U.S. Open Checks Bounced???

Well this happens what every year not like it's new...

I was just waiting for this to happen.

maybe if the players step in and demand... oh wait some already tried that route...
 
Really?? He didn't know he was $70,000 short? That tells us something, right?


your rite i was refering to the players not Barry. we just had our wires crossed. :)

hope your good,

Its sad but this could be the last US Open as it has been known, there will always be a 9Ball US Open, who owns it or promotes can change. ITS a successful franchise and has huge value. But it sadly has had difficulties the past few years. As have lots of businesses.

I dont have a horse in this race and its not my spot to take a side, i wont do that.

Personally I hope it works out for all parties involved and keeps going into the future, BB has done a great job for many years, the players who have placed well or won it have done a great job for years(we need the players), Pat Flemming, the different TD's (Scott and Ken), Jay Helfert. Jerry Forysyte(sorry about that Jerry;)) and others I havent listed. have over many years provided 1000's of hours of great matches and pool history. This years tournment was among the better US Opens in terms of the matches and who went deep (Efren Parika). SVB DRILLING EVERYONE, and dedicating his win to Chad. It Dont get any better. The sad part is the $$$ isnt working out. That 's sad and I hope it does come rite soon for everyone.

Thats my thoughts


best regards to everyone and congrats to them as well,

Eric :)
 
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The US Open 9ball Championship is a PONZI SCHEME.

It's been that way for over 10 years now.

Most of the time, the players used to get paid late, from the entry fees for NEXT year.

And people wonder why some die hard pool fans never go to this tournament anymore.

Such a joke.
 
your rite i was refering to the players not Barry. we just had our wires crossed. :)

hope your good,

Its sad but this could be the last US Open as it has been known, there will always be a 9Ball US Open, who owns it or promotes can change. ITS a successful franchise and has huge value. But it sadly has had difficulties the past few years. As have lots of businesses.

I dont have a horse in this race and its not my spot to take a side, i wont do that.

Personally I hope it works out for all parties involved and keeps going into the future, BB has done a great job for many years, the players who have placed well or won it have done a great job for years(we need the players), Pat Flemming, the different TD's (Scott and Ken), Jay Helfert. Jerry Forysyte(sorry about that Jerry;)) and others I havent listed. have over many years provided 1000's of hours of great matches and pool history. This years tournment was among the better US Opens in terms of the matches and who went deep (Efren Parika). SVB DRILLING EVERYONE, and dedicating his win to Chad. It Dont get any better. The sad part is the $$$ isnt working out. That 's sad and I hope it does come rite soon for everyone.

Thats my thoughts


best regards to everyone and congrats to them as well,

Eric :)
I do have a horse in this race and its the same horse as everyone else should have. PAY THE PLAYERS! like I said before if this was the first time I could understand to a point. Why should these players put out their money when the end result is they have to fight to get paid. Maybe BB should pay the top 16 players expenses (As a loan) then take it back out of their winnings when they get paid. That way the players don't come out of pocket. I imagine they would be getting paid if that was the case.
 
I think Barry is making a mistake with the added money, based on what he's saying.

He should just advertise the prize fund as being whatever the entry fees are plus, say, a % of the gross profit of the event. Maybe say a minimum of $10k added + % of the GP. That will help the event become solvent and sustain most unexpected situations. It also creates an incentive for pros to post on FB and Twitter and get people out to the event - as they'll be playing for more money.

The breakdown here is simple: The pros want to play for big money and feel it's the promoter's job to provide the funding for that in advance (i.e. "It's Barry's problem, not mine." Although it's true that IS Barry's problem, I think Barry WANTS to pay the players what they want and doesn't want to go backwards in payouts -- even if bumps in the road might send him into the red.

There are two kinds of tournaments: Sponsored events (where someone is putting up the cash and if 1 person shows up to watch, the players still get paid) and Business Events (where the tournament relies on goods sold, seating, food, vendor, etc, income in order to add the money as advertised).

Therefore, Barry should advertise his tournament as such--- reduce the added to $10k (which is STILL good) and offer a fair % of the gross profit of the event back to the players --- as if the players who cash are co-owners of the event. If the event goes WELL, they might make more than they would otherwise. If the event goes to crap, they still make their $10k + entry fees that go into the payoff pool.

