Four Contributors To The Death Of Pool

[336Robin]

Home Game Room Construction

Once again. Nothing is killing the game we love. We are a very tiny part of the leisure time market.

It's very simple.


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Sonny,
I agree with your statement but home gameroom construction is way down and that is the market you are referring to.

 

[midnightpulp]

I'm virtually the only one around here who does speak the truth. The problem is, we have many dreamers and fantasists who have an idealist form of the world, and cannot adapt to how it is in reality. These people, whether on here or npr, get terribly upset when you point out the truth, and try to blame the messenger rather than take the responsibility to educate themselves.

C'est la vie.

As for the rest...whole of western europe watches snooker...growing in east europe...china 30 million players...popular throughout the indian sub continent...established markets in australia/new zealand...yadda yadda.

Darts...not my area of expertise but...popular in western europe...growing eastern europe...pro tour in Australia...pro tour in new zealand...all tours televised on free to air national tv, with audience share greater than even the mighty columbo.

Now, is there any thing else i can help you with, anything at all?

Provide television ratings. I don't give a shit about China since they will watch anything that involves a Chinese player. Basketball games featuring Yao Ming have pulled higher ratings in China alone than the average television ratings for a Champions League Final.

Yao’s first game against NBA superstar Shaquille O’Neal in 2003 attracted more than 200 million viewers in China, almost twice the US audience for the most-watched Super Bowl in history.

What can we conclude from this? Absolutely nothing. Anyhow, pool is just as popular in China as snooker. Ask Colin, who has actually been there, about it.

Also provide television ratings for darts viewership outside the UK.

What I take issue with is your idea that snooker's popularity (again, only in the UK) is the result of it being a better game than pool. So, snooker was a shitty game for 100 years, when Joe Davis was winning 6 pounds for the World Title and no one cared about it, and then it magically became a "good" game after Higgins' arrival on the scene?

And pool was a "good" game when Greenleaf and a young Mosconi would fill stadiums playing exhibitions and then became magically an uninteresting game after World War II, magically became a good game again after the release of the Hustler, magically became a bad game again in the 70's, magically became a good game again when Fats and Mosconi drew big numbers on TV, magically became a bad game again, then a good game again after the Color of Money, etc, etc?

You fail to understand how cultural trend plays a role in all of this, and cultural shifts in sports are usually driven by something outside of the sport (an engaging personality, a popular movie or TV show, etc). It has absolutely nothing to do with the intrinsic quality of the games in question.

 

[caff3in3]

I would rather play in a room that you can smoke in.
I can't walk outside in the middle of a match to smoke and get the stress out of a missed shot, but in room i can smoke in at least I can light up one.

My pool hall though has like 20-25ft ceilings and great ventilation, even when I do not go there, if they do not allow smoking, I'll just go somewhere that does.

I smoke a pack a day and thought this way. They banned smoking indoors quite a few years ago where i live and i dont think i would play in a place that allowed smoking now. If you asked me 10 years ago, i would have said the opposite.

 

[midnightpulp]

Is facebook more popular than myspace because of who the sponsor is, or is it because it's a better product?

And you have your answer.

Is Katy Perry more popular than Miles Davis because of her looks or is it because she makes better music?

Is Twilight more popular than Dickens (only read because schools force kids) because that kind of easily read pap will always be more accessible or is because it's better literature?

And you have your answer.

 

[sonny_burnett]

Sonny,
I agree with your statement but home gameroom construction is way down and that is the market you are referring to.

I was thinking that there is no reason for anyone to build rooms as a business. There just aren't enough players to support the venture.

In home rooms are very difficult to swing. The trend toward smaller homes makes it impossible for most people to afford a room large enough to house a game room.

I just have enough room to put in a 7' table, which I don't want.
I might put one in anyway. Better than no table at all.

