Dress Code for Gold Crown Billiards, Erie, PA

Blue Hog ridr said:
I saw some of the pics Paul posted and there was a white boy playing that had a base ball cap and sweat shirt on. Must have been the mayors son.

If a black kid showed up with the same attire, that would be grounds to refuse entry. So, its purely a pick and choose thing.

I do believe that if any of Paul's friends showed up wearing a pillow case it would be OK cause it would be Tuesday night meeting time.

Post 104.

Backwards base ball cap and a hoodie under that pic.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=214081&page=7
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This is perfect. We have a procedure for this.

After the dress code is politely explained to a potential customer, 19 out of 20 just say “Oh OK” and honor the rules. Then there is the 1 out of 20. This guy is confrontational. He turns around, scans the crowd, and points his finger and says “What about him?” This guy is a problem and we want rid of him. The staff is instructed to respond as follows: “You don’t worry about him. We will worry about him. You worry about yourself.” This stern response brings the focus right back where it should be: Adhere to the dress code or no service. He can decide what he wants to do. Swear, cry discrimination, or throw the race card and he is gone.

P.S. We do have policy and a procedure for the occasional customer who has already been served and is inappropriately dressed. It is completely different than what takes place at the counter.

I know that this post in particular will really rub some people the wrong way. Let me reassure everyone. We try our very best to run a great place. We have the best regulars that a poolroom could ever want. We are inclusive. In 34 years, we have never had someone who loves the game stay away because of the dress code. Everyone gets on board, (contrary to what you may read in this thread).
 
inside_english said:
I love these.

I only wish they could invent a device that administers an electric shock to the person who insists on wearing their pants low enough to see their boxers.

Of all the new "styles" out there, this has to be the worst.

I also love how some posters take the dress code to extremes. You don't want people to dress like a$$holes in your place, so they make the assumption that you want everyone to wear suits...what a joke.

My mother always said...a bar of soap is very cheap.

If you can't make the effort to look like a decent human being when you leave your home, you don't deserve the respect you seem to demand from everyone else.
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Tap, tap, tap!
 
Whatever Paul. Obviously you pick and choose who gets in and who doesn't regardless of what they are wearing.

If your best buddies son comes in wearing a hoodie, thats OK.

If someone that you don't know comes in wearing a hoodie, tough luck.

Discrimination comes in varying colors and levels but it is still discrimination.

Nice explanation but it still doesn't come close to why you posted a picture of someone wearing a hoodie in your hall.
Pretty much makes the entire thread no longer credible, as if it came close in the first place.
 
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as hog rider said, i count at least 5 people with hoodies on in those pictures, and tend to agree with him.
 
Blue Hog ridr said:
Whatever Paul. Obviously you pick and choose who gets in and who doesn't regardless of what they are wearing.

If your best buddies son comes in wearing a hoodie, thats OK.

If someone that you don't know comes in wearing a hoodie, tough luck.

Discrimination comes in varying colors and levels but it is still discrimination.

Nice explanation but it still doesn't come close to why you posted a picture of someone wearing a hoodie in your hall.
Pretty much makes the entire thread no longer credible, as if it came close in the first place.
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Anyone can wear a hoodie or a coat with a hood. It's cold here. Almost every coat has a hood. They cannot pull a hood up over their head while they eat, drink, and play pool inside. You don't get that?
 
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I get it just fine Paul. You got busted and now you're back peddling on your words.

Previously you were adamant re the wearing of Hoodies in your hall.
When brought to your attention that the pictures that you posted contained
people wearing them, you retracted your statements, saying now that Hoodies are OK as long as the people wearing them don't put the hoods up.

No longer remotely credible but highly laughable.

I see you have a need to be understood. That is quite a burden.
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Actually Paul, it seems that you are the one that feels the need to be understood.
Otherwise why would have started this thread in the first place and continue defending it like a pit bull
every step of the way.
 
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i can't believe this is a real and serious thread, but it seems to be.

you mentioned that wearing a hoodie over the head while in a pool hall makes a mockery of the functional quality of the hoodie. for why would someone wear a hoodie, drawn over their head, in a pool hall where the temperature must be above 70 degrees? therefore, you seem to believe that one is a gangster if one chooses to draw a hood above their head inside a building. so i guess the general rule we can draw from the no hoodie on head while in a building dictum is that there are acceptable functional outdoor practices for an accouterment of cloth that become unacceptable indoors since the presence of four walls, a ceiling and a heater make them unacceptable. this i can understand. however, what i cannot understand is why you allow persons to wear hats while indoors your pool hall? what function does a hat serve indoors? outdoors it's easy to see why one might wear a hat, fowards, backwards, sideways or even upside down. to block out the sun, protect one's hair from bird droppings, create a barrier to protect their precious noggin from the frigid cold of winter, etc. however indoors i can't see a functional purpose for wearing a hat. likely indoor hat wearing is an affront against common human decency and decorum, and is the start of a very slippery slope towards gangsterism.
 
I am reposting this letter for those folks who are late coming to this thread. This is what this thread is about:

I sent a letter to the editor on this subject to the Billiards Digest. The letter was published in the August issue. For those who are interested, read on...

