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No mod no foul, noob.foul!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's a foul. You can't block a pocket just because you're shooting in the other direction.
If I were the ref I'd follow it with a warning that if he does it again, it's loss of game.
Interfering with the table when it is in play, illegal use of equipment (the pocket), and bordering unsportsmanlike behavior.
So a ref I know made a ruling and was wondering if he made a mistake. You may well have seen a similar situation....
A player came up against a jump shot and went to get his break/jump cue. He unscrewed the bottom part of the butt as he approached the table and placed it standing up in a corner pocket for storage. He shot the shot.
Under what conditions is the above illegal? Should he have called a foul?
Maybe the ref considered the pocket as part of the playing surface, a ball could come in contact with the cue handle. I don't think it's legal to leave equipment on playing surface while shooting ?
Dale
I think that if a player is using his own piece of chalk he should be able to request that the other player not leave chalk on the table and that if a foul involves that piece of left chalk it should be on the player who left it.
I don't see how that can be a foul unless a ball hit it. Same thing as a chalk cube falling on the table in the middle of a shot but it gets removed before anything hits it. Is it a foul just because something may have hit it if it was left on the table?
Then you may as well call the bridge you use when shooting a foul since if you did not stand up off the shot and move your hand off the table, a ball could hit it.
Which specific WSR rule would you invoke? That's what they were playing under.
Regarding Post #27.....Not just a foul, it would be a fragrant foul.
(Note that I didn't say whether my ref friend called a foul. Maybe the seated player jumped up and asked him to call one.)
I have seen ump shows in pool games. I think they are usually due to a ref not actually knowing the rules. An example I heard (IIRC) is when Allen Hopkins was playing and had cue ball in hand. He placed it and took some (short) warmup strokes and decided it wasn't going to work, so he picked the cue ball up to put it in a better place. The ref called a cue ball foul. The rules may be clearer now, but I don't think that was a foul under the rules at the time (1980 or so).
If a player violates a rule, and there is a referee, the ref must call a foul. It's not up to the opponent to prompt the ref -- it's the refs job to call all fouls. That includes a fairly common violation of the rules that is a game-loser at nine ball that is often overlooked in unrefereed games.
I hadn't thought of it this way - I think this is a fair point.My thinking is more about why should the rules be bent.
If the referee allows a foreign object (something that is not part of the shot/game,) to be placed into a pocket for storage and there is no penalty for leaving it there, why can't something even more distractive be left in the pocket "for storage". Distractions should be eliminated or at least reduced in the game of pocket billiards. Having to ask your opponent to remove his jump butt (or anything else) is more than I would personally like to tolerate.
How about if a player brings his big ole sweaty towel to the table and decides to stuff it in one of the pockets "for storage"....Does the player's opponent really have to put up with any of those type of shenanigans?
Next up, perhaps we can have our seeing-eye dog to observe each shot and leave him at the table when we are finished shooting, "accidentally" leaving him there of course. No worries.....
JoeyA
If the foul was called it is accurate but as Paul Harvey would say, "now here's the rest of the story." It's a bullshit ticky tack foul. Now if any ball came close to the pocket, you might be able to make a case for calling a foul. Brings to mind the call against Efren playing Mike Siegal. Cue ball only fouls were the rule with a caveat that if you disturbed any ball(s) and any other ball came close to it, then that could be called a foul. Efren moved an object ball slightly and before any of the balls stopped, he moved it back to where he thought it was. Mike called foul in that the balls hadn't stopped moving and who knows whether the moved ball might have been struck. Now it gets better. Efren was incensed by the call and broke down his cue to quit and was talked back into finishing the match. Mike protested of course stating the if you break down your cue, you've conceded. The breaking down of your cue rule was adopted after that match and has been in effect ever since.
(...) You may well have seen a similar situation (...)
It's a foul. You can't block a pocket just because you're shooting in the other direction. (...)
Interfering with the table when it is in play, illegal use of equipment (the pocket), and bordering unsportsmanlike behavior.
It actually happens so very often in our part of the World; by WSR there are no grounds to call it a foul, besides it has no impact on the outcome of the play, etc. In a nutshell: no harm done !!!
Although it may be seen as not elegant - it is what Players do frequently, therefore we accept it as a natural development, etc.
Common Law comes into mind
Ruling: no foul, no warning, accepted.
I am sorry to say this, but we should not be going towards the "Ump Show".
This kind of approach aften arises at Referees' Courses where the "referees to be" want to know how to be "important".
The answer is always:
We are the Refs not the "gendarmerie"
It's not the Ump Show. It's a foul. It's illegal and shouldn't be allowed, ref or no ref.