Vision Centre Shift

[Pidge]

Does anyone experience this? One week, day, month you play with a certain vision centre and you play great then you start to play bad and can't hit the cue ball at all then you shift the vision centre slightly or drastically in some of my experiences and you play better than ever for a while. With me it's a constant cycle. Things like being tired and even lighting can make a difference.

Thoughts?

 

[ronscuba]

I find when I get lazy with my routine, my alignment goes off. Eyes, shaft, elbow, one or more gets slightly off and then all of a sudden I am missing.

It happens regularly for me roughly monthly. To get back, I get more methodical with my routine, paying special attention to aiming lines and alignment. When everything is lined up, eyes, shaft, body, elbow, shoulder, etc., my stroke feels like it is in a slot and I cannot miss.

So I don't think my vision center is shifting, just me getting lazy and not always aligning correctly.

 

[us820]

Does anyone experience this? One week, day, month you play with a certain vision centre and you play great then you start to play bad and can't hit the cue ball at all then you shift the vision centre slightly or drastically in some of my experiences and you play better than ever for a while. With me it's a constant cycle. Things like being tired and even lighting can make a difference.

Thoughts?

Absolutely yes.It didn't used to until about 45.

 

[Dave-Kat]

Yes @pidge and it's much like @ronsscuba. I tend to loose it when my PSR is disrupted by distractions as well as being lazy. Just allot going on. That is the way it's always been for me.

My mind is always moving from one thought to another and when, that's when I can harness my mind, clear outside thoughts, and focus on my PSR, my vision and stroke follows and my game jumps up considerably.

Sometimes when I am missing shots or inconsistent that I find myself playing lazy and by 100% feel not taking the short amount of time to set up properly. I do not even realize I am doing it until I screw up a shot or shape while running. I catch it now most of the time and step back and 're-focus' but sometimes it's too late and I have blown my game or match. The good: I am getting better at catching it sooner:groucho:


The most important part about this to me is I now understand the inconsistency problem. Solid PSR discipline is crucial for me to improve my vision, game and consistency.

Have a good day,

-Kat,

 

[Pacecar]

I used to fight my problem that my left eye might be the dominant eye for a particular day .... and then day(s) later my right eye would be the dominant eye. Drove me crazy trying to hit dead center cue ball. My fix was to squint my eye(s). In my PSR stance lineup, I briefly squint my right eye to make my left eye become dominant .... then as I'm going down on the shot, I briefly squint my left eye to shift and force my right eye to become the desired dominant eye (both eyes are open). With this routine, I'm now able to maintain a consistent vision center and hit the cue ball precisely.
Each person's eyesight is different. This is what it took for me to maintain a consistent and accurate vision center.

 

[One Pocket John]

See figure 14.4 or read the whole article.
http://neuroscience.uth.tmc.edu/s2/chapter14.html

For those having issues, private message me with your email address and I will email you my 1000 word fix for this issue. Pidge I did borrow a few lines from a post you made long ago.

Works for me and I'm almost 70. If it doesn't work for you put it on the shelf and visit it later.

This is not Gene's perfect aim.

Have fun that's what the game is all about.

John

 

[Pidge]

See figure 14.4 or read the whole article.
http://neuroscience.uth.tmc.edu/s2/chapter14.html

For those having issues, private message me with your email address and I will email you my 1000 word fix for this issue. Pidge I did borrow a few lines from a post you made long ago.

Works for me and I'm almost 70. If it doesn't work for you put it on the shelf and visit it later.

This is not Gene's perfect aim.

Have fun that's what the game is all about.

John

I've dropped you a message John.

I'm not a huge fan of trying to get the head in one specific place under the eyes every shot. I always tell people to sight the shot and stay on this sight line with the vision as you get down and bring the tip to centre ball. 99 times out of 100 a player will go to what is natural this way and it's almost always bang on if not very very close to their vision centre.

