WRISTS - The "hidden power catalyst" of a great stroke or "just along for the ride"?

New DVD

CJ

I hope you can get the new DVD's in the mail before wisking away to beautiful sunny downtown London. :smile:

John
 
DTL said:
You had used that quote with my name tagged to it by mistake and we got it cleared up, see our previous post. But then CJ saw the same quote (with my name STILL tagged to it) and made a response post .......2nd time it was used with my name on it, see post #1484. It's no biggy, just setting the record straight. :)
Click to expand...

Mr. DTL,

I got you. Sorry again that my 'boo boo' caused you a bit of hassle.

Best Regards,
 
Last edited:
i don't mean to come across as a dick CJ, but I don't see you using the TOI hardly at all in the Miserk match. I see you use a lot of stun shots and the cue ball reacting exactly like a stun shot and not like it is being deflected. I see clear inside english being used also.
 
Pay Up Sucker said:
i don't mean to come across as a dick CJ, but I don't see you using the TOI hardly at all in the Miserk match. I see you use a lot of stun shots and the cue ball reacting exactly like a stun shot and not like it is being deflected. I see clear inside english being used also.
Click to expand...

I've been working with it for several weeks and can tell when another player is using it by the reaction of the cue ball. Before I started using a TOI, I thought the same thing about many top players. I thought they used spin better than I did. Now I understand what they were doing with the cue ball.

In the Mizerak match, CJ is using a TOI on most of his shots. Until you spend committed time to practicing with it, it is hard to see when a player is using it. It becomes familiar when you know what you are looking at on each shot.

It's not a mystery or a secret. It's public knowledge, but like anything the details and subtleties are lost without experiencing it.

Best,
Mike
 
I know what to look for Mike, i tried this technique out when CJ first talked about it in the aiming thread a while back and do it here and there on different types of shots when fooling around.

First game in the miserak match

1st shot: outside center.
2nd shot: center ball a touch high - This maybe the only one with a TOI?
3rd shot: center ball with a tip high
4th: low inside english
5th stop shot
6th: half tip low
7th: low inside english
8th: high inside english

I see the cue ball reacting normal on all shots and no signs of deflection at all lol :) Are you seeing the cue ball move away from the ob with this floating away effect in that game? :)
 
Last edited:
Pay Up Sucker said:
I know what to look for Mike, i tried this technique out when CJ first talked about it in the aiming thread a while back and do it here and there on different types of shots when fooling around.

First game in the miserak match

1st shot: outside center.
2nd shot: center ball with a half tip high - This maybe the only one with a TOI?
3rd shot: center ball with a tip high
4th: low inside english
5th stop shot
6th: half tip low
7th: low inside english
8th: high inside english

I see the cue ball reacting normal on all shots and no signs of deflection at all lol :) Are you seeing the cue ball move away from the ob with this floating away effect in that game? :)
Click to expand...

Check out this previous post of mine. I see it a little different after several weeks of using a TOI on 80-90% of my shots...http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?p=3874908#post3874908

Best,
Mike
 
Can you use the TOI without getting the cue ball floating away effect, he maybe inside but its not enough to be noticeable to the eye. I think cj plays that way and keeps the deflection to a very very minimum and only really deflects it when he needs that floating away position for his next shot. He can really regulate the amount of deflection on a given shot.. what do you think? He likes to use that slow drag shot or kill shot quite often and that is where that cue ball floating effect could be coming from?
 
Last edited:
Mikjary said:
I've been working with it for several weeks and can tell when another player is using it by the reaction of the cue ball. Before I started using a TOI, I thought the same thing about many top players. I thought they used spin better than I did. Now I understand what they were doing with the cue ball.

In the Mizerak match, CJ is using a TOI on most of his shots. Until you spend committed time to practicing with it, it is hard to see when a player is using it. It becomes familiar when you know what you are looking at on each shot.

It's not a mystery or a secret. It's public knowledge, but like anything the details and subtleties are lost without experiencing it.

Best,
Mike
Click to expand...

Mike you are definitely getting it... It's pretty hard to notice unless you have hit the shots with TOI and know what to expect out of the cueball... Once you start doing it you will start seeing it... It's back to what Danny D. always says.. "If he knew what he didn't know he wouldn't not know it..." I think you are starting to know it... Congrats!

Chris
 
The Renfro said:
Mike you are definitely getting it... It's pretty hard to notice unless you have hit the shots with TOI and know what to expect out of the cueball... Once you start doing it you will start seeing it... It's back to what Danny D. always says.. "If he knew what he didn't know he wouldn't not know it..." I think you are starting to know it... Congrats!

Chris
Click to expand...

This technique should not take more than one afternoon to master? Mike is trying to stretch it beyond its limits i think lol :) This technique has its limits and you can see it on CJ's matches. You guys are going to force me into mastering this technique when i don't want to lol
 
Last edited:
Pay Up Sucker said:
This technique should not take more than one afternoon to master? Mike is trying to stretch it beyond its limits i think lol :) This technique has its limits and you can see it on CJ's matches. You guys are going to force me into mastering this technique when i don't want to lol
Click to expand...

