Image of Pool, in Fact, was Created by a Con Artist

lfigueroa said:
I don't believe I've agreed with you but if you want to claim so, knock yourself out.

Lou Figueroa
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Why are you being so flippant to C.J., Lou? Sheesh! :embarrassed2:

I'm not trying to start a verbal war of words. You're probably one of the very minute few on this forum who is even capable of giving me a good debate via the written word. ;)

I don't know if it's this forum or what, but any time a known pool player posts on AzBilliards, they seem to have to defend their written word more so than the other members on AzBilliards. I'm not sure why, either. :frown:

I'm not talking about you, Lou, but in my opinion, there seems to be a lot of egos that need massaging on this forum from time to time, and when somebody steals their limelight, they go after that entity by dissecting their words and criticizing their stance on certain issues.

I realize, though, we all have our own opinions about various topics, but it sure would be nice if people could have a pleasant discourse. It makes for a better read in general, I think.

Those egos that need massaging can always get their scratches itched by the testicle danglers at various pool events. There should not be a need for them to do so on this forum. Facebook is another vehicle where egos can shine and get all the massaging they need. :D

Again, this post is not directed at you, Lou; thus, the purpose of all the inserted smiley faces. :smile:
 
JAM said:
Why are you being so flippant to C.J., Lou? Sheesh! :embarrassed2:

I'm not trying to start a verbal war of words. You're probably one of the very minute few on this forum who is even capable of giving me a good debate via the written word. ;)

I don't know if it's this forum or what, but any time a known pool player posts on AzBilliards, they seem to have to defend their written word more so than the other members on AzBilliards. I'm not sure why, either. :frown:

I'm not talking about you, Lou, but in my opinion, there seems to be a lot of egos that need massaging on this forum from time to time, and when somebody steals their limelight, they go after that entity by dissecting their words and criticizing their stance on certain issues.

I realize, though, we all have our own opinions about various topics, but it sure would be nice if people could have a pleasant discourse. It makes for a better read in general, I think.

Those egos that need massaging can always get their scratches itched by the testicle danglers at various pool events. There should not be a need for them to do so on this forum. Facebook is another vehicle where egos can shine and get all the massaging they need. :D

Again, this post is not directed at you, Lou; thus, the purpose of all the inserted smiley faces. :smile:
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I think the flippancy started with him saying "Thanks for agreeing Lou, no apology needed..." (And I must say that for a post not directed at me personally you sure used my name a lot in the above post :-)

Personally, JAM, I think it's great that known players participate here, so there's no ego thing going on there with the exception of those occasions when the known player thinks his word is gospel and others, though they may not have dedicated as much time to the sport, don't have valid insights. The problem I'm perceiving is that if the lesser players speaks up for himself without sufficient fawning there are the "what'd you know" posts, the "you don't play as good" posts, the "you should be grateful he's here" posts, the "that's why good players don't post here" posts, and (my favorite) "you're going to drive him away" posts. Even in your post, you're taking me, oh wait a minute... not me, to task for not being more respectful.

But as I have said before, the great thing about forums like these is that your ideas stand or fall on their merits and not because you've won the US Open or can run X number of balls. At least it should work that way but somewhat obviously others see it differently. Maybe it's because I go to a lot of tournaments and have been around and played champions I feel that they should be treated like everyone else, that's all. Like I said, no ego involved.

Having said all that and looking at the front page of AZ the last few days it is a bit much, IMO, to see so many self-promoting threads dedicated to one player. Maybe he needs his own forum :-o

In any case, now you've gone and done it. The Chef will be along any minute to scold us for straying even further off topic. Have a good one JAMster.

Lou Figueroa
 
lfigueroa said:
Probably you referring to rathole threads and that you seem to post a lot in the NPR forum -- home of many a rathole thread -- and where I don't see you chastising folks as threads alter course. A little more seriously, there's nothing wrong with a frank discussion about where the game is, has been, and is going. Sometimes that involves pointed questions and threads migrating from their starting point.

I suppose that if you don't like what's happening in a particular thread you can a) try to steer it back with a *thoughtful* on-topic post, or b) stop following the thread. Saying instead that those actually participating and enjoying the discussion have "ruined" the thread somehow, some way, and might even be against the survival of pool, is not so helpful.

Lou Figueroa
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Thanks for taking the time to answer that.

Jeff Livingston
 
lfigueroa said:
(snip) The Chef will be along any minute to scold us for straying even further off topic. Have a good one JAMster.

Lou Figueroa
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I'll try to remember not to post on threads you're in. If I accidentally do, please let me know about it so I can stop.