It could be because of this why I find it changes. Some shots I sight with my right eye so as I get down its slightly, very slightly to the right of my chin. But most shots I sight with the left eye and naturally when doing this get the cue very slightly to the left of my chin. It may be that I've learned to sight shots and aim them with both eyes over the years and have basically just memorised all the angles that come up.

I've made centuries in snooker with the cue way out to the left of my face, way out to the right like Earl and plum in the centre. I'm definitely not a player that has no dominant eye... I'm definitely left eye dominant but for pool it doesn't matter really. Depends how I sight as to where the vision centre is.

 

[3kushn]

Is it vision or rhythm? Getting out of rhythm screws up everything.

 

[One Pocket John]

Emails have been sent to all that have asked.

Its the body position.

John

 

[One Pocket John]

I've dropped you a message John.

I'm not a huge fan of trying to get the head in one specific place under the eyes every shot. I always tell people to sight the shot and stay on this sight line with the vision as you get down and bring the tip to centre ball. 99 times out of 100 a player will go to what is natural this way and it's almost always bang on if not very very close to their vision centre.

It could be because of this why I find it changes. Some shots I sight with my right eye so as I get down its slightly, very slightly to the right of my chin. But most shots I sight with the left eye and naturally when doing this get the cue very slightly to the left of my chin. It may be that I've learned to sight shots and aim them with both eyes over the years and have basically just memorised all the angles that come up.

I've made centuries in snooker with the cue way out to the left of my face, way out to the right like Earl and plum in the centre. I'm definitely not a player that has no dominant eye... I'm definitely left eye dominant but for pool it doesn't matter really. Depends how I sight as to where the vision centre is.

Pidge, in the info I sent you. Once the standing alignment is established and you begin to fall down on the shot line let your strongest eye become your guide for all parts of your body. The cue will naturally fall down, along with the bridge, shoulder, elbow and grip hand where your strongest eye feels that you are on the shot line.
Jeez, this stuff is hard to put into words.

Have fun man.

John

 

[One Pocket John]

Is it vision or rhythm? Getting out of rhythm screws up everything.

No Tom, its vision. Rhythm is a personal thing.

I have no conscious thought of when to shoot the shot or how many practice strokes I take for a shot. My eyes seem to be connected to the sub-conscious and my arm just shoots. I do have a very disciplined PSR and I just do it.

Can't put this type of stuff into words.

John

 

[One Pocket John]

Does anyone experience this? One week, day, month you play with a certain vision centre and you play great then you start to play bad and can't hit the cue ball at all then you shift the vision centre slightly or drastically in some of my experiences and you play better than ever for a while. With me it's a constant cycle. Things like being tired and even lighting can make a difference.

Thoughts?

Enjoy

John

 

[Scott Lee]

John...3kushn is Tom...not Bill. :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

No Bill, its vision. Rhythm is a personal thing.

John

 

[One Pocket John]

John...3kushn is Tom...not Bill. :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Corrected. TY

John

 

[bbb]

pidge
as you know i have vision center issues
the method i describe in this thread has helped me tremendously
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=427338
it may help you too since regardless of where your vision center is on any given day
looking thru the "2 " cues will keep you in the vision center position
in a separate thread on another subject some one linked a nic barrow video on alignment
what i found is my method forces me into many of the positions nic advocates
ie kept my head on the line all the way down
and my bridge hand and cue on the line early while going down

 

[BilliardsAbout]

The vision center tends to be fixed, not movable or changing, even with degenerating eyesight. You could start to get cataracts in one eye and you'd still have the same vision center location in front of your face. However, stance may play a role here. Consider...

1. I take a step forward toward the table to start my stance with the foot opposite my shooting hand.

2. It's a normal step for balance, not a very long step or baby step, as if I'm walking down the street.

3. I allow my neck to freely rotate to the side (it turns with the torso) so that my left eye is slightly ahead of my right eye over the shot line (I'm right handed).

