Yes, I actually care what others think of me...see, I don't think that highly of you right now, but I'm sure you don't care.
If you foul, but your opponent doesn't see it, should you call it on yourself?
- Thread starter ChrisBanks
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Yes, I actually care what others think of me...see, I don't think that highly of you right now, but I'm sure you don't care.
If you accidentally tap the cue ball or something, that's an honest mistake... obviously not cheating.
But the instant you decide not to call it, you're now cheating. And you seem to feel that if the stakes are high, that's OK.
You are pretending you think it's not really cheating, but if it's not, then why would you refuse to do it in a friendly game and consider doing it for 50k? That's ass backwards. If it's OK to do for 50k, then it should be even more OK to do just for fun.
But you seem to know right from wrong, and you're basically saying "if the money's right, yes, I'll cheat."
Once again, reading comprehension my friend. I never said it was ok, I clearly stated that I have played a set for 5k and fouled when my opponent didnt see it, and I picked up the cueball and handed it to him. What I am saying is with something like 50k on the line I don't know if anyone here can really say for certain they would abide by the same moral code. I don't know if I personally would.... 50k is a lot of money and if someone else isn't paying attention for that kind of cheese then maybe they are just a fish. And as the saying goes "if you let a fish keep his money, then you are the fish".
I am pretty sure the whole point of this post in the first place is to really get a true answer from people. And if people are being honest with themselves then I would be hardprest to find someone that could Honestly tell themselves that they would be honorable in any situation, I am sure many people here would like to say they would, or think they would try to... But are they really being truthful to themselves.
It's your job to pay attention to the game even when not shooting. I'll never lie when someone asks did I just foul or calls a foul..but you need to pay attention to the game. This isn't golf where you call a foul on yourself because your opponent is on the other side of the fairway..your right beside the table. Pay attention to what's happening or pay the price. I have more then once and never cried about it afterwards...nor felt I was cheated.
Now do I do it in a fun game sure..when you and your friends are chatting and no one is really paying attention just knocking balls around. Sure I'll let them know I fouled because it's a more relaxed situation.
You are correct, in that no one can predict how they will react in a given hypothetical situation.
But that shouldn't stop us from striving to take the high road. It also shouldn't give you (or anyone) license to mock those who do try to do the right thing, or like to think they will.
I call my fouls. As I never have gambled for more than a beer, I cannot fathom playing pool for $5000, much less for $50,000. But I hope that I would uphold my morals were I ever in that situation.
Continue to mock folks, I expect it gives you a chuckle. Doing the right thing usually makes me feel good, too.
Shooting the 6-ball, for example, with the 2-ball on the table is a foul, independent of what happened earlier in the game, and can be called at that point -- the foul then is shooting the 6 out of order, not shooting the 3 out of order. It's not what you called a "continuing foul," it's just a foul that can be called on its own.
What do you think should happen? Should S go through the balls in order after the original mistake and pocket the 9-ball for the win, with the 2-ball still on the table? So if you skip a ball and it's not called it's the same as originally pocketing it in order? But what if S misses, say, the 6-ball -- does the opponent now have to go back and shoot the 2-ball or is it forgiven for him as well? What if he does go back to the 2-ball but misses it -- does S now have to shoot it whereas he didn't have to a couple innings ago? Your analysis doesn't make sense to me.
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YOU ARE CORRECT! Brain cramp on my part.
So now I have to join Rick Perry in saying...."Ooops."
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I think that S should notice the 2 ball about the time he is on the 6, shoot the 6 and play position for both the 2 and the 7 and then start to line up on the 7 and quickly turn and shoot the 2. (And play shape on the 7.) That should lead to an "earnest discussion."
As I said before, things go more smoothly if both players try to make sure that all the rules are followed on every shot.
No Creedo, what he is saying is ""if the money's right, I'll consider cheating".
Sure we can predict how we will act in any given situation. I know myself, I'm sure you guys know yourselves as well.
Oh, man, know thyself and thou shall know the Universe and the Gods
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Yes, traffic flows more smoothly when drivers all decide to observe red lights...
My last thoughts on this:
If we can't say that we would not cheat at a mere game that involves putting spheres into holes (for any amount of money wagered!), then we as a human race have bigger fish to fry...
If we can't say that we would not cheat at a mere game that involves putting spheres into holes (for any amount of money wagered!), then we as a human race have bigger fish to fry...
Likewise, my friend!
Aha! Lawful and foxy!
If I'm playing poker and have a bad hand, I can fold or I can bluff.
If I bluff and convince my opponent that I have strong cards when in fact I do not....am I cheating? There is clearly an element of deception but he has the opportunity to call the bluff!
I am unaware of any rule in poker that says you cannot do this and therefore do not consider it cheating. In fact, this behavior is commonplace.
If i call the foul on myself in pool, I'm essentially folding.
If I don't call the foul on myself but allow my opponent the opportunity to call the foul I'm essentially bluffing.
I am unaware of any rule in pool that says you cannot do this.
So, why do so many accept this behavior for poker but consider it cheating in pool?
I was playing a strong player in league and the competition was tight. My opponent double tapped the cue ball when he stroked his shot. He didn't immediately sit down so I called the foul and played out the game. I can assure you, had I not caught the foul and he continued to play, I would not have considered it cheating or dishonorable. It is upon me to be involved in the game and not to blame my opponent when I lose sight or focus on my objective.
If I bluff and convince my opponent that I have strong cards when in fact I do not....am I cheating? There is clearly an element of deception but he has the opportunity to call the bluff!
I am unaware of any rule in poker that says you cannot do this and therefore do not consider it cheating. In fact, this behavior is commonplace.
If i call the foul on myself in pool, I'm essentially folding.
If I don't call the foul on myself but allow my opponent the opportunity to call the foul I'm essentially bluffing.
I am unaware of any rule in pool that says you cannot do this.
So, why do so many accept this behavior for poker but consider it cheating in pool?
I was playing a strong player in league and the competition was tight. My opponent double tapped the cue ball when he stroked his shot. He didn't immediately sit down so I called the foul and played out the game. I can assure you, had I not caught the foul and he continued to play, I would not have considered it cheating or dishonorable. It is upon me to be involved in the game and not to blame my opponent when I lose sight or focus on my objective.
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ChrisBanks
Banned
Interesting concept. Can we get some others to respond to this?
Fouling in pool is not analogous to bluffing in poker. In the former, you're essentially violating the rules/regulations of the game, in the latter you're simply betting higher than one would expect given the value of your hand. A more accurate analogy would be fouling in pool versus claiming to have a flush when you have 4 diamonds and a heart and waiting for someone else to point out the problem.
Or to put it more simply: you're comparing apples and oranges.