Thanks for the advice mate =)
Where to start?
- Thread starter nzjase
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Thanks for the advice mate =)
Getting down to a pool hall would be great problem is it is a strain on my current commitments. Hence the focus on practice/play at home on my own table.
But watching the better players is definitely something I need to do.
Work on physical mechanics. If you can't hit the cue ball accurately, you can't control it. You'll never hit it accurately consistently with bad mechanics, which means the fewest moving parts possible.
Throwing balls onto the table is fun, but you never get to work on what troubles you. Start with a simple follow shot and work on judging the distance the cue ball rolls. Move to cut shots, while still rolling the cue ball. Pay attention to the angle it takes. Rolling cue balls are the most predictable tools in your arsenal, which makes them very useful.
Throwing balls onto the table is fun, but you never get to work on what troubles you. Start with a simple follow shot and work on judging the distance the cue ball rolls. Move to cut shots, while still rolling the cue ball. Pay attention to the angle it takes. Rolling cue balls are the most predictable tools in your arsenal, which makes them very useful.
Great advice, thanks!
there are multiple videos on the net where pros do runouts and explain their patterns.
max eberle as multiple free videos on his homepage.
jimmy reid too.
but as the others here stated; fundamentals... MORE fundamentals
PAT even offers some "tasting" drills on their homepage, free to download after registration.
link; http://www.pat-billiard.com/Default.aspx
so you can try out some drills
max eberle as multiple free videos on his homepage.
jimmy reid too.
but as the others here stated; fundamentals... MORE fundamentals
PAT even offers some "tasting" drills on their homepage, free to download after registration.link; http://www.pat-billiard.com/Default.aspx
so you can try out some drills
there are multiple videos on the net where pros do runouts and explain their patterns.
max eberle as multiple free videos on his homepage.
jimmy reid too.
but as the others here stated; fundamentals... MORE fundamentals
link; http://www.pat-billiard.com/Default.aspx
so you can try out some drills
All of this is massively appreciated guys, thanks a ton for your help.
Phill Cappelle's Play Your Best 8 Ball is an excellent reference book.
Here's some 8 Ball videos that Max Ebere has done. These are really good because he goes through the thought process of choosing a group and picking patterns:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvWXmkg-QkM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrunGp5p5i0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEaDplqKicY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZhuthlkw7Q
When I first started playing league I would almost always try to get out. I'd often fall short a ball or two and at times this has cost me to lose, even against lesser opponents. A good opponent has a relatively easy out because you have now cleared all the traffic for him. And a savvy lesser player will make a a ball or two and then hook you, make a couple and hook you again - then get out. :angry:
My game improved when I realized that in every game there is a point of no return. Once you reach that point, if you go for the run out and don't get out you are in deep trouble. This may be different depending on each lay-out, earlier if there are problems like clusters. Keeping that I mind I've tried to consciously identify when this occurs in every rack. At that point I assess my chances to get out versus playing defense and ducking for cover. This is much better when you still have soldiers on the battlefield for defense than for a run out to stop a ball or two short, in which case all you've accomplished is having done all the heavy lifting for your opponent.
Especially when practicing I've found it useful on every shot to choose both an offensive shot AND the best defensive shot. This will open your mind to seeing those opportunities when a safety, even early in the game, is the better play. When you have problems in the layout a good early safety that gives you ball in hand will help you deal with those problems (like breaking up a cluster or a tied up 8 ball).
Deal with problems early if possible so if the break-out doesn't open things up like you hoped you still have balls to hide behind or create congestion for your opponent.
