Swanee 2013:: No jump cues?
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Seen him do it many times. Rafael is one of the best in the world with a full cue. I made him look silly on my shop table though when I handed him a famous brand cue and told him to jump and he could barely get the cue ball off the table.
It was from him that I learned how to refine my own technique for full cue jumping and improve my range of shots.
Guy like Rafael is even MORE dangerous with a jump cue.
If you haven't had that kind of exposure, which I have been fortunate to have, then how could you know? If you had then I doubt you would be in disagreement with me. I mean I don't see how you could be if you had that type of experience.
Yes, you mean like working at the worlds largest pool school on the planet...and working with no less that five HOF'ers.... yep, thanks... I'll try to get more experience :wink:
You are not the only one that has experience, but you kinda of just assume nobody else does, and then throw yours out there as "well, see, here is my proof, if only you did you would know I'm right".... so excuse me if I don't bow to you and thank you for your insight, no matter how wrong it is......
We are never gonna agree, so I'm not going to convice you and you can stop convincing me.... we agree to disagree....
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Jump or not to jump?
I've only been playing competively for 4 years or so, I've had to learn to jump because of the advantage I would give away if I didn't know how to jump. Some tournaments don't allow it so you have to learn 2 or 3 rail kicks they're are so many different aspects to each discipline, which keeps me learning. I love jumping 1/4 ball with my shooting cue but need a lot of practice jumping a full ball w my shooting cue. Establish any set of rules stick by them. But please don't make all tourneys or leagues the same. Learn as many disciplines as you can and create new ones, challenges create new ideas. I love great safeties and have learned to take'm to the church for good jumpers and the opposite for guys that kick like mules. Its all a challenge, at least thats my outlook. I got beat cuz I let him back to the table kinda view. It maybe rose colored in my eyes but thats how I prefer it.
I've only been playing competively for 4 years or so, I've had to learn to jump because of the advantage I would give away if I didn't know how to jump. Some tournaments don't allow it so you have to learn 2 or 3 rail kicks they're are so many different aspects to each discipline, which keeps me learning. I love jumping 1/4 ball with my shooting cue but need a lot of practice jumping a full ball w my shooting cue. Establish any set of rules stick by them. But please don't make all tourneys or leagues the same. Learn as many disciplines as you can and create new ones, challenges create new ideas. I love great safeties and have learned to take'm to the church for good jumpers and the opposite for guys that kick like mules. Its all a challenge, at least thats my outlook. I got beat cuz I let him back to the table kinda view. It maybe rose colored in my eyes but thats how I prefer it.
u need a better saftey then,if you lock someone up they cant jump.i'm sick of people playn safe with just an interference ball and when you jump they cry...lolIf you play solid safes jumping is mostly eradicated,and i can jump excellent...and i can kick excellent also
No.
God forbid that the rules of a sport are such that the more skillful players are more likely to win.
But that is patenly unfair for the "skill challenged", and the ACLU could get involved, and then take away all of pool's money.... oh wait, never mind
No jump cues at Swanee
Just an FYI-
The Swanee has not allowed jump cues since way back.
I believe no jumps cues have been an established policy for the Swanson since 1996-1997.
We also started the 'rack your own' back in the 3rd year.
There is a lot of debate about use of jump cues. I personally don't like them.
Mark griffin
Just an FYI-
The Swanee has not allowed jump cues since way back.
I believe no jumps cues have been an established policy for the Swanson since 1996-1997.
We also started the 'rack your own' back in the 3rd year.
There is a lot of debate about use of jump cues. I personally don't like them.
Mark griffin
I have nothing against jumping, do it with your playing stick. Like I said, a 12 yr old can jump a full ball with a decent jump stick within 30 seconds of touching one. Better safeties meaning I should move a cue ball 16 feet to hide it and do it so it's within 2 inches of another ball that covers it fully so some guy that had a $100 or even less to spend on a trick cue can't pop over the ball with as much ease as putting on a pair of velcro shoes? I don't think so.
I don't think I have ever been to a real tournament where they just said "no jumping", just "no jump cues". Any no jumping rule usually comes from the room owner during local tournaments.
Do me a favor: if jumping is SOOOO easy, and can be learned SOOOO quickly, how about uploading us a video where you use a jump cue, and jump in all your shots? Break and run out a rack of 10 ball, but before each shot, place an impeding ball in your shot line. I would be impressed. So impressed, I would start a World Committee On the Destruction of All Jump Cues (the WCODAJC), and begin by destroying mine, on video.
