Professional Pool Player Behavior - Is it Time to Solve the Problem or Not?

Not being one that follows professional pool closely, I am extremely surprised that there is nothing in place already.

I would suggest that, for those of you on this site that are "connected" or that have a relationship with the management/promotors/etc of the various leagues and tournaments, create a "Code of Conduct" proposal and present it to each governing body. It may take a while to finalize but I can't imagine that anyone who care about the game, and it's future, could possibly object... including the players
 
No doubt about it, the Earl show puts peeps in the seats. If I were to ever run another major event with a door charge, he would most likely be paid an 'appearance' fee.

Earl became a favorite of mine because of his talent. He is, simply put, a genius of the sport when it comes to his skills. His behavior, on the other hand is a detriment to him and to the sport. It should not be tolerated and the "fans" that egg him on hoping for a trainwreck should be thrown out.
 
There's no debate about Earl Stickland, it's about solving the problem of promoters and tournament directors not supplying a Code of Conduct to the players. This seems to be such a difficult task and it's rudimentary and should be done automatically to prevent potential problems and have a solution for ones that do arise (and they will).

Well said, CJ, I appreciate it that you stay focused on the topic at hand.

Clearly, sharking should result in a penalty in the game. i.e. Ball in hand to the opponent, loss of game if it continues.

Threats of violence should result in loss of match expulsion for a period of time.

I watched the match and felt that the referee lost control long before the specifics of the ending.
 
Earl became a favorite of mine because of his talent. He is, simply put, a genius of the sport when it comes to his skills. His behavior, on the other hand is a detriment to him and to the sport. It should not be tolerated and the "fans" that egg him on hoping for a trainwreck should be thrown out.

:thumbup2:
 
Let's not kid ourselves anymore, it's not the games that are boring or exciting

Yep pool is boring that's what's killed the game
This is not the UK

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Yes, and the UK has Criquet which makes no sense and good luck trying to figure out those rules.....it's mind boggling. :D

When it comes down to just watching the games/balls, with no influence by the players (pretend for a moment the player are invisible), Baseball is clearly the most boring game ever invented, followed closely by football.

Imagine sitting for a few hours just watching the baseball being thrown around and sometimes hit...... but most times not. How on earth could anyone stay awake? :confused:

Let's not kid ourselves anymore, it's not the games that are boring or exciting, it's the presentation and the characters/personalities generated by the PR, Marketing, and Advertising experts. Pool has none of these experts, so the results are obvious

Earl has received more attention from this than all the other pool players combined in the last month. I posted several things about the Code of Conduct that's desperately needed and so far over 10,000 people have seen it TODAY, and that's not including AZBILLIARDS, I'm sure a few hundred saw it on here too.;)

'The Game is the Teacher'.com
Cricket-Revolution-Gameplay-Trailer_3.jpg
 
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Like Ive said before both Earl and JJ should be fined, suspended or both!! You should have no room for this type of unprofessional BS and it needs to be address properly. Set the bar and tone for the rest of the league to show you mean business. This is a BUSINESS and its not to be taken lightly and never as a joke. I have zero tolerance for BS with my staff and if you acted like this you would both hit the door with your head spinning!! However.... Knowing this is a new thing I would apply suspensions or fines to get the point across to everybody involved that this is unacceptable!!

I love how a lot of people think this whole blowup is great and is good for BB. When really... Its horrible and detrimental to what this league is striving to do. I almost feel sorry for the folks that think that pool needs to be like "reality" (give me a F-ing break :rolleyes:) tv and not just what it is. Its almost like they are zombies of the public view and not visionaries. Sad to say the least!! If you really think this is the way professional pool needs to be you have a child like view of the world.

EARL.... Pull your head out fo your arse and play pool to the best of your abilities and STFU!!! The last thing you need to do is talk to the crowd unless its something positive. I am completely embrassed for you to YELL at yoru fans. You are a complete jackass and ruining a good thing for doing such things!!