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[philly]

I'm lucky enough to have 4 poolrooms within 40 driving minutes of my home. One room is busy all of the time and it has food but no alcohol. It has about 15 9 foot Gold Crowns, an 8 footer, 2 diamond 7 footers and 2 3 cushion tables. They open 9 am everyday including Sunday. Guess what. They have a great owner who knows how to maintain a room, put up with the regulars with good humor, and keep the undesirables out. They advertise the longest running weekly handicapped 9 ball tournament in America. I believe it has been going for 25 years.
My home room has no booze and no food and they get a great crowd. It has about 12 9 foot Gold Crowns, 6 9 foot Gandys, one 9 foot Diamond a heated Gabriels 3 cushion table, and a 10 foot snooker table. It is a busy room and guess what. The owner knows how to maintain a room, put up with the regulars with good humor, and keeps undesirables out. You can find action in both rooms or just friendly games.
Bottom line it's all about the ownership.
The other two rooms are really really trying.

 

[GaryB]

There was way more action and general pool activity before the advent of so many Casinos that siphoned off the compulsive gamblers that made up the action. That along with the inability or lack of foresight to actively court younger players has dampened the enthusiasm and excitement for the sport.

 

[Ron Swanson]

Provide television ratings. I don't give a shit about China since they will watch anything that involves a Chinese player. Basketball games featuring Yao Ming have pulled higher ratings in China alone than the average television ratings for a Champions League Final.



What can we conclude from this? Absolutely nothing. Anyhow, pool is just as popular in China as snooker. Ask Colin, who has actually been there, about it.

Also provide television ratings for darts viewership outside the UK.

What I take issue with is your idea that snooker's popularity (again, only in the UK) is the result of it being a better game than pool. So, snooker was a shitty game for 100 years, when Joe Davis was winning 6 pounds for the World Title and no one cared about it, and then it magically became a "good" game after Higgins' arrival on the scene?

And pool was a "good" game when Greenleaf and a young Mosconi would fill stadiums playing exhibitions and then became magically an uninteresting game after World War II, magically became a good game again after the release of the Hustler, magically became a bad game again in the 70's, magically became a good game again when Fats and Mosconi drew big numbers on TV, magically became a bad game again, then a good game again after the Color of Money, etc, etc?

You fail to understand how cultural trend plays a role in all of this, and cultural shifts in sports are usually driven by something outside of the sport (an engaging personality, a popular movie or TV show, etc). It has absolutely nothing to do with the intrinsic quality of the games in question.

The cyclical nature of fads. Look into it.

Snooker has remained consistently popular for 50 years, and has never had a film or reality tv show to promote it. It became popular when it was televised - think about why that may be for a second. Pool became unpopular when it was televised - think about that for a second also. Let me know if you need any help with joining the dots.

And someone has been to china? Wow!!

 

[Ron Swanson]

Is Katy Perry more popular than Miles Davis because of her looks or is it because she makes better music?

Is Twilight more popular than Dickens (only read because schools force kids) because that kind of easily read pap will always be more accessible or is because it's better literature?

And you have your answer.

Are you (cackhandedly) trying to suggest pool is high brow and snooker is trailer trash?

You're stretching a bit, old chap.

 

[midnightpulp]

The cyclical nature of fads. Look into it.

Snooker has remained consistently popular for 50 years, and has never had a film or reality tv show to promote it. It became popular when it was televised - think about why that may be for a second. Pool became unpopular when it was televised - think about that for a second also. Let me know if you need any help with joining the dots.

And someone has been to china? Wow!!

Again, snooker is only popular in the UK. That is it. It wouldn't draw sufficient enough ratings in any other country aside from when Ding plays, and like I said, the Chinese would watch a fellow citizen paint a house. Means nothing.

Pool was popular as a spectator sport for nearly 100 years (in the US). Look up the purse and the draw the first "world" pool championship got. Made the front page of various newspapers and 15,000 was the purse, in 1860s money! Meanwhile, Joe Davis was playing for 6 whole pounds 60 years later.

"Cycles" can last centuries, so the killshot you thought you had with your rebuttal doesn't hold water.

Television is simply a surrogate for watching something live, so tell me why these people were willing to fill stadiums to watch Greenleaf and then suddenly "not watch" when television became a staple in every home?

Your reasoning and logic is shit. Try actually investigating the history of pool and cultural trends, and maybe you'll offer an actually insightful perspective rather than just trumpeting the same old tired arguments, which don't hold up.