Hitting the ball and making it with shape for the next one are different things. If there was a rule that you can use a jump cue but HAD to make the ball or it's a foul, I don't think I'd say no to that. I'd probably put money up playing even against anyone if the only cue they could use was a jump cue and had to jump every shot.
Plus, I don't own a jump cue, my son does
The first time I EVER used a jump cue was when I bought his. I hopped over a ball the first time I tried it. And the next 4 tries. He took 2 tries to go over about 3/4 of a ball. At 12.I do have to say the jump cues sure do entertain the kids. They should sell them in party shops next to the hello kitty stickers for goodie bags.
The reason for NOT allowing specialized jump cues... it takes skill to jump with a playing cue and does not cheapen safety play nor does it reward someone when they hook themselves on a shot by allowing them an easier way to pocket the ball anyway.
The reasons for allowing jump cues? From what I see... It's easier to jump that way. Maybe it would balance out a 2x4 case if you only own one cue so you're not walking crooked?
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Oh my apologies then. I did assume that you didn't have the same type of experience that I have had with the way you are talking about the comparisons in kicking and jumping instruction.
Well yes, then certainly we must agree to disagree. I have to say though that I would be more than happy to spend some time with you and help you to learn how to teach people to kick in a shorter time than you are currently able to and perhaps in person I could demonstrate some of the nuances of jumping that I appreciate. Maybe after a nice discussion we could both change our perspectives a little.
Hitting the ball and making it with shape for the next one are different things. If there was a rule that you can use a jump cue but HAD to make the ball or it's a foul, I don't think I'd say no to that.
Plus, I don't own a jump cue, my son does
I do have to say the jump cues sure does entertain the kids. They should sell them in party shops next to the hello kitty stickers for goodie bags.
Actually this is a perfect example of WHY jump cues SHOULD be allowed. Hopping over the ball is only the very basic shot in jumping like hitting the cue ball straight down the table.
I will bet you couldn't do these shots on your first try. In fact I HAVE bet a lot of people $99 that they could not do them on their first try.
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCDAE91F25C56ADDC&feature=view_all
You seem to think that the number of tries a person takes is an indicator of how hard or easy a task is. Hate to break it to you but I have seen people draw table length on the first try and then spend months trying to figure out how they did it.
Perhaps if you had more skill then you could have not only "hopped" the ball with accuracy but you could also teach your 12 year old how to do it as well.
Anyway, video video video
All of the anti-jump cue crowd's objections will be addressed and any time this topic comes up, about three times a year, I can just post the video answering all the objections at one time.
The issue with those shots is that they should be pretty much impossible to do. It's only a trick cue that allows someone to do those shots. I probably could not do many of the magic tricks people pull off either if they gave me the same equipment they use. But I'm willing to bet if you take away the trick cards and hidden strings, they could not either.
I don't think the jump cue has done anything to advance the game to a higher level. Leather cue tip over wood, yep. Nice rubber on tables to allow for even banks, yep. Jump cues are like playing with those lines you can turn on in Virtual Pool, sure it's easier and you can do some fancy cut shots, but what's the point? Like cheating on a test, you can study, pay attention to get a good grade, or just pay some guy $50 for the answers.
I don't think the jump cue has done anything to advance the game to a higher level. Leather cue tip over wood, yep. Nice rubber on tables to allow for even banks, yep. Jump cues are like playing with those lines you can turn on in Virtual Pool, sure it's easier and you can do some fancy cut shots, but what's the point? Like cheating on a test, you can study, pay attention to get a good grade, or just pay some guy $50 for the answers.
Actually this is a perfect example of WHY jump cues SHOULD be allowed. Hopping over the ball is only the very basic shot in jumping like hitting the cue ball straight down the table.
I will bet you couldn't do these shots on your first try. In fact I HAVE bet a lot of people $99 that they could not do them on their first try.
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLCDAE91F25C56ADDC&feature=view_all
You seem to think that the number of tries a person takes is an indicator of how hard or easy a task is. Hate to break it to you but I have seen people draw table length on the first try and then spend months trying to figure out how they did it.
Perhaps if you had more skill then you could have not only "hopped" the ball with accuracy but you could also teach your 12 year old how to do it as well.
Anyway, video video video
snooker has a rule that you can not leave the table surface intentionally trying to evade a ball. this I believe pool should incorporate
I dislike the jump cue and personally think it cheapens the game. kicking is much harder to perform accurately. jumping, because it's easier to insure a good hit therefore no ball in hand, damages the art of finding the ball rail first
... if you do allow jumping it should be done with your normal playing cue
just my opinion of 50 years of playng pool people so don't get your feathers ruffled
Billy
So let me get this straight:
Those of you who wish to ban jump cues feel that
a) jumping is too easy
b) kicking is harder
Right?
