Rodney Morris Challenges the Top 25 European Players

Us watching a man watching a table must be the first thing to go if this sport is to survive. I don't believe most players realise they are in an entertainment industry. They are failing to entertain us to a quite spectacular degree, and fannying around with the rack isn't exactly helping.

Where's the authority in pro pool? Who's the boss?
 
KMRUNOUT said:
If a human being racks the balls, the possibility exists that there might be some gaps that a "pro" player (or really anyone with a bit of knowledge about the subject) may determine favors breaking from a particular location, speed, fullness of hit, etc. What is wrong with standing by patiently while the ref racks, then taking a few seconds to look over the result, not saying anything to anyone, making your determination how and where to break from, and then breaking the balls? The referees don't need to be pressured by the players...there ought to be enough pressure on them to perform the often difficult, if not damn near impossible task under some conditions, to rack the balls perfectly.

The only problem I can see with this is if the referee consistently gives poor quality racks, the player may feel they are being treated unfairly. Ignorance of the rack and the subtle differences, spaces, etc. is not a very good basis for determining the best way to handle this issue. The bottom line is that if humans rack, there WILL occasionally be spaces. Preventing the pros from knowing the conditions they are playing under (for example where the spaces are in the rack they have been served up), really takes pool farther from being a legitimate pro sport. Unless, of course, the knowledge about the rack could be wiped from the minds of all people forever. I don't see that happening. As such, some will have the knowledge, and will feel something wrong has been done if they are forced to break a a less than frozen rack. A big part of the problem is the voice of the people who either don't know or don't believe the significance of the spaces in the rack. "Just rack the balls and get on with it" really takes us a big step backwards. It is the exact equivalent of saying "Don't bother with that stuff that you know, because I don't know it and it doesn't matter to *me*"

Thoughts?

KMRUNOUT
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My thought is the paying public should come first.
 
Johnnyt said:
With all the B/S and time wasted racking 9 ball at the pro level the MR should be used and alternate break be used. Then the next thing is they will be *****ing about the way the other guy lags for the first break. Johnnyt
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Well, obviously, if you out-lag me, you cheated. If I didn't freeze it, the table is faulty.
 
Neil said:
Nice try, but yet, fail. So, are you saying that a controlled break is not a part of professional pool? And, how can one have a controlled break without even looking at how the balls are racked??

Also, if the ref is so insecure that they feel so pressured by someone looking at the rack, then it's time to get a different ref.
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I'm saying any part of pro pool that is boring should be dispensed with posthaste.

As for stronger refs, couldn't agree more. Get ones that tell the players to get on with it.
 
Pathetic Shark said:
Pro9 has a Mezz masse cue for £1,099. Yup, for most people a cue you'll use twice in a lifetime. £1,099.
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Don't hate mate, I'm the only owner of that cue in the UK! Since I don't know how to masse I use to to switch channels on the TV when I can't reach the remote.
 
Wait, Rodney challenged them on facebook?

I put the over/under on this being an actual challenge at zero.
 
I can't watch more than a game of it before wanting to mow the lawn, or at least....

Pathetic Shark said:
I'm saying any part of pro pool that is boring should be dispensed with posthaste.

As for stronger refs, couldn't agree more. Get ones that tell the players to get on with it.
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I agree with that 100% .... the players should respect the Refs and you're right, we need to cut away the waste/fat and make the game go faster and put back the strategy and "sparring" and take out the senseless kicking and easy run outs.

The game has some great aspects and for some reason they got taken out and replaced by things that are horrible, like racking, kicking and breaking softly......how boring are these things? Then the guy gets "ball in hand" and runs an easy table.....we really wonder why no one wants to watch this nonsense??? I can't watch more than a game of it before wanting to mow the lawn, or at least watch the grass grow in anticipation. :groucho:
 
freedomfry said:
so is it only working out if he finds 25 players? Rodney would be breakfast for Darren, however if he would play 25 guys he would have a good chance to win 13+ matches.
BTW I'm challenging the best 1000000 players in the US and play them all back to back for 10k. I will start with the lowest ranked players and work my way up. Any takers?
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This is how I see it...if Rodney beats 13 of the 25...he shows a profit.
....and I love his chances.

But I don't like his chances of getting 25 players to agree to this contest...
...seems like herding cats.
 
one of them would play him....that's the irony

pt109 said:
This is how I see it...if Rodney beats 13 of the 25...he shows a profit.
....and I love his chances.

But I don't like his chances of getting 25 players to agree to this contest...
...seems like herding cats.
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I seriously doubt if even one of them would play him....that's the irony of the scenario.
 