Best of luck and welcome to the forum! :wink:
Here's some 8 Ball videos that Max Ebere has done. These are really good because he goes through the thought process of choosing a group and picking patterns:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvWXmkg-QkM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrunGp5p5i0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEaDplqKicY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZhuthlkw7Q
When I first started playing league I would almost always try to get out. I'd often fall short a ball or two and at times this has cost me to lose, even against lesser opponents. A good opponent has a relatively easy out because you have now cleared all the traffic for him. And a savvy lesser player will make a a ball or two and then hook you, make a couple and hook you again - then get out. :angry:
My game improved when I realized that in every game there is a point of no return. Once you reach that point, if you go for the run out and don't get out you are in deep trouble. This may be different depending on each lay-out, earlier if there are problems like clusters. Keeping that I mind I've tried to consciously identify when this occurs in every rack. At that point I assess my chances to get out versus playing defense and ducking for cover. This is much better when you still have soldiers on the battlefield for defense than for a run out to stop a ball or two short, in which case all you've accomplished is having done all the heavy lifting for your opponent.
Especially when practicing I've found it useful on every shot to choose both an offensive shot AND the best defensive shot. This will open your mind to seeing those opportunities when a safety, even early in the game, is the better play. When you have problems in the layout a good early safety that gives you ball in hand will help you deal with those problems (like breaking up a cluster or a tied up 8 ball).
Deal with problems early if possible so if the break-out doesn't open things up like you hoped you still have balls to hide behind or create congestion for your opponent.
Best of luck and welcome to the forum! :wink:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GqrF3xS2qA
a long 8 ball rack that shows how the pros try to move their balls to break cluster, remove opponents balls etc. one of my favorites
a long 8 ball rack that shows how the pros try to move their balls to break cluster, remove opponents balls etc. one of my favorites
For videos, one of the easiest and mostly efficient DVD , IMHO, is "A pool lesson with Jerry Briesath"
Lots of goods, easy to understand, and fun to watch over and over, thanks to Jerry's easy going style!
Here:
poollessons"dot"com/dvds
You might find somebody on this forum that actually sells the DVD set, if you struggle to get any......
Nice stuff, from one of the best and most known instructors at a world-class level!
Lots of goods, easy to understand, and fun to watch over and over, thanks to Jerry's easy going style!
Here:
poollessons"dot"com/dvds
You might find somebody on this forum that actually sells the DVD set, if you struggle to get any......
Nice stuff, from one of the best and most known instructors at a world-class level!
YouTube is your friend. There are so many 8-ball videos on there that you have years of material to work with. 8 ball is mostly about patterns to run out as easily as possible but it it's also about learning how to properly deal with clusters. On YouTube you have some of the greatest modern 8 ball matches with Efren Reyes other top tier pros. You also have amateur matches and matches by semi-pros. Study them HARD to understand WHY they do what they do.
REALLY study and take notes and then take it to the pool room. Put up some of the layouts and see if you can get out the way they did. When you can finish rack with simple shots and not disturb other balls you are playing good. When you can navigate difficult clusters and move balls properly you are playing great. That's really the secret is to find the simplest route but be able to handle rough terrain if needed. Don't create extra work by running into balls when you don't need to and try to REALLY understand what will happen when you do plan to run into balls.
Also, you need to practice breaking and running out. It's incredibly boring to rack and break but the fact of it that you will get more realistic layouts than if you simply throw the balls out.
Work on your safety game. There are obvious and non-obvious safes in 8 ball. Learn the standard ones and try to think of creative ones but learn to do them consistently.
And lastly, work on problems. This means you should set up situations and work out how to play them. Think of all possible ways to run out or play safe with the problem facing you. This is not only fun it trains you to think on your feet and not trap yourself by only considering one option.
REALLY study and take notes and then take it to the pool room. Put up some of the layouts and see if you can get out the way they did. When you can finish rack with simple shots and not disturb other balls you are playing good. When you can navigate difficult clusters and move balls properly you are playing great. That's really the secret is to find the simplest route but be able to handle rough terrain if needed. Don't create extra work by running into balls when you don't need to and try to REALLY understand what will happen when you do plan to run into balls.
Also, you need to practice breaking and running out. It's incredibly boring to rack and break but the fact of it that you will get more realistic layouts than if you simply throw the balls out.