Interesting.

Wasn't it you that said a while back that using delection to pocket balls was impractical? Or something like that... & now you're going to master it in one afternoon.

Very interesting.
 
Pay Up Sucker said:
This technique should not take more than one afternoon to master? Mike is trying to stretch it beyond its limits i think lol :) This technique has its limits and you can see it on CJ's matches. You guys are going to force me into mastering this technique when i don't want to lol
Click to expand...

read this sherlock :wink: you know what is also amusing, i am one of a few guys on here that could master this technique lol ;)
 
Last edited:
Pay Up Sucker said:
read this sherlock :wink: you know what is also amusing, i am one of a few guys on here that could master this technique lol ;)
Click to expand...

Allrighty then. If you are ONE of the few, then just who are you?

I know one thing, that's a fairly arrogant & condescending statement.
 
Pay Up Sucker said:
I know what to look for Mike, i tried this technique out when CJ first talked about it in the aiming thread a while back and do it here and there on different types of shots when fooling around.

First game in the miserak match

1st shot: outside center.
2nd shot: center ball a touch high - This maybe the only one with a TOI?
3rd shot: center ball with a tip high
4th: low inside english
5th stop shot
6th: half tip low
7th: low inside english
8th: high inside english

I see the cue ball reacting normal on all shots and no signs of deflection at all lol :) Are you seeing the cue ball move away from the ob with this floating away effect in that game? :)
Click to expand...
I wonder if it is you that transcribed the first rack or CJ told you what he used there?
 
It was just me and I could be wrong and have been many times and I maybe pushing CJ into a rage soon lol but I am not afraid to throw my opinion out there and discuss things they way I see them lol :) I have shot the technique and after the second shot (made them both), I could see what the cue ball was doing. I do not know why I am being told I have to spend hours and hours on the technique, I know it already. I understand the perception of opening the pocket by targeting a specific zone in the pocket. I understand the deflection part and the cue balls slightly different tangent line.The kill shot or slow drag shot that also has a big factor on the cue ball that makes it seem like it floats away. I can tell you now unless all the balls break perfect you are not going to run the table out using the TOI on every shot, Cj know this :wink:
 
Last edited:
"The moment of Truth is the moment of contact." CJ Wiley

Mikjary said:
I find that accelerating throught the stroke on softer shots doesn't necessarily mean a harder hit cue ball. The tendency when hitting softer shots for some people (not necessarily you) is to slow down the end of the stroke and eliminate speed off of the cue ball. This hurts the TOI cue ball deflection and changes the shot angles.

If I want to shoot a softer shot with a TOI, I make sure my forward stroke starts out slowly enough that I can continue through the cue ball and get the feeling of acceleration. It's a Jedi mind trick. It takes a little thought to think like this, but it pays off with the TOI.

I can almost slow roll balls with a TOI doing this. I've experimented with it and gotten used to the deflection at different speeds. Also, the swerve can be a factor on longer soft draw shots depending on each shooter's cue elevation.

Let's see what CJ says about all this.

Best,
Mike
Click to expand...

You are experiencing it correctly. This is why I can't describe some of these feeling without you experiencing them first. It becomes a totally different game, however, trying to explain specifically why is the challenge.

I do feel like I accelerate on all my shots and that's why the "stun shot" becomes such an important "weapon". It's all about accuracy first because the entire shot hinges on precisely striking the cue ball. "The moment of Truth is the moment of contact." CJ Wiley
 
from my experience those "few" will be extremely difficult to beat.

Pay Up Sucker said:
It was just me and I could be wrong and have been many times and I maybe pushing CJ into a rage soon lol but I am not afraid to throw my opinion out there and discuss things they way I see them lol :) I have shot the technique and after the second shot (made them both), I could see what the cue ball was doing. I do not know why I am being told I have to spend hours and hours on the technique, I know it already. I understand the perception of opening the pocket by targeting a specific zone in the pocket. I understand the deflection part and the cue balls slightly different tangent line.The kill shot or slow drag shot that also has a big factor on the cue ball that makes it seem like it floats away. I can tell you now unless all the balls break perfect you are not going to run the table out using the TOI on every shot, Cj know this :wink:
Click to expand...

I like to play "The Ghost" 15 Ball rotation where, after the break I take any one ball off the table. This leaves 12-14 balls on the table to run in rotation order. I can only beat this game playing the TOI method and have no chance any other way.

I use it on most of the shots, unless I'm slow rolling, staight in or changing the angle off a rail. The whole key to this is actually Mastering the shot you play with most of the time. It takes more than a few days to totally master a shot, and if you don't try to master one I can safely say you won't ever do it.

Mastering one type of shot that you can count on to "cinch" a key ball is very important. If you truly do this it will bring the rest of your game up because you will find a common denominator between the shot you've mastered and how you hit the "other shots".

When you hit a variety of shots you never truly master any one of them because you won't use them enough. This is common sense in other things, however "few" seems to connect it to pool. And I will tell you, from my experience those "few" will be extremely difficult to beat. ;)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top