4. I put my vision center down atop the shot line for the cue ball.

So, if your stance positions changes day to day, your head position changes, thus your VC. Make sense?

 

[greyghost]

johns write up is pretty good, he sent it to me awhile back....sadly it keeps getting lost in my stuff....i wanted to combine it with some of the things i teach others. i highly recommend the read.

pidge.....make sure your wrist is straight....this could be a culprit. Then once yor eyes are hitting the spot your wrist is crocked to your gold....check that out and make sure thats not whats busting your balls.

in the old vids i taught the index finger to thumb on back hand, and middle finger......

i currently play with that thumb touching the nip of my ring finger.....

if you look at your hand and go from index, bird, ring with the thumb it straightens the wrist out more and more and then pow, perfect straight.

it will also show that tension the cue puts in the hand once you pull it back too far.....when the hand will hti the back of your shoe you will feel it.....

been talking crap about this and leading in from afar with the cue stick and walking in the shot, as opposed to side stepping in.......

causes lots of problems with the side step from close quarter....lead with cue.

then the body has no choice. but to be on that line that that cues perfectly on.

that hand thing tho is pretty radical.....i been doing that for over a decade and now on that ring finger for about 6 months and i doubt ill ever look back. its helped me to lighten up my "cradle" even more and kept down the dumb ass long pullbacks that always cost us in general.

- the gh gh gh greyghost

 

[us820]

The vision center tends to be fixed, not movable or changing, even with degenerating eyesight. You could start to get cataracts in one eye and you'd still have the same vision center location in front of your face. However, stance may play a role here. Consider...

1. I take a step forward toward the table to start my stance with the foot opposite my shooting hand.

2. It's a normal step for balance, not a very long step or baby step, as if I'm walking down the street.

3. I allow my neck to freely rotate to the side (it turns with the torso) so that my left eye is slightly ahead of my right eye over the shot line (I'm right handed).

4. I put my vision center down atop the shot line for the cue ball.

So, if your stance positions changes day to day, your head position changes, thus your VC. Make sense?

I believed that I could never change until it happened to me.My moderate right dominance has switched to weakly left.It happened over a 1 1/2-2 year period.It caused many frustrations until I figured out what was going on.My right eye had degenerated quite a bit as well.

 

[ronscuba]

johns write up is pretty good, he sent it to me awhile back....sadly it keeps getting lost in my stuff....i wanted to combine it with some of the things i teach others. i highly recommend the read.

pidge.....make sure your wrist is straight....this could be a culprit. Then once yor eyes are hitting the spot your wrist is crocked to your gold....check that out and make sure thats not whats busting your balls.

in the old vids i taught the index finger to thumb on back hand, and middle finger......

i currently play with that thumb touching the nip of my ring finger.....

if you look at your hand and go from index, bird, ring with the thumb it straightens the wrist out more and more and then pow, perfect straight.

it will also show that tension the cue puts in the hand once you pull it back too far.....when the hand will hti the back of your shoe you will feel it.....

been talking crap about this and leading in from afar with the cue stick and walking in the shot, as opposed to side stepping in.......

causes lots of problems with the side step from close quarter....lead with cue.

then the body has no choice. but to be on that line that that cues perfectly on.

that hand thing tho is pretty radical.....i been doing that for over a decade and now on that ring finger for about 6 months and i doubt ill ever look back. its helped me to lighten up my "cradle" even more and kept down the dumb ass long pullbacks that always cost us in general.

- the gh gh gh greyghost

Having a hard time picturing your grip/wrist. I can touch thumb to ring finger with wrist in any position. Wrist straight can be interpreted differently since wrist can move is so many different directions and wrist has a top, bottom and side.

Can you post a picture ?

 

[greyghost]

Having a hard time picturing your grip/wrist. I can touch thumb to ring finger with wrist in any position. Wrist straight can be interpreted differently since wrist can move is so many different directions and wrist has a top, bottom and side.

Can you post a picture ?

watch my videos you will understand.....

greyghost pool on youtube