JJ.... Same goes to you. Sit in your chair and LIGHTLY talk to your teammates and yadda yadda yadda. Be the bigger guy and walk away next time. You were both embarrassing and disrespectful to your fans.... Your teammates... and the hand that feeds you. I wish the best for all of you but you're a bunch of ego inflated C+nts that need to sort it out!!
 
Play small ball.

Maybe each teams should have a midget.

To solve disputes.

Let them go at it with big boxing gloves !

No offense to little people.

Maybe they could use a new place in the world.
 
JJ only went off after Earl refused his offer of a handshake and then spouted off once again. Had JJ punched him in the nose in front of the camera, I would have felt he was justified. I think JJ showed great restraint before finally getting pushed over the edge.
 
There was an incident with Earl Stickland and Jeremy Jones in their Bonus Ball match that's all over the internet. I respect both these professional players and understand what it's like to compete and be stressed and upset about the many negative things we have to deal with in the "pool world". I think it's about time to become "Solution Oriented" as a sport/game and stop blaming the players for the flaws in the current system of professional tournaments and special events. Let's do what's normally done in sports and that's have rules, regulations and clear, concise, consequences for negative behavior.

My position on these incidents will always be the same. Where in the Professional Pool'Code of Conduct' does it say what is acceptable behavior and what is not? The answer is there's no Code of Conduct Manual in the US/World Open, the Steaming Matches, Bonus Ball or any other tournament in these modern times.

All Professionals deserve the consideration of understanding what's expected of them and then given the responsibility to follow these guidelines knowing what the consequences of breaking them are.This is a common management practice from McDonalds to Microsoft and is also common in the NBA, PGA, NFL and other sports.

A written Code of Conduct is something that exists in grade school, high school, college and then in our professional business careers. Why is pool different, we can't expect someone that's competing for their livelihood to simply "do the right thing," in competition the only "right thing" is the rules and regulations, and yes there is sportsmanship obligations too, however there MUST be a written set of guidelines, we can't simply place everything under "sportsmanship etiquette".

When we had the Professional Cue Sports Association in 1996 there was a written Code of Conduct manual that outlined SPECIFIC behavior guideline for dealing with press, the public and tournament matches. Each player was required to sign this contract and it was binding, we also specifically stated the punishment for not abiding by our rules and regulations concerning behavior.

The Code of Conduct is not an unusual document, it's a Common Document in professional settings, whether it's professional sports, business or entertainment......why is pool the exception?

"If we're not planning for success, we are, in effect, planning for failure".....my questions is simple "why are we planning for failure at every tournament and special event, so we can blame the players? I believe this is a "management issue" and to continue to blame the players is like blaming the the child for breaking the rules when there are no rules.

I'm 100% IN FAVOR of demonstrating professional behavior to the press, the fans, and each other, however, the promoters/managers of the events must make it their responsibility to communicate the Code of Conduct in writing and make sure the players sign this contract, then enforce it as needed. This is a common practice done in businesses that include PHD's, Medical Degrees, Law Degrees, and other Professionals.....it's time for the "pool world" to stop trying to be the exception and follow normal business procedures.

Let's be solution oriented instead of continuing these business practices that are proven not to work properly at the expense of the game, it's players and it's fans." 'The Game is the Teacher'.com

The WPBL code of conduct.....

WPBL Personal Conduct Policy
All WPBL players and staff are required to avoid all conduct that would be deemed detrimental to the integrity of the league and the image it represents. Therefore certain behaviors inside and outside of the WPBL studios will not be tolerated and will result in various forms of discipline.
- Slandering of the league, the game of bonus ball, or anything directly related to either

- Derogatory comments or gestures towards any player, official, staff or audience member of the WPBL including but not limited to homophobic, racial or sexist in origin made by any means including social media

- Damage or theft of any property of the WPBL

- Showing up late or missing a match

- Assaulting any player, official or fan

- Cheating

- Gambling on any WPBL match

- Any intentional decrease in performance
The preceding will be dealt with by various forms of discipline based on a league committee ruling:
1. Verbal Warning
2. Written Warning
3. Monetary fine
4. League Suspension
5. League Expulsion


This document was given to all the players along with their contracts back in November. We have an appointed ruling committee that will meet on matters like last nights. It consists of myself, Larry Chiborak, Nathan Dumoulin, Johnny Archer (voted by players) and Thorsten Hohmann (voted by players).

