Pics of the "Fatboy" Rails and Pockets for TAR 21. Yeah they are a wee bit tight.

leonkush said:
Sorry I quote " I have played pro in the past and as a road player over 20 odd countries for many years " look up the word "Past" then you get the hang of it. What's the point
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Did it ever occur to you that I think you are full of shit without having to consult any reference material at all?

Any "Pro" who practices for weeks then goes two and out not because he played bad or got beat but because the conditions were different is full of shit no matter what time frame it occurred in. I bet your "road" career was a screaming success.
 
leonkush said:
sorry forget it - no more I understand now clearly the type of person that I am dealing with. it is my fault I should never have got involved. good luck. It is a poor show that if people have differences of opinion that they have to resort to being rude. I am sure that if you thought about it properly you could have come back with a witty or intelligible answer rather than really letting yourself down like this in front of the readers. Why would anyone want to have a conversation in this forum, I didn't come here to argue I was just interested in exchanging views and experiences with different people and instead just get a huge back lash if someone disagrees with my opinion..does the game really mean that much to people's lives that it builds up this type of aggression and disrespect for others?

I have been a member since 2005 and never had this trouble before, maybe the economic conditions are getting the best of people and these forums are providing an avenue for people to vent their anger and frustrations... Then again I am from the UK and not from America and maybe getting the wrong end of the stick and this is the way people communicate now days and it is acceptable behavior. If so, I apologize.

I also think that you will find that there are a lot of players who travel the world playing 9-ball and chasing their dreams, and most of them are unknown and a lot are inexperienced and make mistakes. You then have to look at how one measures "success". For example, in many cases just working towards the opportunity and making it happen is a success in its own right even if you don't win a game and that is all that has ever mattered me personally. You know having the chance to play Bustamante, Peach etc in different places and different players in World Qualifiers is something one can be proud to tell their kids regardless if they do get beaten and have invested a lot of money chasing their dreams. It is all too easy for some people to sit back behind a computer and criticize people without trying it themselves.
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You seem to be the victim type poster. You throw out unsolicited poorly supported opinions that derail the thread then use your "pro" and "road" experience as a means to impress people. I call bullshit on it and I am some evil being because I dont politely thank you for blessing us all with your opinion and derailing the thread.

You dont care about this match and I dont care about your opinion on tight pockets. This thread was started to discuss one of those I'll let you go look up which one it was. You dont like it feel free to go start your own thread and discuss whatever the hell you want.
 
Slh said:
the rudeness of some posters here is unbelievable.
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I agree. I think it quite rude to hijack someones thread when its much easier to go to the main forum click on "New Thread" and type "Why I think tight pockets are bad".
 
leonkush said:
I am having a different conversation from a different perspective. i am not talking about this match...
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Leon

What you wrote above is your main issue of why there is some "backlash".

This thread was created by Justin, who happens to be the one behind putting this match together. He is discussing the pockets being used in THIS match between the 2 players that are playing in THIS match, that also agreed to these pockets for THIS match.

So you can see you discussing events and opinions that have nothing to do with THIS match, may be looked upon as contributing nothing to the actual thread and therefore "hijacking" it, as other people start to discuss what your wrote.

I'm not sure why it's so hard for some people to wrap their heads around the fact that this is a one time match. It's not a tournament. It's not TAR that is saying let's have tight pockets. When 2 players match up for a one on one match for big money, the players & the backers tend to set most of the rules.

TAR's role is to try and get both players to agree to something and to make it attractive to the public. We all know how most players are. Matching up is a 3 hour battle over what table, what pockets, what cueball, what rules, what equipment, who can watch, who can talk, who can take a smoke break, who can pay in chips, who can use what chalk... the list goes on and on.

So I imagine TAR is pretty flexible about what rules the players end up agreeing to, in order for the public to get a chance to see a match. I'm sure TAR will draw the line in some areas, such as if they want to play a race to 500 with no break, or if they feel they should have a 5 min shot clock between shots.

Good luck on all the wannabe promoters out there, that think they will dictate all the rules about the race, the bet, the equipment, the time and the rules, to the players that people want to see match up.

So if you catch a pocketful to sh1t for rambling on about playing snooker and how a player plays in China and comes to Borneo and is all surprised by the fact the table is outside in the goat corral, it has no bearing on this match so people are going to suggest you go elsewhere.

Hopefully you can understand that:rolleyes:

Now, there's still time for you to go run off some flyers for this match and go down to the pub and pass them out to your mates and tell them to get the PPV.. they'll have a bloody good time!
 
leonkush said:
Read the entire thread please you are making statements after hearing the end of a conversation. And what is the point of being rude, I don't get it. Why cause bad blood you are just bringing this forum down.
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Like Justin, I have read this thread front to back, top to bottom.