 

[midnightpulp]

Are you (cackhandedly) trying to suggest pool is high brow and snooker is trailer trash?

You're stretching a bit, old chap.

You miss the point again.

Popularity=/=quality, was my main point, which is the retarded line of logic you keep taking to support your argument.

Pool vs. snooker have no inherent "worth" over one another, and it would be idiotic to suggest such.

Anyhow, here's my "killshot."

It featured Willie Mosconi and Minnesota Fats along with six other players from the PPPA (Professional Pool Players Association) competing in a trick shot competition (Irving Crane, Steve Mizerak, Allen Hopkins, Ray Martin, Peter Margo and Ernie Costa).

The show aired in two parts on consecutive Saturdays and Sundays and received the second highest rating for a sport show in 1978 with a 40.7 share of the viewing audience.

In 1978, that would be roughly 35-40 million viewers, higher ratings than any snewka match ever. And if you figure it out, "connect the dots," of why that match drew big compared to pool now, then you will have your answer, and it has nothing to do with "game quality."

 

[Grantstew]

It is damn pricey though.

I play for a team, so I don't pay for table time

 

[Ken_4fun]

Earl Strickland is a big contributor to the death of pool.

His actions when there was sponsorship on the line at Romines, where he quit during the match after Corey Duell was softbreaking, pretty put the stake in the heart of sponsorship of professional pool.

Ken

 

[jburkm002]

I was watching I think it's called what a shot on YouTube. There were several and one showed either how crazy or just plain disrepectful Earl is.

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[Baby Huey]

I own a room in Ventura Ca. and I die 6 months of the year due to weather and the other 6 months I do OK. Now, pool is not dead it's just taking a new form. Leagues will be the salvation of pool. APA and BCA being the two biggest. APA has a stranglehold on pool. Case in point just look at their franchise fee with a waiting list to boot. What we players want is to see more tournaments with the top players playing. That's going away in our country. What will emerge is that pool will become more of a participation sport vs a spectator sport. The two competing leagues really don't embellish the top players. APA doesn't at all and BCA still hosts some Pro events. Frankly if it weren't for BCA we wouldn't have much of a pro tour at all. Lastly it costs a lot to learn to play our game. An owner has to take it on the chin financially to get the young kids to play pool. I'm most lucky that one of my kids just won the Junior Nationals (Chris Robinson.) I actually have a total of three kids who if they stay with it might repeat what Chris accomplished. So, back to the main point and that is that whoever owns a pool room has to figure out a way to get the kids into their rooms not out of their rooms.

 

[Ron Swanson]

Your reasoning and logic is shit.

Lol.

rather than just trumpeting the same old tired arguments, which don't hold up.

Lol.

 

[Ron Swanson]

You miss the point again.

Popularity=/=quality, was my main point, which is the retarded line of logic you keep taking to support your argument.

Pool vs. snooker have no inherent "worth" over one another, and it would be idiotic to suggest such.

Anyhow, here's my "killshot."



In 1978, that would be roughly 35-40 million viewers, higher ratings than any snewka match ever. And if you figure it out, "connect the dots," of why that match drew big compared to pool now, then you will have your answer, and it has nothing to do with "game quality."

No, it has everything to do with it being a trick shot contest, apparently. Freak shows always attract the hoi polloi.

Hoist. Own. Petard.

 

[Ron Swanson]

I play for a team, so I don't pay for table time

Sweet. I paid for a table yesterday for the first time in...well, probably ever. Quite a shock, won't be doing that again in a hurry...

 

[midnightpulp]

No, it has everything to do with it being a trick shot contest, apparently. Freak shows always attract the hoi polloi.

Hoist. Own. Petard.

Wrong again. Trick shots were featured, but Fats and Mosconi played sets of 9 ball, straight, and one pocket.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gtnmfb9Dnkg

 

[Horsetrader]

Jerry is right here, smoking usually goes with gambling and gambling always goes with pool. Pool isn't the only sport that is slowing down. I hear golf is too. Golf is expensive to play. On the news the other day they are actually making the holes bigger to attract more players. I thought that was so funny. That might work for pool.