We will have a decision and public announcement soon.
 
if it's not communicated it's simply poor management.

Like Ive said before both Earl and JJ should be fined, suspended or both!! You should have no room for this type of unprofessional BS and it needs to be address properly. Set the bar and tone for the rest of the league to show you mean business. This is a BUSINESS and its not to be taken lightly and never as a joke. I have zero tolerance for BS with my staff and if you acted like this you would both hit the door with your head spinning!! However.... Knowing this is a new thing I would apply suspensions or fines to get the point across to everybody involved that this is unacceptable!!

I love how a lot of people think this whole blowup is great and is good for BB. When really... Its horrible and detrimental to what this league is striving to do. I almost feel sorry for the folks that think that pool needs to be like "reality" (give me a F-ing break :rolleyes:) tv and not just what it is. Its almost like they are zombies of the public view and not visionaries. Sad to say the least!! If you really think this is the way professional pool needs to be you have a child like view of the world.

EARL.... Pull your head out fo your arse and play pool to the best of your abilities and STFU!!! The last thing you need to do is talk to the crowd unless its something positive. I am completely embrassed for you to YELL at yoru fans. You are a complete jackass and ruining a good thing for doing such things!!

JJ.... Same goes to you. Sit in your chair and LIGHTLY talk to your teammates and yadda yadda yadda. Be the bigger guy and walk away next time. You were both embarrassing and disrespectful to your fans.... Your teammates... and the hand that feeds you. I wish the best for all of you but you're a bunch of ego inflated C+nts that need to sort it out!!

Professional Pool has no policies and procedures that are given to the players. There is no Code of Conduct that the player are required to read, sign, date and return at the events. So there is no behaviour that is punishable by any means because there are no laws.

It's like driving on a highway with no speed limits, you can drive as fast as you want and people can complain that you are driving too fast, but you can NOT get a ticket and if there was speed limits most cars would drive much slower and safer.....this too is true with the Pro Players and their behavior - they would be much better if they knew what was expected, and if it's not communicated it's simply poor management.

Earl and Jeremy did nothing wrong UNLESS they broke existing rules.....and the fact is if there's no rules it's impossible to break any. No matter what people "think" is acceptable behaviour or not, this is the facts, to break rules, there must first be rules.
 
There was an incident with Earl Stickland and Jeremy Jones in their Bonus Ball match that's all over the internet. I respect both these professional players and understand what it's like to compete and be stressed and upset about the many negative things we have to deal with in the "pool world". I think it's about time to become "Solution Oriented" as a sport/game and stop blaming the players for the flaws in the current system of professional tournaments and special events. Let's do what's normally done in sports and that's have rules, regulations and clear, concise, consequences for negative behavior.

My position on these incidents will always be the same. Where in the Professional Pool'Code of Conduct' does it say what is acceptable behavior and what is not? The answer is there's no Code of Conduct Manual in the US/World Open, the Steaming Matches, Bonus Ball or any other tournament in these modern times.

All Professionals deserve the consideration of understanding what's expected of them and then given the responsibility to follow these guidelines knowing what the consequences of breaking them are.This is a common management practice from McDonalds to Microsoft and is also common in the NBA, PGA, NFL and other sports.

A written Code of Conduct is something that exists in grade school, high school, college and then in our professional business careers. Why is pool different, we can't expect someone that's competing for their livelihood to simply "do the right thing," in competition the only "right thing" is the rules and regulations, and yes there is sportsmanship obligations too, however there MUST be a written set of guidelines, we can't simply place everything under "sportsmanship etiquette".