To the Editor of Billiards Digest,

In the closing paragraphs of the June Chronicles, “Crime in the Halls,” Mike Shamos made several suggestions for how poolrooms can improve their image and at the same time, the image of the game. I have owned a room for 33 years and I can tell everyone that the most reliable method for operating a respectable room and garnering community acceptance is to institute and maintain a dress code. Not only do words and manners have meaning, attire also conveys a message. Forbidding offensive, disrespectful, and inappropriate clothing goes a long way toward changing the image of the game and setting standards for a poolroom. People tend to act in accordance with the way they are dressed. A simple dress code can actually clean up questionable customers and make them desirable customers. It can also be used as a filter at the front door to deny entry to trouble that a poolroom would never want.

The room itself must play its part and set a tone of consideration and dignity with a neat, clean, and attractive atmosphere without offensive music and vulgar language. Instituting a dress code requires more than just posting a sign of proscribed attire. Developing policy, educating staff, and administering regulations are also necessary.

Image has always been our Achilles heel. Here is a simple, straight-forward, and doable practice that has served my business well for more than three decades.

Sincerely,
Paul Schofield
Gold Crown Billiards
Erie, PA
 
Speaking of offensive....

A simple dress code can actually clean up questionable customers and make them desirable customers.
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You do understand that you are in fact quite offensive yourself. I mean that quite sincerely.


You never responded regarding the fate of the employee I sighted in your photograph wearing known gang related clothing.

I guess we should ignore that for some mysterious reason.

I do have another serious matter to address though. My son is disabled. Specifically he is autistic. That is known to people in this forum and is not a supposition for the sake of conversation, it is quite real as is what follows. He loves to wear hoodies. Because of the idiosyncrasies of his disability he refuses to wear them with the hood down, it puts him into a sort of panic mode.

We have lots of family to visit in Erie and I love to shoot pool. I'm a family man so I might consider attending your establishment with my family.

How do you intend to accommodate my son's disability in light of your policies?
 
Chopdoc said:
In my younger days I would have gotten fired up about it and probably shown up with a hundred or so to shoot pool, possibly even park a bike or ten on your carpet. I have ridden charity rides, poker runs, Veterans Day Parades, etc there in Erie and still know some righteous brothers there. If you live in Erie you probably know of some of the people I would be talking about. It's a small enough town. But I am older now and less volatile. As it stands I'll just say that part of your rules sucks. But it's your place. I'll respect yours....as long as you respect mine.
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You don't need this place. You should just stay away.
 
Actually, I like here and am planning on staying. :smile:

Apparently you don't like how I was in my younger days? That has little to do with me now. Indeed there was a time when such matters would have been dealt with quite directly. But as I said, I am older now, and less volatile. Age tends to do that. That does not change the fact that I find your manner quite offensive.



Now, about visiting your establishment with my disabled son and how you will accommodate him....
 
Paul Schofield said:
A simple dress code can actually clean up questionable customers and make them desirable customers. It can also be used as a filter at the front door to deny entry to trouble that a poolroom would never want.
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C'mon Paul, do you actually believe that the way YOU make a person dress is going to make them a DIFFERENT person???

You can wrap a turd in the best suit-and-tie that money can buy and it's still gonna be a turd!!!

Maniac (This thread's getting funnier by the page. Very entertaining.)
 
Maniac said:
C'mon Paul, do you actually believe that the way YOU make a person dress is going to make them a DIFFERENT person???
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Who said that? We have been through this before.

Clothes do not make the person. We do not judge character. We judge clothes.

People have a tendency to act in accordance with the way they are dressed. School districts discovered this when they realized a significant decrease in disciplinary problems after instituting a dress code.
 
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Paul Schofield said:
Clothes do not make the person. We do not judge character. We judge clothes.
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So, if a large group of hardcore gang-bangers puts on the correct clothing and come into your room, then you're comfortable with that???

Maniac (would rather have decent people dressed in shorts/workboots/backwards hats in my place, if I had one ;))
 
Maniac said:
So, if a large group of hardcore gang-bangers puts on the correct clothing and come into your room, then you're comfortable with that???

Maniac (would rather have decent people dressed in shorts/workboots/backwards hats in my place, if I had one ;))
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I judge clothes. You do what you want in your place.
 
I guess you've never heard the cliche' "Never judge a book by its cover"? Cliche's are coined for a reason. They're based on common sense.

I never judge someone without first getting to know them. I do not even trust the opinions of other people telling me about someone else. You sir, are a "shoot first and ask questions later" type of person. You come off as a sour, bitter old man that is very distrustful of many facets of life.

I wish you all the best for you and your precious (but snooty) poolhall. There are literally hundreds of people that post on this forum that wouldn't be allowed entry, and probably wouldn't want to anyway.

Maniac (still can't figure out how a thigh-length HOCKEY JERSEY is considered classy or ungangster-like)
 
I didn't read the entire thread, but I like the direction that Gold Crown is taking.

I don't quite understand the backlash against a dress code. I think the room owner is trying to position his room as being more upscale.

For instance, if you went to your local golf club, would you get grief from the pro shop if you tried to tee off with a hockey jersey (I know I would from mine)? I think positioning a nice room with the same expectations someone would find at a local golf course sends a clear message to people that the rooms means business and is professional.

How could forcing someone to wear the same clothes as your local golf course be a BAD thing? It's a great idea. If I owned a room, I'd prob do the exact same thing. For every low-class person you'd lose, you'd prob gain 5 "older" clients that like and respect the environment.

Just my 2 cents--- good job.

Dave
 
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