Both Tar Players hate Jump Cuues...BUT
- Thread starter Johnnyt
- Start date
Hey Johnny T, Shaw is very good with it and as you will see uses it every chance he gets!
So i would of never exspected to hear Shaw say that, iam guessing they both said they didnt like jump cues at the podcast?
That's what I heard, but i'm old and just about deaf, so I could of heard it wrong.:smile: Johnnyt
Jayson just express that he wouldn't mind them being banned. The fact that he would like to see them banned doesn't mean that he's not gonna use them if they are being allowed. I rather jump cues not to be allowed too but if I'm playing a tournament where they are I will get my short cue out when I need it.
They said they don't like them and they shouldn't be allowed. But if they are legal and the shot comes up they are obviously gonna use it, or else they are at a disadvantage.
A player can dislike the jump cue while still using it. If his opponent can use it and he decided not to then he's at a disadvantage.
A player can dislike the jump cue while still using it. If his opponent can use it and he decided not to then he's at a disadvantage.
Thank you. That was the point I was trying to make. Johnnyt
Maybe it's about staying true to the history of the game :wink:... Jump cues have been around for 20 years now so many players don't remember the days when they weren't around...
For those who are long in the tooth and recall a time before them they may also lament the decline of the mace and think of leather tips as some type of magic or wizardry since the cue ball defies logic and changes directions.
I'd say moving forward fewer events will restrict their use as the older promoters make way for younger ones.. I only hope younger ones are out there....
Chris
For those who are long in the tooth and recall a time before them they may also lament the decline of the mace and think of leather tips as some type of magic or wizardry since the cue ball defies logic and changes directions.
I'd say moving forward fewer events will restrict their use as the older promoters make way for younger ones.. I only hope younger ones are out there....
Chris
yeah but for TAR it doesn't give their opponent an advantage.
The players make the rules. If they agree not to use them, they ban them for both players.
I don't get it either, maybe each of them privately believes he's put in more hours with
the jump cue than the other, so he thinks he has an edge by allowing jumps even if he dislikes them.
I would like to see firearms banned from street fights. How much talent, hard work and practice does it take to pull a trigger?
But until they are, I'm bringing mine.
Seriously, I think it's refreshing to participate in a sport where the players can speak their minds and not worry about backlash from sponsors (cue makers who sell tons of jump cues). Of course, this is because the cue makers aren't pumping a bunch of cash into the sport. If they were, the "rules" might be different.
But until they are, I'm bringing mine.
Seriously, I think it's refreshing to participate in a sport where the players can speak their minds and not worry about backlash from sponsors (cue makers who sell tons of jump cues). Of course, this is because the cue makers aren't pumping a bunch of cash into the sport. If they were, the "rules" might be different.
Good Point. I personally favor 1746 as the golden year for billiards. That was pinnacle of skill in this game. After that people started in with things like cushions, and leather tips and chalk, and plastic balls, and thick precision milled slate and consistent cloth, leading all the way up to this abomination called a jump cue.
Back then a man had to show SKILL to make every ball no matter how easy it looked. Now any three year old with a jump cue can make a ball jump OVER another ball and CURVE around yet another ball to GO BETWEEN tow other balls and make the object ball, where is the skill in that? The Jump Cue does all the work magically, obviously.
As economists would say private actions speak louder than public words. In a format where the participants can both CHOOSE not to use a tool it speaks volumes that they BOTH chose to use it.
I like that line, Jumps are for Chumps. I don't agree with you but the line is catchy.
The ONLY time I have ever flexed my sponsorship muscles was when I was asked to sponsor a tour that did not allow jump cues. I explained to the tour operator that the rules of the game worldwide allowed jump cues and I felt that it's a disservice to make players have to play using different rules. I said we sell jump cues so I didn't feel comfortable advertising a product to a group of players who would not be allowed to use that product on the tour I was supporting. I said if you consider my stance and decide to allow them I will sponsor. He did change his mind and I did sponsor his tour.
The fact of it is that jump cues, like almost every other piece of equipment was developed by PLAYERS. Not by "manufacturers" trying to push stuff. Manufacturers and distributors RESPOND to the rules we don't make them. There is no manufacturer rep on the rules committee of any billiard organization in the world.
Some players invented jump cues and manufacturers just picked up on the trend. We don't give a crap about what equipment we sell to you because we are going to provide whatever equipment you need according to the rules and your desire.
Everyone want to make this a debate about kicking vs. jumping.
