $4k is a lot of money, would in fact buy a Searing instead of many others.
If I were given $4k to buy a cue and couldn't keep the difference, I would max out that $4k in resale value, so there's an excellent chance I would buy a Searing if given the chance. A $4k Searing can be turned around and sold for $4k almost instantly, or, if I have to hold onto it for a year, maybe even $4500 or $5k, who knows. A $4k brand new cue dripping with ivory and silver and inlays from a builder who's maybe 99% as good, or even 100% as good just without the hype (say, Searing has cornered the market on $4k PJ buyers, so someone else newer doesn't have a chance) I would probably have to work a lot harder to sell it for $3k. So, in short, I think a lot of people, at least people for whom $4k is a lot of money, would in fact buy a Searing instead of many others.