OK?

Jeff Livingston
 
lfigueroa said:
I think the flippancy started with him saying "Thanks for agreeing Lou, no apology needed..." (And I must say that for a post not directed at me personally you sure used my name a lot in the above post :-)

Personally, JAM, I think it's great that known players participate here, so there's no ego thing going on there with the exception of those occasions when the known player thinks his word is gospel and others, though they may not have dedicated as much time to the sport, don't have valid insights. The problem I'm perceiving is that if the lesser players speaks up for himself without sufficient fawning there are the "what'd you know" posts, the "you don't play as good" posts, the "you should be grateful he's here" posts, the "that's why good players don't post here" posts, and (my favorite) "you're going to drive him away" posts. Even in your post, you're taking me, oh wait a minute... not me, to task for not being more respectful.

But as I have said before, the great thing about forums like these is that your ideas stand or fall on their merits and not because you've won the US Open or can run X number of balls. At least it should work that way but somewhat obviously others see it differently. Maybe it's because I go to a lot of tournaments and have been around and played champions I feel that they should be treated like everyone else, that's all. Like I said, no ego involved.

Having said all that and looking at the front page of AZ the last few days it is a bit much, IMO, to see so many self-promoting threads dedicated to one player. Maybe he needs his own forum :-o

In any case, now you've gone and done it. The Chef will be along any minute to scold us for straying even further off topic. Have a good one JAMster.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...

Lou you are a big meanie. Trying to have an actual discussion based on reality and logic. You are whats wrong with pool today young man.
 
lfigueroa said:
I think the flippancy started with him saying "Thanks for agreeing Lou, no apology needed..." (And I must say that for a post not directed at me personally you sure used my name a lot in the above post :-)

Personally, JAM, I think it's great that known players participate here, so there's no ego thing going on there with the exception of those occasions when the known player thinks his word is gospel and others, though they may not have dedicated as much time to the sport, don't have valid insights. The problem I'm perceiving is that if the lesser players speaks up for himself without sufficient fawning there are the "what'd you know" posts, the "you don't play as good" posts, the "you should be grateful he's here" posts, the "that's why good players don't post here" posts, and (my favorite) "you're going to drive him away" posts. Even in your post, you're taking me, oh wait a minute... not me, to task for not being more respectful.

But as I have said before, the great thing about forums like these is that your ideas stand or fall on their merits and not because you've won the US Open or can run X number of balls. At least it should work that way but somewhat obviously others see it differently. Maybe it's because I go to a lot of tournaments and have been around and played champions I feel that they should be treated like everyone else, that's all. Like I said, no ego involved.

Having said all that and looking at the front page of AZ the last few days it is a bit much, IMO, to see so many self-promoting threads dedicated to one player. Maybe he needs his own forum :-o

In any case, now you've gone and done it. The Chef will be along any minute to scold us for straying even further off topic. Have a good one JAMster.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...

This really hit home with me. You want to see what happens when a no name banger, but the greatest undiscovered shot maker in the world(joke,sorta), questions the status quo, the voices of so called authorities, hang out in the aiming conversation thread. You will see who is massaging who's ego.
 
lfigueroa said:
I think the flippancy started with him saying "Thanks for agreeing Lou, no apology needed..." (And I must say that for a post not directed at me personally you sure used my name a lot in the above post :-)

Personally, JAM, I think it's great that known players participate here, so there's no ego thing going on there with the exception of those occasions when the known player thinks his word is gospel and others, though they may not have dedicated as much time to the sport, don't have valid insights. The problem I'm perceiving is that if the lesser players speaks up for himself without sufficient fawning there are the "what'd you know" posts, the "you don't play as good" posts, the "you should be grateful he's here" posts, the "that's why good players don't post here" posts, and (my favorite) "you're going to drive him away" posts. Even in your post, you're taking me, oh wait a minute... not me, to task for not being more respectful.

But as I have said before, the great thing about forums like these is that your ideas stand or fall on their merits and not because you've won the US Open or can run X number of balls. At least it should work that way but somewhat obviously others see it differently. Maybe it's because I go to a lot of tournaments and have been around and played champions I feel that they should be treated like everyone else, that's all. Like I said, no ego involved.

Having said all that and looking at the front page of AZ the last few days it is a bit much, IMO, to see so many self-promoting threads dedicated to one player. Maybe he needs his own forum :-o

In any case, now you've gone and done it. The Chef will be along any minute to scold us for straying even further off topic. Have a good one JAMster.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...

No ifs, ands, or buts, you, Lou, I admire the way you explain your position on a subject matter in a comprehensive manner. You must be a successful businessman in your personal life. Only those who know how to interact with the public can rock and roll their way to the top. The buffoons who are incapable of proper communication skills never succeed on their own volition.

Good post, Lou! :smile:
 
duckie said:
This really hit home with me. You want to see what happens when a no name banger, but the greatest undiscovered shot maker in the world(joke,sorta), questions the status quo, the voices of so called authorities, hang out in the aiming conversation thread. You will see who is massaging who's ego.
Click to expand...

Duckie, your post reminds me of a time when Keith McCready provided an instructional article on a pool shot for a publication. After he submitted the article, the editor called to say that their "house expert" stated there was no way that shot could be made the way Keith described it. They asked him to rewrite the description of the shot.

Keith was livid. He proceeded to show me the shot on our pool table, EXACTLY the way he wrote about it. The shot was executable exactly as written. He refused to change what he wrote.

He wanted to ask the editor, "How many tournaments as your house expert won?" but I advised against that. He was insulted that this house expert, who's never entered a tournament in his/her life, would question Keith's description of the shot.

A parallel I can make is that in MS-WORD software, there's several ways to achieve one function. If I want to CENTER a word in a document, I can do this several ways. Well, maybe there's several ways to aim, all accomplishing a successful end result. :smile:
 
It's better to try and not succeed than not try at all.

JAM said:
Why are you being so flippant to C.J., Lou? Sheesh! :embarrassed2:

I'm not trying to start a verbal war of words. You're probably one of the very minute few on this forum who is even capable of giving me a good debate via the written word. ;)

I don't know if it's this forum or what, but any time a known pool player posts on AzBilliards, they seem to have to defend their written word more so than the other members on AzBilliards. I'm not sure why, either. :frown:

I'm not talking about you, Lou, but in my opinion, there seems to be a lot of egos that need massaging on this forum from time to time, and when somebody steals their limelight, they go after that entity by dissecting their words and criticizing their stance on certain issues.

I realize, though, we all have our own opinions about various topics, but it sure would be nice if people could have a pleasant discourse. It makes for a better read in general, I think.

Those egos that need massaging can always get their scratches itched by the testicle danglers at various pool events. There should not be a need for them to do so on this forum. Facebook is another vehicle where egos can shine and get all the massaging they need. :D

Again, this post is not directed at you, Lou; thus, the purpose of all the inserted smiley faces. :smile:
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People like Lou, if they represent even a small group encourage me to try to help the Industy of pocket billiards more than ever. The economy in Dallas is still good and there are people that are with me that have money to spend on this Game. Sometimes negative people must be pulled along "kicking and screaming" for their own good. I have no idea what everyone has to gain or lose, but I would think just spending time on this forum that everyone at least wants to see something stimulating happen in the "World of Pool", even if it's just for entertainment. I'm going to dedicate the next 3 years of my life to it and I know in my "heart of hearts" that if I was able to generate over 50M in the bar/nightclub/billiard club business in one city it's possible to do it in Professional Pocket Billiards when the Whole World is the market. If I'm not correct, then at least the "Trip" will be a fun and exciting one for my life and when I'm old and no longer able to do what I can do now I'll have no regrets. To try and not succeed is better than to not try at all. ;) aloha
Let's TRY NOW
 
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You're only as old as you act...."get off my lawn CJ" LoL

JCIN said:
Lou you are a big meanie. Trying to have an actual discussion based on reality and logic. You are whats wrong with pool today young man.
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Lou's a young man? CLICK ON THIS Picture....I Can Help You With Your Game, the Main Problem is in your Left Foot and LEFT Arm Angle is Inconsistent ...you MUST pre set upper body angles BEFORE you get down...so your main problems are in your left side, which is controlled by the right side of your brain...it's the creative part and it needs attention......do the "no practice stroke drill" and I'll tell you what's next tomorrow.
 
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duckie said:
This really hit home with me. You want to see what happens when a no name banger, but the greatest undiscovered shot maker in the world(joke,sorta), questions the status quo, the voices of so called authorities, hang out in the aiming conversation thread. You will see who is massaging who's ego.
Click to expand...


(against my better judgement since duckie refuses to engage in a back-and-forth...) I'm there (Aiming Forum) and I do believe it is wrong the way your posts are pilloried on a regular basis. But part of that is your refusal to acknowledge comments and engage in a discussion after you post something that otherwise would make for interesting conversational departures.

Lou Figueroa
 
JAM said:
No ifs, ands, or buts, you, Lou, I admire the way you explain your position on a subject matter in a comprehensive manner. You must be a successful businessman in your personal life. Only those who know how to interact with the public can rock and roll their way to the top. The buffoons who are incapable of proper communication skills never succeed on their own volition.

Good post, Lou! :smile:
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Gracias, JAM. I like your stuff (most of it) too :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
cjssecrets4u2 said:
Lou's a young man? CLICK ON THIS Picture....I Can Help You With Your Game, the Main Problem is in your Left Foot and LEFT Arm Angle is Inconsistent ...you MUST pre set upper body angles BEFORE you get down...so your main problems are in your left side, which is controlled by the right side of your brain...it's the creative part and it needs attention......do the "no practice stroke drill" and I'll tell you what's next tomorrow.
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You know, I have to say, that despite what I am sure are nothing but the best of intentions, I am taken aback by the sheer audacity of this post of yours.

First off, I'm a amateur. I play a few hours a week. I have done and now do other things with my life besides play pool. As I have said before, most pros probably play more pool in a month than I do in a year.

Second, as an amateur who never plays on Diamonds but once or twice a year, I'm proud to be able to put up a 30, or whatever it was, on demand. It is not so easy. I once watch a pro at the DCC 14.1 Challenge plow through 12 tries in a row and *never once* get out of the second rack. So, for me, it was not so bad. (And I want to give a shout out to David "Blackjack" Sapolis for his kind commentary.)

Third, I am shocked by the pure hubris of you saying you can help me from watching that video. First: you do realize that that is a three year old video? I, like many others here, am constantly working on my game -- the player you see on that video is not the player I am today in terms of PSR, final setup, and playing capabilities. Second: are you somehow going to allot me more time to play pool? Maybe you are going to buy me a Diamond pro-cut table to practice on?

I will say this: you are close on the left side thing, but not completely right and certainly not for the reason you state (at least in my case). I figured the left side issue while I was playing Darren Appleton my first round at the US One Pocket Open in Vegas earlier this year. I made passing reference to it in my trip report, which you can read here http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=275274 when I say: "And it was most cool to play Appleton, a total gentleman, and very instructive in that I got a chance to watch his PSR and mechanics up close and from various angles. In fact, mid-match it dawned on me that he was doing something, mechanically, that I was not. So then, while in the chair, I started looking around the tournament arena and realized that it was something almost every great player in the room was was doing too. It was an 'a ha' moment."

Thanks though.

Lou Figueroa
 
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I'm really not sure who drew first blood but you both are good guys and this silliness needs to stop.
 
I really want you to play better and find enjoyment in pocket billiards

lfigueroa said:
You know, I have to say, that despite what I am sure are nothing but the best of intentions, I am taken aback by the sheer audacity of this post of yours.

First off, I'm a amateur. I play a few hours a week. I have done and now do other things with my life besides play pool. As I have said before, most pros probably play more pool in a month than I do in a year.

Second, as an amateur who never plays on Diamonds but once or twice a year, I'm proud to be able to put up a 30, or whatever it was, on demand. It is not so easy. I once watch a pro at the DCC 14.1 Challenge plow through 12 tries in a row and *never once* get out of the second rack. So, for me, it was not so bad. (And I want to give a shout out to David "Blackjack" Sapolis for his kind commentary.)

Third, I am shocked by the pure hubris of you saying you can help me from watching that video. First: you do realize that that is a three year old video? I, like many others here, am constantly working on my game -- the player you see on that video is not the player I am today in terms of PSR, final setup, and playing capabilities. Second: are you somehow going to allot me more time to play pool? Maybe you are going to buy me a Diamond pro-cut table to practice on?

I will say this: you are close on the left side thing, but not completely right and certainly not for the reason you state (at least in my case). I figured the left side issue while I was playing Darren Appleton my first round at the US One Pocket Open in Vegas earlier this year. I made passing reference to it in my trip report, which you can read here http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=275274 when I say: "And it was most cool to play Appleton, a total gentleman, and very instructive in that I got a chance to watch his PSR and mechanics up close and from various angles. In fact, mid-match it dawned on me that he was doing something, mechanically, that I was not. So then, while in the chair, I started looking around the tournament arena and realized that it was something almost every great player in the room was was doing too. It was an 'a ha' moment."

Thanks though.

Lou Figueroa
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Just trying to be of service....and yes, I can tell a lot from a video, and I really want you to play better and find enjoyment in pool and all things. :smile:
 
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