Work on your safety game. There are obvious and non-obvious safes in 8 ball. Learn the standard ones and try to think of creative ones but learn to do them consistently.
And lastly, work on problems. This means you should set up situations and work out how to play them. Think of all possible ways to run out or play safe with the problem facing you. This is not only fun it trains you to think on your feet and not trap yourself by only considering one option.
So I spent a couple of hours practising today and it was a little disheartening.
I found this drill http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ul3SVzlhyQ&feature=plcp
My stroke is obviously not great since I am a bit of a beginner so thought this would allow me a chance to work on it.
I set myself a target of five in a row with the OB a foot from the corner pocket and the CB a little over a foot further back. Well, after an hour, I had got the CB to follow into the pocket 4 times in a row, a handful of times, but never made the 5th. This kind of sucked all motivation out of my practice so I just played a couple of racks after that.
Has anyone tried something like the above? Should I just move the balls closer to the pocket and a lot closer together? I didn't think my initial set up was too ambitious (obviously was though!)
I have a target pool booklet, would this be a better starting point? I didn't start with it as I thought it might be a little too advanced for where I am at.
I found this drill http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ul3SVzlhyQ&feature=plcp
My stroke is obviously not great since I am a bit of a beginner so thought this would allow me a chance to work on it.
I set myself a target of five in a row with the OB a foot from the corner pocket and the CB a little over a foot further back. Well, after an hour, I had got the CB to follow into the pocket 4 times in a row, a handful of times, but never made the 5th. This kind of sucked all motivation out of my practice so I just played a couple of racks after that.
Has anyone tried something like the above? Should I just move the balls closer to the pocket and a lot closer together? I didn't think my initial set up was too ambitious (obviously was though!)
I have a target pool booklet, would this be a better starting point? I didn't start with it as I thought it might be a little too advanced for where I am at.
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I think the Pro Book has a lot of good drills and information. You can check out the most recent article on my blog about cue calibration (www.BilliardsBiohacker.com) and check out my new podcast too. Make sure to check out episode 3, which will be coming out in a few days. Let me know if you find it helpful.
Cheers,
Skippy
Cheers,
Skippy
Thanks mate. Btw, what is "The Pro Book"
Bert has coached quite a few top-level players.
Here's how I look at it...
• You will learn to make shots just over the course of time, so don't sweat shotmaking for now. It won't come in a day but it will eventually to anyone who plays a lot.
• Cue ball position, however, is not so automatic. In order to play good pool, first you need to have all the tools in your toolbox... the ability to spin a ball off the rails, the ability to draw the ball at will, the ability to make the cue ball stop dead after a straight in shot, at any distance, etc.
Basically, with all these skills you have options. Then you can worry about which option is right for a specific situation.
Without the skills, your options shrink and you are forced to pick an option that is marginal or dead wrong, because all the others are out of reach. If the right shot is to sink the object ball then draw the cue ball six feet to the head rail... and you have never drawn six feet in your life... it does absolutely no good knowing what the right shot is (which is the focus of most 8-ball DVDs and books).
So:
• Can you draw and follow the ball the length of the table, consistently and at will?
• Can you realistically sink a cut shot with a lot of sidespin?
• Can you do stop shots at various distances?
• Cut a ball up the rail and spin it back down towards you?
• Drill a shot in with a lot of top and have it travel to the rail, and then all the way across the length of the table?
This isn't everything you need to do it, but it's a starting point. If you can't do some of these things, you should set up specific shots and practice them until you can.
I don't know your level (average is a really vague word) so if you already can do all this and you JUST need strategy, say so.
• You will learn to make shots just over the course of time, so don't sweat shotmaking for now. It won't come in a day but it will eventually to anyone who plays a lot.
• Cue ball position, however, is not so automatic. In order to play good pool, first you need to have all the tools in your toolbox... the ability to spin a ball off the rails, the ability to draw the ball at will, the ability to make the cue ball stop dead after a straight in shot, at any distance, etc.