My reading comprehinsion is very good.

Maybe the problem we are having is that your background is Snooker?

I am not sure, but you clearly don't understand what this match is about and why it is set up the way it is.

Sorry, no rudeness intended.
 
JCIN said:
They will certainly keep the guys honest but they are not the type of over tight pockets that force a player to change his game.


The biggest challenge presented by the pockets will be the fact that they will require a great deal of focus to be maintained over a long period of time.
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Besides position play, here's how the game changes with these sort of pockets:

- Long table banks are considerably riskier. You'll see maybe two way shots and safes but not as many long table banks - unless it's a dead bank and the safe is difficult anyway.

- Tight pockets make blocking balls a lot bigger and combinations a lot more difficult. This is why there will be more safeties too. Viewers should see some very creative safeties.

- Maintaining table control is more important than sheer offense. On a table like this, you want 'base hits' and can't count on the 'home runs' because there probably will not be a lot of three plus packs and catching up will be difficult. This make strategy and table control more important than sheer offense.

- Tight, deep pockets don't take slight misses, so nerves come more into play. In the Oscar/Morro match, the room was filled with spectators, it got humid and the balls that were slightly missed would no longer drop. That rattled the players and you could see where nerves took their toll - even for these too otherwse cool and collected young men.
 
I measured my the pockets from my screen on the computer. It just so happened that the 15 ball measured 1 1/8" which is one half the size of an object ball.

Using that I measured the front entrance of the pocket and the back of the pocket and got 4 1/2" at front and 3 3/4" for the back. I know that's not accurate and the real photos indicate that the pockets are much narrower than that.

That probably doesn't mean squadoosh but it's still a small pocket. Kind of curious to see a player run out a rack on this table. While the cloth is new they may be able to fire balls in. When the cloth wears and gets thinner, even the pros will have to silicone the object balls just to get them to drop.

The balls should be cleaned and polished each hour to insure fair dinkum. The new cloth may help with the pocketing of the balls. I wouldn't want to play on that table after the cloth gets worn. Just sayin...it's gonna be a beatch soon enough.
 
atthecat said:
When Glen see a picture of his work in a thread, it's like Burt Reynolds passing a mirror. He has to stop, blow a kiss to himself and let everyone know he's the sh#%t.
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LOL at the comment.

Glen is the shiznit. :D
 
leonkush said:
look up the term "in general" I am not talking about this match mate. Maybe read the entire thread from page 1 so you get a good understanding of the different directions this topic has been heading - not everyone submitting comments is wearing blinkers. This fact has been commented on several times within this thread so have a good old look. You can print each page out or maybe get someone to read them for you out load.

Also I am answering queries to my opinion not trying to "continually re-state it". If I reinstate it it is because the the enquirer has not fully understood the main point and caught the post half way through so I have been forced to reiterate it. Maybe have a closer read before you comment because you have done the same thing.

However, you have also managed to be rude and sarcastic in your response which in my opinion is not called for because this type of anti social behavior simply deters open minded people from wanting to express their opinion - which is what this forum shouldn't be all about. Especially coming from a "club member". It's a big wide world mate and everyone has an opinion that they would like to share and not everybody lives and thinks within the box. So maybe take the time to look closer at other peoples situations and perspectives and maybe you might expand your way of thinking because the shallowness of your response certainly highlights that there is room for improvement.

"Make sense to me ?" sarcasm is the lowest form of wit - maybe look that up as well
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The man has worked hard to put on a great match and you have given him no credit for his efforts. In the poolrooms down here we call guys like you "Knockers." Have a nice day! :nanner:

EVERYONE else seems pretty thrilled to have a chance to watch this as it happens! I doubt that anyone is that concerned about pocket size or anything else about the playing conditions. This is a PRIMO table and these are two of the best on the planet! HELLO!!!
 
JCIN said:
For all the shit I give Glen about his posting style the guy does know what he's doing with a pool table. These pockets play perfect. They take a ball down the rail at speed and are nowhere near the stupid gaffe tight of the table Oscar and John played on.

They will certainly keep the guys honest but they are not the type of over tight pockets that force a player to change his game. Shane's 10 ball break when it is at its most powerful relies on the second ball in the rack going in the side and playing postion on the one in the corner. I dont see these pockets having any effect at all on that.

After playing for a few hours on the rail set the biggest thing is it takes away some of the ability to cheat a pocket or use a lot of english on questionable angles. The pockets are not gaffey in any way and simply force you to be precise in your postion and choice of angles to the next shot.