Either way, that approach makes the tournament solvent and makes both Barry and the players equally responsible for the success of the event --- outside of the logistics/management, which would be handled by BB. If there's a natural disaster (I was there in 2001 --- 9/11 definitely affected the event to no fault of Barry's and there's no doubt Hurricane Sandy affected this event, also to no fault of Barry's), all get paid but are affected equally.

Is it right that people are critical of Barry for that? I think so, actually--- because Barry put himself in that position. If he would restructure future expectations and payout models, he'd never find himself in a corner again. In fact, if the players had a piece of the action, they might put forth effort to ensure people show and that there is an actual audience.

Since BB doesn't have national league players to pack-up the bleachers during national events, he needs to operate differently and within his means. I think if he took an "ESOP" approach to his tournament, the players might welcome the chance to have a play in the success of a business (tournament) which could result in growing the event to an entirely new level.

Start by giving players commission on tickets sold on top of the above. Whether you pay a billboard, a place mat in a diner or a radio spot-- advertising costs money. Why not divert that money to the players? Each pro on FB has THOUSANDS of friends that can be leveraged. If a ticket sells for $300 direct from BB, allow the pros to sell them as an affiliate and pocket $100/ticket for their effort. Although that lowers the overall revenue on tickets sold (based on the previous year's #), it should sky-rocket the total revenue based on volume. Now, not only do pros make money from the prize pool, if they sell 50 weekly tickets, they can pocket $5k (paid up front, as the transaction is made) before the event starts.

There are a ton of pros who struggle to pay their way to the open -- many would love that kind of opportunity. Based on many of the FB accounts, many would have NO problem moving tickets.

Anyways, sorry for the long rant. Barry --- if you're reading this-- you can double the size of your tournament if you think outside the box. The 1980's bet-on-the-come method of running your tournament isn't the move. Regardless of what caused the shortfall, it's your fault as a business owner since you didn't structure your business to be more dynamic.
 
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I thought the ABP suppose to take care of things like this?

Johnny told me (while he smothered toast with grits and cut up medium over eggs) "we were cut off at the balls". I didn't quite follow exactly why, but something to do with with sanctioning.
 
I do have a horse in this race and its the same horse as everyone else should have. PAY THE PLAYERS! like I said before if this was the first time I could understand to a point. Why should these players put out their money when the end result is they have to fight to get paid. Maybe BB should pay the top 16 players expenses (As a loan) then take it back out of their winnings when they get paid. That way the players don't come out of pocket. I imagine they would be getting paid if that was the case.

I agree, pay the players. But there isnt there, the $$ promised(what the press release said).
 
Pretty tough to get anyone to play if they have to speculate on whether they will be actually paying out the prize money..... need to make them lay it out on the table before the tournament??? Not too cool..... sounds like Hustling to me...
 
I agree, pay the players. But there isnt there, the $$ promised(what the press release said).
If you were to hold a tournament. Would you start the event if you didn't have the prize fund in place and all other incidentals? I am gonna guess that you would not as I hear you are a good businessman. I understand that things can come up that are not expected and those things will cut into the promoters profit, I repeat (THE PROMOTERS PROFIT) Even so I find it very hard to believe that over $70,000 worth of unexpected expense came along.
 
Has Danny Harriman been paid yet? Have we heard from him in this thread w/an I told you so?

Same story different year, kind of sad. I hope all get paid in a couple weeks as advertised, but this is not the first "advertisement" of this type now, is it?

Happy Halloween everyone.

Dave
 
Has Danny Harriman been paid yet? Have we heard from him in this thread w/an I told you so?

Same story different year, kind of sad. I hope all get paid in a couple weeks as advertised, but this is not the first "advertisement" of this type now, is it?

Happy Halloween everyone.

Dave
It being taken care of in 2 weeks is all the players can hope for but I think its a stall tactic. I do not believe a word he says as this has happened before and it took longer than that. Besides, he promised to pay the players at the end of the tourney and he didn't keep that promise. So what makes anyone thing he will keep this one?
 
Time to take those accountable to court..

I wonder how many folks worked the event for free..
could care less about Berry..

Berry this..Berry that..bagh..He's a loser..and the players
that show up know that..but hey..its the US Open.

I'd hope to see something different this year..
 
Has Danny Harriman been paid yet? Have we heard from him in this thread w/an I told you so?

Same story different year, kind of sad. I hope all get paid in a couple weeks as advertised, but this is not the first "advertisement" of this type now, is it?

Happy Halloween everyone.

