We Get What We Deserve

lfigueroa

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
We, as pool players, get what we deserve.

Everyday, in every other field of endeavor, people put on huge events and deal with tremendous logistical challenges. And somehow, miraculously, they pull them off. They hold conventions, shows, conferences, and tournaments, and they happen flawlessly. Whether a first time event or a reoccurring one, organizers seem to be able to do it with enough panache to make the majority of attendees happy they went, have an enjoyable time while there, and leave them looking forward to the next one.

How do they accomplish that magic? It’s called planning.

Thinking things through and solving not only the expected problems, but the unexpected ones as well. As the chief public affairs officer for the USAF, at a number of bases here and overseas, we’d occasionally hold something called an air show. You know, one of those quaint little gatherings that start out with a bare field and taxiway. We bring in little pieces of equipment like bombers, fighters, helicopters, cargo planes, refuelers, have a couple little aerial demos by The Thunderbirds, Blue Angels, and Golden Knights. A quarter million people showing up is no big deal. Gee, we need to give these folks efficient access to the show; we need to park them; they’re going to want decent food and drink; probably going to need sufficient bathrooms; how about some place to sit in the shade; maybe we’ll have old folks and VIPs that we need to help shuttle around; maybe we need to brief and train everyone involved so they know what questions they’ll be asked and how to answer them knowledgeably. I'm guessing that there are many of you who have also put on large events and know what I'm talking about.

But a pool exhibition or tournament? Such a big event (sigh). And sometimes it’s the first time in a new venue (oh my). And afterwards we all can’t roll out the excuses for the promoter fast enough. Big event, new venue, the unexpected happened, they did the best they could, and on and on. Baloney. We put up with it. We go again the next year and nothing has changed. We get what we deserve.

Lou Figueroa
 
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lfigueroa said:
We, as pool players, get what we deserve.

Everyday, in every other field of endeavor, people put on huge events and deal with tremendous logistical challenges. And somehow, miraculously, they pull them off. They hold conventions, shows, conferences, and tournaments, and they happen flawlessly. Whether a first time event or a reoccurring one, organizers seem to be able to do it with enough panache to make the majority of attendees happy they went, have an enjoyable time while there, and leave them looking forward to the next one.

How do they accomplish that magic? It’s called planning.

Thinking things through and solving not only the expected problems, but the unexpected ones as well. As the chief public affairs officer for the USAF, at a number of bases here and overseas, we’d occasionally hold something called an air show. You know, one of those quaint little gatherings that start out with a bare field and taxiway. We bring in little pieces of equipment like bombers, fighters, helicopters, cargo planes, refuelers, have a couple little aerial demos by The Thunderbirds, Blue Angels, and Golden Knights. A quarter million people showing up is no big deal. Gee, we need to give these folks efficient access to the show; we need to park them; they’re going to want decent food and drink; probably going to need sufficient bathrooms; how about some place to sit in the shade,; maybe we’ll have old folks and VIPs that we need to help shuttle around; maybe we need to brief and train everyone involved so they know what questions they’ll be asked and how to answer them knowledgeably. I'm guessing that there are many of you who have also put on large events and know what I'm talking about.

But a pool exhibition or tournament? Such a big event (sigh). And sometimes it’s the first time in a new venue. And afterwards we all can’t roll out the excuses for the promoter fast enough. Big event, new venue, the unexpected happened, they did the best they could, and on and on. Baloney. We put up with it. We go again the next year and nothing has changed. We get what we deserve.

Lou Figueroa
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The ONLY proper response to this is this:

http://www.theodore-roosevelt.com/trsorbonnespeech.html

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. "
 
lfigueroa said:
But a pool exhibition or tournament? Such a big event (sigh). And sometimes it’s the first time in a new venue. And afterwards we all can’t roll out the excuses for the promoter fast enough. Big event, new venue, the unexpected happened, they did the best they could, and on and on. Baloney. We put up with it. We go again the next year and nothing has changed. We get what we deserve.

Lou Figueroa
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Pool here in America is pretty much thought of as a cluster-f*ck by both the general public AND industry leaders, not to mention a helluva lot of people on this website. I don't think any pool related happenings here have any high expectations from very many attendees.

Things could be better.

Maniac
 
For 20 years Allen Hopkins has put on a GREAT show. This one was no exception. It's perfectly clear that the Valley Forge Convention Center had become a familiar venue for many of us and that we were comfortable there.

So what? Things change.

If Allen could have stayed there then he would have. If Greg could have stayed at the Executive West then he would have.

People on the outside looking in really have very little idea what the promoter is dealing with and how many people he has to deal with to put an event like this together.