Basically, with all these skills you have options. Then you can worry about which option is right for a specific situation.
Without the skills, your options shrink and you are forced to pick an option that is marginal or dead wrong, because all the others are out of reach. If the right shot is to sink the object ball then draw the cue ball six feet to the head rail... and you have never drawn six feet in your life... it does absolutely no good knowing what the right shot is (which is the focus of most 8-ball DVDs and books).
So:
• Can you draw and follow the ball the length of the table, consistently and at will?
• Can you realistically sink a cut shot with a lot of sidespin?
• Can you do stop shots at various distances?
• Cut a ball up the rail and spin it back down towards you?
• Drill a shot in with a lot of top and have it travel to the rail, and then all the way across the length of the table?
This isn't everything you need to do it, but it's a starting point. If you can't do some of these things, you should set up specific shots and practice them until you can.
I don't know your level (average is a really vague word) so if you already can do all this and you JUST need strategy, say so.
All of this is good advice books, videos, articles etc.. will speed you toward your goals. I suggest dividing your practice time into 3 segments.
1. Warm-up
2. Drill
3. Game
When you just “jump” into a practice session with no structure you don’t get the max out of it.
1) Warm-up: Take a few shots; don’t take this part too seriously, it is to get your arm loosened, wrist loosened, get your legs stretched out, back warmed up etc.. throw a ball down table, wait till it stops and shoot at it. I do a much more structured warm-up but let this develop over time; as time passes you will want to warm-up with harder and harder shots and you will end up setting up balls instead of throwing them down table.
2) Drill: Pick a drill or 2 and do it with as much focus, concentration, fervor and determination as you can but only do 1 or 2 a day this is essential and it sounds like you like drilling and that is great. Those who don’t will never be as good as their natural ability will allow given the time and resources they have to devote to it, you will.
3) Game: Fargo, Bowlyards, playing the ghost, Byrnes practice game, Target pool (if you score it) and the like is great practice. I specifically DO NOT recommend that you break an 8 ball rack and try to run the table. For 99% of the players out there (99% of them will not admit this or will think they are the 1%) this leads to reinforcement of bad habits, unfocused, careless, sloppy play. Do not attempt this form of practice until you get about 5-10 solid years of competitive play.
Finally if you want to improve it is not a good idea to say “I want to improve my 8ball game” for best results become a student of “the game” (pool) and of “your game” (how YOU play and how to fix YOUR problems) Good luck you seem to have a good handle on how to teach yourself feel free to PM me if you have specific questions.
1. Warm-up
2. Drill
3. Game
When you just “jump” into a practice session with no structure you don’t get the max out of it.
1) Warm-up: Take a few shots; don’t take this part too seriously, it is to get your arm loosened, wrist loosened, get your legs stretched out, back warmed up etc.. throw a ball down table, wait till it stops and shoot at it. I do a much more structured warm-up but let this develop over time; as time passes you will want to warm-up with harder and harder shots and you will end up setting up balls instead of throwing them down table.
2) Drill: Pick a drill or 2 and do it with as much focus, concentration, fervor and determination as you can but only do 1 or 2 a day this is essential and it sounds like you like drilling and that is great. Those who don’t will never be as good as their natural ability will allow given the time and resources they have to devote to it, you will.
3) Game: Fargo, Bowlyards, playing the ghost, Byrnes practice game, Target pool (if you score it) and the like is great practice. I specifically DO NOT recommend that you break an 8 ball rack and try to run the table. For 99% of the players out there (99% of them will not admit this or will think they are the 1%) this leads to reinforcement of bad habits, unfocused, careless, sloppy play. Do not attempt this form of practice until you get about 5-10 solid years of competitive play.
Finally if you want to improve it is not a good idea to say “I want to improve my 8ball game” for best results become a student of “the game” (pool) and of “your game” (how YOU play and how to fix YOUR problems) Good luck you seem to have a good handle on how to teach yourself feel free to PM me if you have specific questions.