Dave

What hapened to the prize money being escrowed. Wasn't that supposed to start last year?
 
Great Post

I think Barry is making a mistake with the added money, based on what he's saying.

He should just advertise the prize fund as being whatever the entry fees are plus, say, a % of the gross profit of the event. Maybe say a minimum of $10k added + % of the GP. That will help the event become solvent and sustain most unexpected situations. It also creates an incentive for pros to post on FB and Twitter and get people out to the event - as they'll be playing for more money.

The breakdown here is simple: The pros want to play for big money and feel it's the promoter's job to provide the funding for that in advance (i.e. "It's Barry's problem, not mine." Although it's true that IS Barry's problem, I think Barry WANTS to pay the players what they want and doesn't want to go backwards in payouts -- even if bumps in the road might send him into the red.

There are two kinds of tournaments: Sponsored events (where someone is putting up the cash and if 1 person shows up to watch, the players still get paid) and Business Events (where the tournament relies on goods sold, seating, food, vendor, etc, income in order to add the money as advertised).

Therefore, Barry should advertise his tournament as such--- reduce the added to $10k (which is STILL good) and offer a fair % of the gross profit of the event back to the players --- as if the players who cash are co-owners of the event. If the event goes WELL, they might make more than they would otherwise. If the event goes to crap, they still make their $10k + entry fees that go into the payoff pool.

Either way, that approach makes the tournament solvent and makes both Barry and the players equally responsible for the success of the event --- outside of the logistics/management, which would be handled by BB. If there's a natural disaster (I was there in 2001 --- 9/11 definitely affected the event to no fault of Barry's and there's no doubt Hurricane Sandy affected this event, also to no fault of Barry's), all get paid but are affected equally.

Is it right that people are critical of Barry for that? I think so, actually--- because Barry put himself in that position. If he would restructure future expectations and payout models, he'd never find himself in a corner again. In fact, if the players had a piece of the action, they might put forth effort to ensure people show and that there is an actual audience.

Since BB doesn't have national league players to pack-up the bleachers during national events, he needs to operate differently and within his means. I think if he took an "ESOP" approach to his tournament, the players might welcome the chance to have a play in the success of a business (tournament) which could result in growing the event to an entirely new level.

Start by giving players commission on tickets sold on top of the above. Whether you pay a billboard, a place mat in a diner or a radio spot-- advertising costs money. Why not divert that money to the players? Each pro on FB has THOUSANDS of friends that can be leveraged. If a ticket sells for $300 direct from BB, allow the pros to sell them as an affiliate and pocket $100/ticket for their effort. Although that lowers the overall revenue on tickets sold (based on the previous year's #), it should sky-rocket the total revenue based on volume. Now, not only do pros make money from the prize pool, if they sell 50 weekly tickets, they can pocket $5k (paid up front, as the transaction is made) before the event starts.

There are a ton of pros who struggle to pay their way to the open -- many would love that kind of opportunity. Based on many of the FB accounts, many would have NO problem moving tickets.

Anyways, sorry for the long rant. Barry --- if you're reading this-- you can double the size of your tournament if you think outside the box. The 1980's bet-on-the-come method of running your tournament isn't the move. Regardless of what caused the shortfall, it's your fault as a business owner since you didn't structure your business to be more dynamic.

I was just thinking the same thing. Justin from TAR is always preaching about the players having a some skin in the events. Here would be an ideal model for both the promoter and players to prosper if both sides could do their part.
 
What hapened to the prize money being escrowed. Wasn't that supposed to start last year?
I think that the players thought it was being escrowed. That also could be just the entry fees though. The added money obviously was not so who was supposed to hold the added money? BB or BCA?
 
There definitely needs to be a change. His business model is simply not working. I love this game/sport and I do not like seeing these marvelously gifted players being treated this way.
 
BCA escrow

I thought the monies were in Escrow by the BCA. What happened then?

Yes, the BCA does escrow the entry fees, and then they release the funds to BB during Open.

With a field of 230 players the BCA would have collected appx. 115K, and to my understanding provides a report to BB and ABP to let them know how much funds have been collected and are available.

The BCA began to escrow the funds last year to help make the process more transparent for the players. The BCA simply doesn't have the bandwidth to send someone to personally cut checks to every player, only to get stiffed by BB as well. The BCA does this as a FREE service for the Players and for the Open.

What Barry does with the money when he gets it, is, well, up to Barry.
 
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