Well I don't think that should be the debate but JohnnyT brings up a VERY good point. In this TAR match both players CHOSE to use jump cues despite stating that they "hate" them. They could have chosen to not use them and rely totally on their kicking skills.
Ronnie is Filipino so presumably his kicking skill is pretty high. Jayson is a young Scot who didn't grow up learning to kick for dinner as Ronnie had to playing rotation.
So the players obviously chose practicality, that being the idea that a wider RANGE of shots available to them, in other words JUMPS and KICKS would be better for each of them. Neither of them are being forced to use their jump cues. When it's their turn at the table they can elect NOT to use one. But they choose of their own free will to use it.
Now, personally I feel that under the current rules a player should have the choice of being able to shoot every legal shot that can be made by man. This includes every possible jump shot. The cue is an inert object. It neither draws, follows, kicks or jumps by itself. The player does that.
Chalk helps the player do it. Without chalk the range of shots a player can perform is reduced dramatically. With chalk the range is increased dramatically. Same thing with a jump cue. It's a tool designed for one purpose but it does not function without skilled hands guiding it.
Ernie Els talking about using a long putter in golf said something to the effect of "I think they should be banned, but until they are, I'll be cheating with it just like the other guys".
If they are allowed, you need to have one to not be at a disadvantage. Which is another reason why I say ban the stupid f-ing things.
If they are allowed, you need to have one to not be at a disadvantage. Which is another reason why I say ban the stupid f-ing things.
I agree. I have been against chalk ever since reading the famous quote by former billiards champion Cyrus J. Wilkerson in 1834 after chalk was invented.
He said, "when I was a lad we had to put in long hard hours to eke out the tiniest bit of sidespin. I have devoted my entire life to mastering this, the greatest of human endeavors, billiards relying solely on my keen eye, unwavering arm, steady rest and brave nerves. Now any fool with his silly twisting powder, they even have the cheek to call it magical, can perform better shots than I can with very little training. Shots that took me years and years to learn can now be mastered in a day with this tip cocaine. An abomination I say. Mark my words the game I loved will now fall into utter ruin and be discarded and relegated to something children do on the playground as it is no longer fit for men of skill as long as this so-called magical twisting powder infests the game and allows base amateurs to play like champions."
I completely agree with the legality of the jump cue. Till its banned im going to use the heck out of it and practice all kinds of jump shots so I can stay ahead of the other guy. Plain and simple just like chalk, cue extenders, mechanical bridges, and non leather tips. Till they are banned Im using all of them!
Jump Cues will NEVER be Gone!
The first jump cues were full cues. Then, longer than 20 years ago the short jump cues were being used. Those were shafts. Late on quiet nights in the poolroom with only a few players and a chump (like me) you get the see the best shots or tricks of the trade. One night a we all gather around with this guy putting a chair on the table. From about 3 or 4 inchs from the chair was the cue ball. The object ball was 3 or 4 inches from the other side of the chair. After a few tries, he jumped the seat and hit object ball directly on top. At the time, that was the coolest thing that I had ever seen.
Anyway, I don't like the jump cues at all. I think their too easy and it benefits the lesser-skilled player. But, still....There is a ton of money in the jump cue business. Every cue company makes a version (J/B cue or jump cue). As a player, you don't want to be tied to banning the use of a jump cue. A potential sponsorship to any larger cue company could consider this as a negative. Now, I will admit that I haven't seen any player being sponsored or directly pushing one jump cue over another. But, this could be in the back of their mind. You couldn't stop leather, chalk or LD shafts. This doesn't mean that it is going to make the players better in the end though.
The first jump cues were full cues. Then, longer than 20 years ago the short jump cues were being used. Those were shafts. Late on quiet nights in the poolroom with only a few players and a chump (like me) you get the see the best shots or tricks of the trade. One night a we all gather around with this guy putting a chair on the table. From about 3 or 4 inchs from the chair was the cue ball. The object ball was 3 or 4 inches from the other side of the chair. After a few tries, he jumped the seat and hit object ball directly on top. At the time, that was the coolest thing that I had ever seen.
Anyway, I don't like the jump cues at all. I think their too easy and it benefits the lesser-skilled player. But, still....There is a ton of money in the jump cue business. Every cue company makes a version (J/B cue or jump cue). As a player, you don't want to be tied to banning the use of a jump cue. A potential sponsorship to any larger cue company could consider this as a negative. Now, I will admit that I haven't seen any player being sponsored or directly pushing one jump cue over another. But, this could be in the back of their mind. You couldn't stop leather, chalk or LD shafts. This doesn't mean that it is going to make the players better in the end though.