When we had the Professional Cue Sports Association in 1996 there was a written Code of Conduct manual that outlined SPECIFIC behavior guideline for dealing with press, the public and tournament matches. Each player was required to sign this contract and it was binding, we also specifically stated the punishment for not abiding by our rules and regulations concerning behavior.

The Code of Conduct is not an unusual document, it's a Common Document in professional settings, whether it's professional sports, business or entertainment......why is pool the exception?

"If we're not planning for success, we are, in effect, planning for failure".....my questions is simple "why are we planning for failure at every tournament and special event, so we can blame the players? I believe this is a "management issue" and to continue to blame the players is like blaming the the child for breaking the rules when there are no rules.

I'm 100% IN FAVOR of demonstrating professional behavior to the press, the fans, and each other, however, the promoters/managers of the events must make it their responsibility to communicate the Code of Conduct in writing and make sure the players sign this contract, then enforce it as needed. This is a common practice done in businesses that include PHD's, Medical Degrees, Law Degrees, and other Professionals.....it's time for the "pool world" to stop trying to be the exception and follow normal business procedures.

Let's be solution oriented instead of continuing these business practices that are proven not to work properly at the expense of the game, it's players and it's fans." 'The Game is the Teacher'.com

Sounds good to me.

Maybe there will be a trickle down effect.Things on the amateur level are getting pretty crazy.
 
IMHO, the problem has always been that pool doesn't transfer to TV or an audience well. I think golf does so more, because there are a lot less shots. In pool having your cue ball one cm to the right or left make a huge difference. But watching pool, you can't tell these subtleties. I wish there was a way they could figure out how to fix this issue but I can't think of it.
 
Perhaps it was staged for ratings? A chair shot to someone's head would have been nice.

Now we a getting some where:grin: the fact pool has tried the dress up act like choir boys routine in the past and just where did that get them
By far with out a shadow of doubt the most entertaining pool bar none is the Mossconi cup because it has life action and drama that's the recipe for success


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...

Let's not kid ourselves anymore, it's not the games that are boring or exciting, it's the presentation and the characters/personalities generated by the PR, Marketing, and Advertising experts. Pool has none of these experts, so the results are obvious
...


Sometimes, the experts withdraw from the waste of energy it takes to create something worthwhile for pro players. Also, as I stated before, here and on Facebook C.J., the pros do not want to be managed. Public Relations, Marketing, and Advertising require discipline. A commodity sorely lacking off of the pool table.

cajunfats
 
Professional Pool has no policies and procedures that are given to the players. There is no Code of Conduct that the player are required to read, sign, date and return at the events. So there is no behaviour that is punishable by any means because there are no laws.

It's like driving on a highway with no speed limits, you can drive as fast as you want and people can complain that you are driving too fast, but you can NOT get a ticket and if there was speed limits most cars would drive much slower and safer.....this too is true with the Pro Players and their behavior - they would be much better if they knew what was expected, and if it's not communicated it's simply poor management.

Earl and Jeremy did nothing wrong UNLESS they broke existing rules.....and the fact is if there's no rules it's impossible to break any. No matter what people "think" is acceptable behaviour or not, this is the facts, to break rules, there must first be rules.


CJ no offence but i think you missed the point I was trying to make...


And yes they did indeed break contracted rules that they all signed...
 
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Most people will say the "don't want to be managed" however, this is secretly what...

...

Let's not kid ourselves anymore, it's not the games that are boring or exciting, it's the presentation and the characters/personalities generated by the PR, Marketing, and Advertising experts. Pool has none of these experts, so the results are obvious
...


Sometimes, the experts withdraw from the waste of energy it takes to create something worthwhile for pro players. Also, as I stated before, here and on Facebook C.J., the pros do not want to be managed. Public Relations, Marketing, and Advertising require discipline. A commodity sorely lacking off of the pool table.

cajunfats


I don't think the players are really of that opinion. Most athletes have agents, and managers that take care of virtually all their obligations so they can concentrate on their training and what they do best.

