TAR Podcast #8 - Shane - Fransisco - Shane Talks About His Aiming Method

His aiming method was in a book.....

the moment he was describing his method I immediately remember reading about this way of shooting a LOOOOONG time ago in a book called Precision Pool where they even show a pic describing how it works.....In any case, to each his own.
 
The tip/ferrule of the cue may be 2 feet in front of your eyes and the OB will appear larger when it is close, say 1foot, to the CB and smaller if it up table, say 7 feet, away from the CB/ferrule.

Aiming the edge of the ferrule at the edge of the OB will be close to 1/2 of the diameter of the ferrule when the OB is close to the CB/ferrule, but that same visual when looking at the edge of a smaller appearing OB up table will send the CB farther away from the edge of that OB resulting in different cut angles - greater cut angles the farther the OB is to the CB/ferrule.

How does one compensate for this or does one memorize the different cut angles achieved at the different separations between the CB and OB?:confused:

Just saying.:wink:
 
Shanes method as he was describing seems very much like Dave Ms.
It sounds like he uses the center of the tip to a certain degree and the edge of the tip at a certain degree.
Also he wasnt suppose to make the first shot.No one ever does.lol
 
PistolPat said:
the moment he was describing his method I immediately remember reading about this way of shooting a LOOOOONG time ago in a book called Precision Pool where they even show a pic describing how it works.....In any case, to each his own.
Click to expand...


You're right, I forgot about that. Here's what they -- Gary Kanov and Shari Stauch -- say in their chapter about aiming:

"Measuring With Your Ferrule

After your get a rough idea of the fraction theory of aiming you can expand on this knowledge with another technique, adding the variable of your own cue stick to make it easier to actually see your aiming point on the shot. After you find the fraction on the object ball, you line up the inside of your ferrule to your aiming point on the object ball. For example, figure 2.8 illustrates a shot with a half-ball hit to the right. First find the half-ball hit on the left side of the object ball that will send it to the right. Then, as you're looking down the shaft and ferrule of the cue stick as it makes contact with the cue ball, you aim the right side, or inside (going into the hit on the object ball), of the ferrule to the half-ball hit, cutting the ball to your right. If you are attempting a half-ball hit to your left, you find the halfway distance and line up the left side of your ferrule to that point on the object ball.

This method works well on longer shots, can work wonders on thin cuts, and also helps aim with english. As we've also shown you in figure 2.8, even with left english on the cue ball, you will keep the inside of the ferrule to the half-ball aiming point on the object ball."

Lou Figueroa
I guess you could
get it to work
 
The thing about this is that having an actual physical item to use as an aid helps immensely. For Shane and others it's the ferrule line. For some it's the shadows or the reflections and for others it's the edges and centers of the ball.

It's not always just pure feel or HAMB but instead is often a deliberate physical system that a person uses, which they certainly have to use some feel and some experience to dial in. But the fact is that Shane and other pros are starting to open up a bit more on the various ways that they aim and it's little surprise to some of us that it's not all just Hit a Million Balls until you feel it.

Imagine trying to build a house without a level and a tape measure. You could certainly do it but you'd probably have a lot of things to fix after the first good rain. Building a house isn't just hammering a million nails and building a strong pool game isn't just hitting a million balls. It's hammering those nails with the right technique and hitting a million balls with the right aiming method (right for you). As we know there are plenty of them which are better than Ghost Ball. Most of which use physical objects as the guides to aiming rather than invisible points on the ball or the cloth.

That's what I got out of this. And Rodney, and Johnny and Stevie and many others also use techniques that can rightfully be called systems to aim. All you have to do is catch them at the right time in the right frame of mind and they will tell you about them.

Drive cross country with David Matlock once and your head will explode with systems and pool theory. Professional players think a lot about ways to play the game. They may not always want to share things that they think give them an edge but it doesn't mean they aren't trying things out and trying to discover easier and better ways to play.
 
Do not over complicate how shane uses his system, I have used a very similar system in the past before pro1. All he is doing, is using the system for getting his body in the proper position to move into the shot.


take cte/pro1, there are 2 lines going from the cb to the ob to get you into the proper position and get on the contact point. shane is using the ctel to get himself into position and using feel to find the contact point once hes in good body position.

take a look at Lou Figawhatever, he can play against tons of pro's but he can never play like one! even though he has shot a million balls. He has plateaued for the last 30 years because he was never willing to get past ghost ball shooting and was never bright enough to find a way to advance himself ;)

This pod cast shane did was a huge bump in knowledge for pool because it has shown you must have some kind of system to play a high pro level game and if you dont have one you will be on a plateau like Lou Figawhatever for 30 years and trash things like pro1 that he cant understand because he is set in his ways and not willing to accept advance ideas. I am betting his personality is his downfall since no pro's were willing to help him and if i were him i would stop bragging about the pro's he has played since none of them thought well enough of him to help out ;)
 
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Does the ferrule tell him where the cueball is going or HAMB tells him that ?
Just asking.
 
LAMas said:
... that same visual when looking at the edge of a smaller appearing OB up table will send the CB farther away from the edge of that OB resulting in different cut angles - greater cut angles the farther the OB is to the CB/ferrule. ...
Click to expand...

I don't think that's right, LAMas. A couple of analogies first.

If you aim the left edge of the CB at the right edge of the OB for a maximum-degree cut shot, does it matter how far apart the two balls are? No, because you're focusing on a straight line (or a vertical plane) through two points -- the edge of the CB at its starting position and the edge of the OB.

If you aim the point half-way between the CB center and the CB left edge at the OB right edge (or, equivalently, the left edge of the CB at the point on the OB half way between the OB center and the OB right edge), we have what we call a quarter-ball aim. Does the resulting cut angle vary according to how far apart the two balls are? No, we know it produces about a 49-degree cut (ignoring CIT). Again, you're focusing on a straight line (or a vertical plane) through two points. Distance doesn't matter.

