Does being a strong player make you a better cue builder??

B

bbb

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just curious hear the opinions of the cuemakers
another way to phrase the question is
if you cant play a lick can you still be an excellent cuemaker??
i mean no offense to the players or non players
personally i think you can be a great cuemaker even if you cant play
but being a player you can test your cue and tweak it so it plays/feel to your liking
and can relate better to what a player wants from the cue
since i am not a cue maker what do i know
i would like your opinions
thanks
 
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bbb said:
just curious hear the opinions of the cuemakers
another way to phrase the question is
if you cant play a lick can you still be an excellent cuemaker??
i mean no offense to the players or non players
personally i think you can be a great cuemaker even if you cant play
but being a player you can test your cue and tweak it so it plays/feel to your liking
and can relate better to what a player wants from the cue
since i am not a cue maker what do i know
i would like your opinions
thanks
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That debate could go on forever :)
It certainly helps to be a decent player and undersatand the game, but having good machinist skills, an artistic eye, a rudimentary knowledge of physics and a good knowledge of the materials you are using is perhaps more important..
 
IMHO, it is an advantage to a cuemaker being able to play a little bit. A cuemaker that can distinguish the different types of 'hit' and 'playability' will have an advantage over one that does not. However, it doesn't mean that a cuemaker that cannot or does not play doesn't have a chance to be an excellent cuemaker. I think build quality and consistency is key to be a good cuemaker.
 
I think it helps as a cuemaker to be a decent player. The reason I say so is if you can play decent and like the way your cues play then there are some others that will feel the same way. But having said that, there are some cuemakers who would be D level players that make pretty good cues. So being a decent player helps you decide what your cues should play like, but it does not help you with tolerances, inlay work or finish. There are cuemakers out there that are top notch with tolerances, inlay work and finish who have zero chance of winning our annual Cuemakers International 9 Ball Championship event. Only the players themselves can decide whose cues play the best.
 
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It depends on what you're after.

Someone recently mentioned that it is not hard to make a "good" guitar, and that the same thing seemed to be true with pool cues.

And given that there are plenty of excellent simple cue configurations to copy, I reckon anyone with basic machining skills and a bit of imagination can make a "good" pool cue whether they play pool or not.

Just follow any of several tried and true recipes and a pretty damned good pool cue will result. Evidence of that is available in the many Asian and other mass-produced cues that play well.

The people making these cues are just following a set of specs.
They don't play pool.

None of these cues are what I would call exceptional, but at the factory, who's to know? They don't play pool!

There are two components to cuemaking, manufacture and development. If the cuemaker, wherever they are, is strictly a manufacturer, the cue's performance will never improve. They will never know what's really important. They will not improve except by the benefits gained through repetition.

On the other side of it, they will never "fail". ( There's the real story, but perhaps off-topic)

If one has never experienced making a nice table length 20* cut from 4 inches off the rail with a GREAT cue, and felt that pop and hear that ball fall....see, my hair is already standing up.

How can one make GREAT cues without that inspiration?

Robin Snyder
 
Post

A strong player and knowledge of woods/materials and how they are used and react to all the elements in a cue is key I believe.




Rob.M
 
Maybe. I think being above a C player would be good enough .
I know plenty of cue makers who do not play at shortstop speed.
Or have never won a regional open tournament.
I surely know a lot of people who think they are good players but have never won a regional open tournament. Heck, a lot of them won't play for $20 unless they get the nuts.

Does it really take a really a pro-speed ability to see cue ball action, deflection and feel the cue ? