Tournament Situation

[naji]

I like that.

I might say, "In the future, don't forget to call those combos." and like you, if he smarts off with anything, I would call the ref and take the foul right there.

Now, how do I decide if his response has an attitude attached to it? No worries, I've experienced plenty of that before. :grin:

To warn someone about the rule defeats the purpose, in pool the mental game is very strong element, it is a test for those fall under pressure of the moment. Rob's memory failed him big time and he knew it, and he has to pay for it , big boys style, not kiddy pool!!. Ronnie on the other hand, is used to playing like that in his country, it is normal to him to call such a foul.
Again, i repeat, Rob's big fuss is what brought this up, otherwise, it would not be mentioned, it was not hill hill and the foul called, it was 5-6, Rob had chance to collect himself, but Ronnie the one who was not bothered a bit by this call and played as if nothing happened, and kept him away from the table, actually Ronnie gave him a chance at rack 11 or 12, he could have locked him behind a ball.
I agree on the part that Ronnie was wrong in cleaning the ball, Ref gave him warning and did not do it again, what else. If you want to call him a shark, Nit, cry baby..that is fine, but the combo call rule is legit, and a Ref would have called it if there was one 100% dedicated to the game.

 

[JoeyA]

To warn someone about the rule defeats the purpose, in pool the mental game is very strong element, it is a test for those fall under pressure of the moment. Rob's memory failed him big time and he knew it, and he has to pay for it , big boys style, not kiddy pool!!. Ronnie on the other hand, is used to playing like that in his country, it is normal to him to call such a foul.
Again, i repeat, Rob's big fuss is what brought this up, otherwise, it would not be mentioned, it was not hill hill and the foul called, it was 5-6, Rob had chance to collect himself, but Ronnie the one who was not bothered a bit by this call and played as if nothing happened, and kept him away from the table, actually Ronnie gave him a chance at rack 11 or 12, he could have locked him behind a ball.
I agree on the part that Ronnie was wrong in cleaning the ball, Ref gave him warning and did not do it again, what else. If you want to call him a shark, Nit, cry baby..that is fine, but the combo call rule is legit, and a Ref would have called it if there was one 100% dedicated to the game.

You're mistaken about Rob's big fuss. That's not what brought this up.

I brought this up WITHOUT MENTIONING the players names because it was controversial and I actually wanted to know what forum members thought about this.

Rob, didn't put up a big fuss imo. In fact, I didn't see him fuming much afterward other than a sarcastic hand clap for Ronnie.

I think Rob handled the aftermath quite well, at least from what I saw as did Ronnie.

Standards of behavior for pool are outlined in the Code Of Conduct Forum on AZ Billiard's website. Since there is no governing body which holds the players to specific standards, the players will have to decide in which manner they carry themselves. It is up to each person to work out their own salvation.

 

[TheNewSharkster]

When there is a chance to be honest, let it be in league or tournament, you have a chance to make a difference.

The bigger the stage, even more important.

Stuff like this happens when your 14 years old. Shame on anyone that pulls a move like this especially on a professional type of situation.

Can you imagine a young man coming up from nowhere and playing SVB who he idolizes and getting this move pulled on him on the hill.

I don't think this stuff sends a good message to the world about the game we love and endorse.

One thing for sure if I was the ref I would have told the player to get real.

There is noone in the world except Ronny that would side with Ronny.

Even if the rules read that way there needs to be some common sense interpretation......

Let's play real life pool. Keep the game right. It's up to us.

So you don't like the rule. Well maybe playing in a tournament that has this rule is a bad idea because you made it clear you have no intent of following the defined set of rules.

Listen, you cannot pick and choose which rules to follow and which to ignore. If the opponent hit the wrong ball are you going to let it slide because you are in a good mood? At the end of the day if you don't like the rules that is something that should be discussed with the TD. Or find a tournament that doesn't have this rule.

 

[alstl]

The rules state that you must call ALL combos, banks and caroms regardless of how obvious they are.

The ruling in the tournament was correct even though most players would never call it.

Robb got under Ronnie's skin early on when he had the tournament director come over and warn Ronnie about cleaning the cue ball right before Robb was about to break.

Ronnie retaliated by throwing the book at Robb.

I will be posting the video on my Youtube channel

Ray

Aha, there are two sides to every story.

Prior to reading this post my answer was going to be it depends on who my opponent is and whether he has pulled a move on me. In this case I won't be shedding any tears for Robb. Sounds like he was trying to get under Ronnie's skin and it backfired.

The question then becomes - If your opponent had called the tournament director on you for cleaning the cue ball, would you strictly enforce the rules on him? I would, guess that's just how I roll.

 

[Underclocked]

There is a time and place for things, rules included. If the shot was obvious (which it was), there was no need to call it, IMHO. Players that make a big deal out of the exact wording of a rule only when it's in their favor ... we have a name for them in these parts.

 

[TheNewSharkster]

There is a time and place for things, rules included. If the shot was obvious (which it was), there was no need to call it, IMHO. Players that make a big deal out of the exact wording of a rule only when it's in their favor ... we have a name for them in these parts.

The rules say you must call all combinations. So yes, there was a need to call it.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I think it's poor sportsmanship, plain and simple. Of course the ref has no choice but to call the foul. ...

I think it is not poor sportsmanship. I think it is an idiot TD action to set those rules. Given the idiot rules, play by them and don't get upset when others play by them.

 

[JoeyA]

I think it is not poor sportsmanship. I think it is an idiot TD action to set those rules. Given the idiot rules, play by them and don't get upset when others play by them.

Specifically what would you change in the rules (or otherwise) to make this situation palatable?

 

[Bob Jewett]

Specifically what would you change in the rules (or otherwise) to make this situation palatable?

Use the WSR.

 

[naji]

There is a time and place for things, rules included. If the shot was obvious (which it was), there was no need to call it, IMHO. Players that make a big deal out of the exact wording of a rule only when it's in their favor ... we have a name for them in these parts.

It is not a boy/girl friend game they are playing. The calling is test of one's ability to be alert and remember in pressure situation. Had they have a ref 100% of the time, ref would have call it not RA. Plus it was not hill hill, Rob could have recover but no match to RA skill. Rules says "call all combinations" it did not say do not call obvious combos. I bet you you call the 8 ball in 8 ball match no matter where it is wouldn't you why!!

 

[vagabond]

After I saw a womens finals match in BCA in (?) 1991 louisville,KY I became an opponent of the concept of " obvious shot/pocket" pockets need not be called. The match was played between MS. Orietta Strickland and a young women from Iowa with a German name. I don`t remember any details now. Orietta made a shot without calling the pocket. she argued that the shot was an obvious shot. Her opponent said that it was NOT obvious. The spectators including me did NOT think it was obvious shot. The ball went to a unrelated pocket. MS. Strickland won the game,set and the National title.
After seeing that, I became a big time opponent to the" Obvious pocket/shot". What is obvious to you is not obvious to me.
Why is this reluctancy/refusal to call the shot?

Even in a friendly game I will not let my opponent getaway with that kind of behavior. Once we agreed to play "call shot" rule there will not be any exceptions and I expect you to call every shot including on a ball that is hanging in the pocket and such expectation is NOT silly. It is respecting the game and respecting the rules, otherwise there is no difference between the player that refuses to call the shot and a criminal in the prison.

Many arguments between players were the result of poorly framed/written Rules

 

[smoooothstroke]

I think the rule is just fine like it is.

If you are playing a known "mover" then call more shots then you normally would.If you are playing a much less experienced player then yourself who might not see a shot as obvious then call that shot.

If all this fails and some1 pulls the move of saying you didn't call a shot that requires you to call something then you simply lie and state that you pointed with your cue.This way you can go back to just playing pool.

If someone calls you on not calling a shot and you know its not a "move" or attempt to win by cheating then just accept the rulling and sit and await your next turn.

 

[Snapshot9]

Obvious combo

I agree!!!!

The rule is stated for 'nonobvious' shots, I would warn him ONCE, and tell him it will be a called foul the second time it happened. I have had this come up in some tournaments I play, and I don't usually say anything in a weekly tournament or two, but I sure would in a special tournament with 64 players or more. This has been a rule, so to speak, since I have been playing pool more than 50 years ago.