OK, now back to aiming with the ferrule. With the cue stick centered on the CB and aiming the left edge of the ferrule at the right edge of the OB, you can think of it as aiming a point on the CB that is half a ferrule (about 1/4") off center at a point on the OB (the edge). Again, it is two points determining a straight line (or a vertical plane), and it doesn't matter how far apart those two points are. Sure, the ferrule at close distance and an OB at long distance may even appear to be the same width, but that's of no concern if you are looking at the line or plane along the ferrule's edge pointing at the OB's edge.

Now with any of the situations I mentioned here, you do have the problem of aiming with something that is not in the center of the CB. So the dilemma is where to place your vision center to best achieve the objective of stroking the CB on the proper line. Should your vision center be over the center of your stick, with the aiming point off to the side? Or should your vision center be directly over the aiming line/plane. That seems to be a matter of personal preference. You may want to read what Dr. Dave's website says about sighting: http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/eyes.html#sighting
 
lfigueroa said:
You're right, I forgot about that. Here's what they -- Gary Kanov and Shari Stauch -- say in their chapter about aiming: ...
Click to expand...

I don't have that book, Lou, so I'm at a bit of a disadvantage in trying to see all they are saying. But the portion you quoted is not the same as Shane's 3-reference alignments.
 
JoeyInCali said:
Does the ferrule tell him where the cueball is going or HAMB tells him that ?
Just asking.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you mean, Joey. The ferrule provides an aiming or alignment line along which to direct the CB. The resulting cut angles he gets, and how to adjust to get all the cut angles he needs, is a matter of HAMB.
 
JoeyInCali said:
Does the ferrule tell him where the cueball is going or HAMB tells him that ?
Just asking.
Click to expand...

The ferrule helps him get in the right space to send the cue ball where he wants it to go. Experience allows him to hit it pure and send it in that direction with the right speed.

If you gave a a rank beginner the task of shooting the cue ball into the pocket from the other end of the table, say a long diagonal shot, then most people who never held a cue would get reasonably able to pocket it within about 30 minutes or less.

But if you told them to use the ferrule to line up to the pocket through the cue ball then they would be pocketing the ball consistently within 2-5 minutes.

It's not much different than if I draw a chalk line for them to follow. Simply a guide.
 
I look at where I about need to hit the object ball and then I go for that spot.

Complicated right?
 
AtLarge said:
I'm not sure what you mean, Joey. The ferrule provides an aiming or alignment line along which to direct the CB. The resulting cut angles he gets, and how to adjust to get all the cut angles he needs, is a matter of HAMB.
Click to expand...

To tell where the cueball is going, doesn't he have to imagine the collision ?
 
• best sight picture •

The way that aiming systems are evolving, they often incorporate alignment, aiming coordinates and sometimes utilize physical properties, not limited to the cue stick but the body as well.

The purpose of aiming systems is to help the player develop the BEST SIGHT PICTURE for the shot.

It is becoming quite apparent that the HAMB enthusiasts are going to have to start spinning faster. ;)

When Shane uses his ferrule to aim, he also allows his experience to fine-tune the shot, JUST LIKE EVERYONE DOES that is successful.

The popularity of aiming systems is sure to increase now that more professional players are coming out and discussing how they aim.

Contrary to what Chicken Little claims, the pro players do use aiming systems. Maybe that snickering that Chicken Little heard from the pro players was just the pro players response to his attempt to learn their AIMING SECRETS.

Note to CL: The sky is not falling. ;-)
 
AtLarge said:
I don't think that's right, LAMas. A couple of analogies first.

If you aim the left edge of the CB at the right edge of the OB for a maximum-degree cut shot, does it matter how far apart the two balls are? No, because you're focusing on a straight line (or a vertical plane) through two points -- the edge of the CB at its starting position and the edge of the OB.

If you aim the point half-way between the CB center and the CB left edge at the OB right edge (or, equivalently, the left edge of the CB at the point on the OB half way between the OB center and the OB right edge), we have what we call a quarter-ball aim. Does the resulting cut angle vary according to how far apart the two balls are? No, we know it produces about a 49-degree cut (ignoring CIT). Again, you're focusing on a straight line (or a vertical plane) through two points. Distance doesn't matter.

OK, now back to aiming with the ferrule. With the cue stick centered on the CB and aiming the left edge of the ferrule at the right edge of the OB, you can think of it as aiming a point on the CB that is half a ferrule (about 1/4") off center at a point on the OB (the edge). Again, it is two points determining a straight line (or a vertical plane), and it doesn't matter how far apart those two points are. Sure, the ferrule at close distance and an OB at long distance may even appear to be the same width, but that's of no concern if you are looking at the line or plane along the ferrule's edge pointing at the OB's edge.

Now with any of the situations I mentioned here, you do have the problem of aiming with something that is not in the center of the CB. So the dilemma is where to place your vision center to best achieve the objective of stroking the CB on the proper line. Should your vision center be over the center of your stick, with the aiming point off to the side? Or should your vision center be directly over the aiming line/plane. That seems to be a matter of personal preference. You may want to read what Dr. Dave's website says about sighting: http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/eyes.html#sighting
Click to expand...

On second thought, you are correct sir. using the ferrule and not a tapered shaft to establish the verticle aim line/plane at the edge of the ferrule which is, say, 1/4" to the side of the center of the ferrule aimed at the edge of the OB. It doesn't matter what the relative size of the OB appears to be at a distance for the CB will impact the OB 1/4" outside of the edge of the OB.

We won't talk about parallax views.

Thanks.:wink:
 
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