And there ARE always unexpected issues that have to be dealt with. ALWAYS. No matter what there is someone with a bug up their ass about how they want it done without any regard to what needs to be done or what CAN be done.
 
JB Cases said:
The ONLY proper response to this is this:

http://www.theodore-roosevelt.com/trsorbonnespeech.html

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. "
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This is just one mans opinion (although I wholeheartedly agree with it). Keep in mind there were literally millions of Americans who didn't care for Teddy Roosevelt and detested anything that came out of his mouth (as is par for any U.S. president).

Maniac
 
Maniac said:
This is just one mans opinion (although I wholeheartedly agree with it). Keep in mind there were literally millions of Americans who didn't care for Teddy Roosevelt and detested anything that came out of his mouth (as is par for any U.S. president).

Maniac
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It's not WHO said it. It's the content that matters. The fact is that critics never built a building, they never hosted a show, they never created a car, they never produced anything of value at all.

For Lou to make a thread like this is the epitome of the worthless critic. At least those who were there can speak about it from experience.

I look at from the other side and say wow how cool that there is a great event where so many pool players can hang out with each other and see tons of great pool stuff, meet the pros, and compete in several different events.

So there were some hiccups, BFD. Like people have never gone to an event like a concert or a baseball game where things weren't perfect. Please.

The fact is that people like Allen Hopkins are part of the engine that drives pool to stay alive in the USA. So go on and tear them down until they lose interest.

Then people can whine and complain about the "good old days" when 10,000 players showed up to get together at the Expo and wish that that event still existed.
 
JB Cases said:
It's not WHO said it. It's the content that matters. The fact is that critics never built a building, they never hosted a show, they never created a car, they never produced anything of value at all.

For Lou to make a thread like this is the epitome of the worthless critic. At least those who were there can speak about it from experience.

I look at from the other side and say wow how cool that there is a great event where so many pool players can hang out with each other and see tons of great pool stuff, meet the pros, and compete in several different events.

So there were some hiccups, BFD. Like people have never gone to an event like a concert or a baseball game where things weren't perfect. Please.

The fact is that people like Allen Hopkins are part of the engine that drives pool to stay alive in the USA. So go on and tear them down until they lose interest.

Then people can whine and complain about the "good old days" when 10,000 players showed up to get together at the Expo and wish that that event still existed.
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I agree!!! Nothing of any magnitude EVER runs perfectly.

Maniac
 
Neil said:
Sorry Lou, but your comparison doesn't fly. The military has an unlimited budget, and isn't required to show a profit. I'm sure there are a number of things each year that Hopkins would like to change, but doesn't have the resources to do so.
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So basically, it's an apples-to-oranges comparison. Well said, Neil.

Maniac
 
I have been in "the arena,” having helped plan events that make some some of these pool things look like lemonade-stand level operation. I’m guessing there are others on the forum with similar experience.

So I know what it takes to put on a good show. Apparently there are some people putting on pool events who don’t.

But my central point was that as long as people keep supporting crappy events the longer they will remain crappy events. You get what you deserve and are willing to put up with :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
Neil said:
Sorry Lou, but your comparison doesn't fly. The military has an unlimited budget, and isn't required to show a profit. I'm sure there are a number of things each year that Hopkins would like to change, but doesn't have the resources to do so.
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Using your noggin to anticipate problems is relatively cheap. Try it.

Lou Figueroa
 
So you want some cute quotes...

Failing to plan is planning to fail....

It pays to plan ahead, it wasn't raining when Noah built the ark...

People who had to cart items didn't have your experience John, so there will be opinions different than yours, you really should learn to deal with that fact. The fact that you are seldom correct, and your opinion is not the end all of end alls...

Anyone who tried to enter and leave that facility with product knows what happened, and as Ron said in the other thread, its all going to be looked at.

JV
 
It's easy to criticize.

Criticism without a real workable applicable solution is as easy as it is useless.

Criticism with real workable applicable solution is much, much harder and usually a lot more welcome.
 
lfigueroa said:
I have been in "the arena,” having helped plan events that make some some of these pool things look like lemonade-stand level operation. I’m guessing there are others on the forum with similar experience.

So I know what it takes to put on a good show. Apparently there are some people putting on pool events who don’t.

But my central point was that as long as people keep supporting crappy events the longer they will remain crappy events. You get what you deserve and are willing to put up with :-)

Lou Figueroa
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I'd bet anything you NEVER ran ANY event of the magnitude of the SBE where your PERSONAL CHECKING ACCOUNT was affected by the success / failure of such event.