Well then, let's make the game tougher in every way. Let's make a rule that you can't take more than one practice stroke during shooting, because taking more makes your shot easier. Also, Let's make a rule that you have to shoot using only one foot on the ground, because let's face it, a 12 year old can shoot using BOTH feet. Also, whenever you shoot a shot, the cue ball and object ball may never collide with any rails, ever. Because let's face it, any idiot can use the rails. It's too easy that way.
You all have the mentality that ANYTHING that makes the game easier in ANY way is bad. So I say put away the custom cue, shoot with a warped house cue, and you have to turn off the lights above the table. Because let's face it, any idiot 12 year old can shoot with the lights ON.
you should never allow a sport as skillful as pool to be made easier
yes, that's my opinion
i agree with this post
I dislike the jump cue and personally think it cheapens the game. kicking is much harder to perform accurately. jumping, because it's easier to insure a good hit therefore no ball in hand, damages the art of finding the ball rail first
... if you do allow jumping it should be done with your normal playing cue
^^^^^^^^^^ this post says it al ................ exept this >>>> They need to pile evry jump cue in a big field & have a good bon fire ........ Learn to use the rails & kick @ balls its part of the game........ I personly would raither watch a great kick shot or a great kick saftey than to watch a guy break the short stick out & play leap frog .........:thumbup:
I dislike the jump cue and personally think it cheapens the game. kicking is much harder to perform accurately. jumping, because it's easier to insure a good hit therefore no ball in hand, damages the art of finding the ball rail first
... if you do allow jumping it should be done with your normal playing cue
^^^^^^^^^^ this post says it al ................ exept this >>>> They need to pile evry jump cue in a big field & have a good bon fire ........ Learn to use the rails & kick @ balls its part of the game........ I personly would raither watch a great kick shot or a great kick saftey than to watch a guy break the short stick out & play leap frog .........:thumbup:
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I think you and others are missing the point. JUMPING itself is not easy, using jump sticks is. And you can take any idea to the extremes. I think pro basketball is too easy, they sctore a 100 points a game and they are too tall! They should all play with 40 lb weights on their ankles and the court will be covered with pig grease. Spectators will be allowed to throw knives at them so they'd have to run in zig zag patterns across the court to avoid getting hit.
That's the issue with saying that jump cues should not be used in pro events. Someone is bound to expand it to things like straight cues and having the players have good eyesight. Should be blind all pro players in one eye to make it harder also? Maybe break a few fingers before play begins?
That's the issue with saying that jump cues should not be used in pro events. Someone is bound to expand it to things like straight cues and having the players have good eyesight. Should be blind all pro players in one eye to make it harder also? Maybe break a few fingers before play begins?
Accidentally posted this in the latest Predator thread:
Think part of the problem now is how and what we learned as we learn to play pool. It's also generational. Those of us who grew up watching Crane, Balsis, Mosconi, Cranfield, etc. learned to play three cushion billiards. Not to be world champ but to understand the motion of the cue ball.
Since the advent of Texas Express, the need to understand three cushion or even straight rail billiards and the diamond system has decreased (MHO). Get out your jump cue and voila! Not sure what this generation is being taught. Read and watched musing from Stan, Randy, Scott, CJ, JBr and others. Sometimes I wish I was an early teen again and have the advantage of such great teachers.
Yes, it was great to have Irving, Mike S., Larry H. and some other great locals helping out. Learned mostly by watching, listening and racking. Don't remember ever having a formal structured lesson as some new players get today.
Oh well, the grass is always greener on the other side. At least till you get there. Sorry for the rambling.
Lyn
Think part of the problem now is how and what we learned as we learn to play pool. It's also generational. Those of us who grew up watching Crane, Balsis, Mosconi, Cranfield, etc. learned to play three cushion billiards. Not to be world champ but to understand the motion of the cue ball.
Since the advent of Texas Express, the need to understand three cushion or even straight rail billiards and the diamond system has decreased (MHO). Get out your jump cue and voila! Not sure what this generation is being taught. Read and watched musing from Stan, Randy, Scott, CJ, JBr and others. Sometimes I wish I was an early teen again and have the advantage of such great teachers.
Yes, it was great to have Irving, Mike S., Larry H. and some other great locals helping out. Learned mostly by watching, listening and racking. Don't remember ever having a formal structured lesson as some new players get today.
Oh well, the grass is always greener on the other side. At least till you get there. Sorry for the rambling.
Lyn