Most people will say the "don't want to be managed" however, this is secretly what many people need in their lives.....great management. Money management, Social management, Physical Fitness Management, Diet Management, Time Management. etc....very few people will honestly say they don't want or need management in their lives and if they do it's obvious they're unorganized.

When I said we need PR Groups, Marketing Groups, and Advertising Experts, not pool players or "backers" trying to fill these roles.
 
This is too hard

The answer is obviously not, how can you lose if you're not even playing the "game".

ALL successful businesses have a Policies and Procedures manual, as well as a Code of Conduct and even a Code of Ethics in many cases.

Pool is the exception, does that mean pool's exceptional? Yes, it's exceptionally unorganized and primitive compared to other sports, businesses and organizations.

This reminds me of managers that can't understand why the employees won't do what he's thinking and acts like it's too much to actually tell them or memo them in writing.

Dress codes are present in parties, businesses, sports, games, movies, TV shows, but in pool people are allowed to dress with very little taste and professionalism. I'm ok with the Bonus Ball jerseys (although I would not have selected them), what's not acceptable to represent pool is poorly tailored shirts, shorts, t shirts, and tank tops. imo

CJ

I would like to read your posts, but having to continuosly scroll right and left is too much. None of the other posts are like this, so I assume it is something unique to you. Can you do anything about this to make it easier on all of us?
 
Chickens Guarding the Henhouse

The WPBL code of conduct.....

WPBL Personal Conduct Policy
All WPBL players and staff are required to avoid all conduct that would be deemed detrimental to the integrity of the league and the image it represents. Therefore certain behaviors inside and outside of the WPBL studios will not be tolerated and will result in various forms of discipline.
- Slandering of the league, the game of bonus ball, or anything directly related to either

- Derogatory comments or gestures towards any player, official, staff or audience member of the WPBL including but not limited to homophobic, racial or sexist in origin made by any means including social media

- Damage or theft of any property of the WPBL

- Showing up late or missing a match

- Assaulting any player, official or fan

- Cheating

- Gambling on any WPBL match

- Any intentional decrease in performance
The preceding will be dealt with by various forms of discipline based on a league committee ruling:
1. Verbal Warning
2. Written Warning
3. Monetary fine
4. League Suspension
5. League Expulsion


This document was given to all the players along with their contracts back in November. We have an appointed ruling committee that will meet on matters like last nights. It consists of myself, Larry Chiborak, Nathan Dumoulin, Johnny Archer (voted by players) and Thorsten Hohmann (voted by players).

We will have a decision and public announcement soon.
The only area I have difficulty with is the Committee Members. I would encourage having a format much like the old BCA utilized. If you have member/sponsors who have a vested interest in the independence and success of the operation, it would be a good idea to build a Rules Committee with one player and one WPBL Officer. This way players cannot overrule good judgement when it comes to discipline.

Just my two cents.

P.S. I saw Robin Adair posted mentioning the McDermott Texas Express rules of conduct. John McChesney, Randy Goettlicher, and Robin are an excellent example of knowledge and fairness when monitoring events. I'd consider tapping that Brain Trust for my organization.

cajunfats
 
I believe they should have professional "character development" and the players.....

CJ no offence but i think you missed the point I was trying to make...


And yes they did indeed brake contracted rules that they all signed...

Yes, you did make some good points, I do agree that pool does NOT need to be like what happened. The question is "how does it need to be?" What persona does a Pool Player supposed to fill? Can we tailor make a way to act that will accomplish a style?

I have opinions that not be popular, and one is I believe they should have professional "character development" and the players should be worked with to develop their own public personality. Let's face it, the "real personality" is not what works and that's certainly not what Minnesota Fats did and I doubt if any of the famous movie stars you see actually "act" like themselves......Chuck Norris of course is the exception.
 
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