You will see some packages in the match. There wont be any of the playing safe with three open balls on the table like in the Morra/Oscar match because the pockets simply wouldnt take a ball down the rail with enough speed to get the cue ball around the table. I think its a perfect set up for two of the best in the world. The biggest challenge presented by the pockets will be the fact that they will require a great deal of focus to be maintained over a long period of time.

Gotta hand it to Glenn. He did a great job on these rails.
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Great analysis here! You should consider doing commentary. :rolleyes:
 
leonkush said:
sorry forget it - no more I understand now clearly the type of person that I am dealing with. it is my fault I should never have got involved. It is a poor show that if people have differences of opinion that they have to resort to being rude. I am sure that if you thought about it properly you could have come back with a witty or intelligible answer rather than really letting yourself down like this in front of the readers. Why would anyone want to have a conversation in this forum, I didn't come here to argue I was just interested in exchanging views and experiences with different people and instead just get a huge back lash if someone disagrees with my opinion..does the game really mean that much to people's lives that it warrants this type of aggression and disrespect for others?

I also think that you will find that there are a lot of players who travel the world playing 9-ball and chasing their dreams, and most of them are unknown and a lot are inexperienced and make mistakes. For example, myself personally never had a sponsor or coach and I went in blind with my life's savings. You then have to look at how one measures "success". For example, in many cases just working towards the opportunity and making it happen is a success in its own right even if you don't win a game and that is all that has ever mattered me personally because I never made it. However, you know having the chance to play Bustamante, Peach etc in different places and different players in World Qualifiers and Pro events is something one can be proud to tell their kids regardless if they do get beaten and have lost a lot of money chasing their dreams.

It is all too easy for some people to sit back behind a computer and criticize people without trying it themselves and putting people down with flippant irrational and negative statements such as "I bet your "road" career was a screaming success" without having any prior knowledge of the player and his objectives (you also mentioned that you had never heard of me?). For example, to measure the success of any project you must first fully understand its objectives, your statement refers to the project failing which without any information on my initial objectives for playing you couldn't possibly know before you made the statement.

If I come across arrogant for saying that I have made centuries in snooker (like thousands of other players) and traveled (like many other players) then this was never my intention. As such, the nature of your response so far has simply been because you feel personally threatened and want to completely destroy someones credibility to bring them down to your level so you can feel better about yourself.. For example, if i was to talk to like minded people who are doing the same thing or who are content in their lives they certainly wouldn't have reacted in the same manner. Moreover, if all of the top pros ever listened seriously to irrational critics there would be half as many playing the game today and who knows maybe even your match up would be missing a player.
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I read all this and I'm kind of sorry I did. To paraphrase you, "Blah, blah, blah," and more "Blah, blah, blah."
 
"CaliRed". said:
Leon

What you wrote above is your main issue of why there is some "backlash".

This thread was created by Justin, who happens to be the one behind putting this match together. He is discussing the pockets being used in THIS match between the 2 players that are playing in THIS match, that also agreed to these pockets for THIS match.

So you can see you discussing events and opinions that have nothing to do with THIS match, may be looked upon as contributing nothing to the actual thread and therefore "hijacking" it, as other people start to discuss what your wrote.

I'm not sure why it's so hard for some people to wrap their heads around the fact that this is a one time match. It's not a tournament. It's not TAR that is saying let's have tight pockets. When 2 players match up for a one on one match for big money, the players & the backers tend to set most of the rules.

TAR's role is to try and get both players to agree to something and to make it attractive to the public. We all know how most players are. Matching up is a 3 hour battle over what table, what pockets, what cueball, what rules, what equipment, who can watch, who can talk, who can take a smoke break, who can pay in chips, who can use what chalk... the list goes on and on.

So I imagine TAR is pretty flexible about what rules the players end up agreeing to, in order for the public to get a chance to see a match. I'm sure TAR will draw the line in some areas, such as if they want to play a race to 500 with no break, or if they feel they should have a 5 min shot clock between shots.

Good luck on all the wannabe promoters out there, that think they will dictate all the rules about the race, the bet, the equipment, the time and the rules, to the players that people want to see match up.

So if you catch a pocketful to sh1t for rambling on about playing snooker and how a player plays in China and comes to Borneo and is all surprised by the fact the table is outside in the goat corral, it has no bearing on this match so people are going to suggest you go elsewhere.

Hopefully you can understand that:rolleyes:

Now, there's still time for you to go run off some flyers for this match and go down to the pub and pass them out to your mates and tell them to get the PPV.. they'll have a bloody good time!
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Tap Tap Tap!
 
Can I suggest that TAR do a video interview with Glen about tables? Right or wrong it could provide some interesting information in a visual format for everyone to digest. What would be really cool is to get Greg Sullivan's perspective, Glen's thoughts, Ernesto's and maybe some player's thoughts on the subject of what makes a great playing table.
 
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