Neil said:
O.k., you've made it clear. You don't have a clue, and want no part of learning. To you, learning is akin to cheating. You just go ahead and keep on just banging at the break. That's kind of thinking is exactly why guys like you can't handle SVB. He STUDIES the break, you just whack at it.
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wow if cj just bangs at the break I would hate to see if he actually studies it like you say. I would have love to won 1/100th of the money he has won by banging just whacking at breaks ! :)
 
CJ Wiley said:
Actually dealing cards and racking pool balls (for the Mosconi Cup) is virtually identical......
machaela1.jpg
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Actually, it is a really flawed analogy. No one is questioning the *honesty* of the the refs. The point is they are not going to do things perfectly. In dealing cards, the mechanics are pretty tough to screw up. The card either goes down with the correct side up or down, or it doesn't. There is no in between. There are certain rules the dealer must follow. If the dealer follows those rules, *they cannot screw up*...their performance would essentially be 100% accurate. In racking the balls, the goal is to position the balls in the correct pattern with all balls frozen. Quite obviously this is *physically difficult* in many cases. The ref simply may not correctly perform this task. It has a MAJOR impact on the outcome of the contest. The quality of the dealing has ZERO impact on the outcome of a poker game. There is the big difference that ruins this analogy.

I mean...does anyone really want the outcome of pro pool matches to be influenced by the quality of the rack? Because I'm sure no one is crazy enough to claim the rack makes no difference. I'm at least right about that?

KMRUNOUT
 
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the "Touch and Bang" (TAB) on most of my shots.

Houstoer said:
wow if cj just bangs at the break I would hate to see if he actually studies it like you say. I would have love to won 1/100th of the money he has won by banging just whacking at breaks ! :)
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Yes, I AM a "banger"....not only do I "bang" at the break, but also use the "Touch and Bang" (TAB) on most of my shots. This is the secret "bangers" have kept hidden since the foundation of Pocket Billiards...... for more secrets go to www.cjwiley.com

"TAB" - Pocket Billiard Banger's "New Coca Cola" ;)

click
 
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I personally don't think it looks good, and it makes no difference to me if ........

KMRUNOUT said:
Actually, it is a really flawed analogy. No one is questioning the *honesty* of the the refs. The point is they are not going to do things perfectly. In dealing cards, the mechanics are pretty tough to screw up. The card either goes down with the correct side up or down, or it doesn't. There is no in between. There are certain rules the dealer must follow. If the dealer follows those rules, *they cannot screw up*...their performance would essentially be 100% accurate. In racking the balls, the goal is to position the balls in the correct pattern with all balls frozen. Quite obviously this is *physically difficult* in many cases. The ref simply may not correctly perform this task. It has a MAJOR impact on the outcome of the contest. The quality of the dealing has ZERO impact on the outcome of a poker game. There is the big difference that ruins this analogy.

KMRUNOUT
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I have seen many dealers in my time that can deal "seconds" and that certainly effects the outcome of the card game....they also can show players a glimpse of the cards, and even deal off the bottom. This effects the outcome much more than accidently not freezing the pool balls, as a matter of fact you never know, it could actually help the player if the balls aren't "perfect".....it's impossible to know for sure from rack to rack....it's just "in the stars" like the "rolls" of the match for the most part.

I think we can take it for granted that the Referees would be highly trained for the position of "official racker".

In the pool room I grew up in the owner of the pool room racked the balls and collected a dime a game.......I'm not sure if he was a top notch racker, but we never examined his rack, we just broke the balls. Even if the honesty of the racker isn't in question, it sure looks that way if the player studies his rack intently.....it's fair to both players to be allowed to look OR it's fair if the players are NOT allowed to look.....it's just a matter of presentation.

Jay Helfert racked the balls when Earl Strickland ran the 11 racks in a row for a Million Dollars and Earl was ok with the "Referee" racking for the most money ever put up on a game of pool. He didn't examine every ball to see if they were "perfect" he simply broke the balls to the best of his ability.

Teaching someone to rack the balls properly is not difficult, especially if they've done it before. If we can't train officials to rack then we have a far bigger problem than we're discussing now......corporate managers are trained to manage hundreds of people, surely our officials can manage 9 balls in a pocket billiard rack....or we're in trouble. ;)

We know how to see the "L Train" (from Joe Tucker) and depending on how anal the player is or wants to be they can take a magnifying glass to the table and spend a minute or two studying the rack before they break.......we just have to decide if this is to be allowed or not contingent on how it effects the flow and visual aspects of the game. I personally don't think it looks good, and it makes no difference to me if we're allowed to look or not. If we break the balls and there's something obviously wrong it may be good to have an option in place.......again, whatever is best for the game is fine with me, and I would think it would be fine with anyone that's not looking for an advantage because a Referee made a mistake and accidentally left balls not touching.

We can also allow the players to study every shot with as much time as they need or we can seek to speed up play to make it more exciting and entertaining to the viewers.

I represent the game and only want to help make it the best product possible for future success.......in doing so I feel the Referees are a big part of the future because they add class, style and integrity to a game that so desperately needs these things.

'The Class of the Game is the Teacher'
 
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CJ Wiley said:
I represent the game and only want to help make it the best product possible for future success.....
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I think this is important for us all. Too many players are only thinking about themselves, not the game. This starts with pros, naturally, but permeates down to all levels.

We all have a responsibility to make this game more popular. Otherwise, why bother?
 
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