Give me NAVSEA's or SPAWAR's annual budget and I'd make an event that looked like Disney World too. Whooptie Do.

Now, let's give Lou ZERO budget outside of his checking account and let's see what he comes up with.

Furthermore, based on how little he'd likely make from that event --- let's see if he keeps putting on the same event year after year--- and ADDING MONEY to the events YEAR AFTER YEAR.

I keep saying it --- Lou is a knocker know-it-all who can always do it better than the next guy (according to him); however, we're YET to see Lou put his cash up and do something better... with superior "planning."
 
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Like it or not, Lou is spot on.

You put up with substandard events, that's what you get.

There is no class, no sense of style in pool tourney's. I realized this recently when I went to a local 3 cushion tourney. There was class in that tourney.

The players acted like gentlemen, a dress code was in affect, the fans were quiet and if they got a little too loud, they were told to be quiet.

Pure class, pure style, but then again that is what is expected and DEMANDED from the players as well as the fans.

This is the biggest problem with pool. There is no set standards required of the players or the fans such as in the 3 cushion tourney I went to.

Until this is changed, you will get what you deserved in pool tourneys.

Oh, go ahead bad mouth me all you want. Doesn't change the fact that I'm right.
 
SpiderWebComm said:
I'd bet anything you NEVER ran ANY event of the magnitude of the SBE where your PERSONAL CHECKING ACCOUNT was affected by the success / failure of such event.

Give me NAVSEA's or SPAWAR's annual budget and I'd make an event that looked like Disney World too. Whooptie Do.

Now, let's give Lou ZERO budget outside of his checking account and let's see what he comes up with.

Furthermore, based on how little he'd likely make from that event --- let's see if he keeps putting on the same event year after year--- and ADDING MONEY to the events YEAR AFTER YEAR.

I keep saying it --- Lou is a knocker know-it-all who can always do it better than the next guy (according to him); however, we're YET to see Lou put his cash up and do something better... with superior "planning."

The only thing clear to me is that you couldn't wipe your azz without a plan.
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Lou:

As you know, I'm a veteran as well. There's a SOLID point to be made of the fact that, with the massive budgets of the different factions of the respective military alma maters of you and I (A.F. and Navy, respectively), we can put on shows of the magnitude you describe. Hire the experts and put them to work for you. When you have the nearly bottomless pit spending budgets of the DOD, you can do just about anything. Taking risks with, and spending other people's money is easy.

But put a fence around that budget -- especially if that budget is coming out of your personal pocket -- and watch what happens. Ah, not so easy grasshoppa, eh?

I find it a bit odd (humorous, actually) that you commented specifically on an event that you weren't even at. Or, that you chose to use this event -- one that you weren't even at -- as "the latest example" of a much grander-scale point you're trying to make. While the grander scale point may have some value, going to a past year's event isn't a free pass to comment on this one, because you didn't personally experience the massive changes nor have a knowledge base of experience with multiple past year events to compare against.

I was there. (And I was also at previous year's events -- 5 years running, without a gap.) I also manned a booth at this year, as well as in years past. I thought Allen Sr. & crew did the best they could with what they had. The layout of these new facilities is completely different from the VF Convention Center. Don't forget that Allen Sr. & crew had literally up to a run of 18 years to fine tune and tweak the layout of SBE to suit the VF Convention Center. First year in a new facility? *Of course* there's going to be some growing pains as Allen Sr. & crew figure out what works, what didn't, and tweak/tune it over time. One thing about Allen, is that he *listens* to feedback. He's demonstrated this in spades, year after year in the old VF Convention Center.

I think if we give him time, he'll fine tune and tweak SBE to fit the new facilities just as well as he did the old one.

And, going back to your original example of using air shows to compare against, I'll bet my hat that the first incarnations of those shows didn't exactly go off as planned, either. I know that when bases close and any kind of military show moves to a new base / area, there's growing pains there, too. I'd been stationed aboard multiple ships, at multiple bases (and seen multiple bases around the world as well -- remember, Navy ships travel, unlike the A.F. where you're rooted in one place for the duration, awaiting the call). I can tell you that each one has been fine-tuned and tweaked over time in how they do things.

Your commenting on SBE in the new facilities is about as meaningful as, say, my commenting on DCC and its new facilities -- when I have yet to even go to a DCC.

Food for thought,
-Sean
 
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Lou use your public affairs skills for the good of poo,l turn away from the darkside. Haters do not make pool better, work for change rather than resisting the people who are trying to make a difference. If you have to be a critic try to mention some positives and then come with items that could be done better.
 
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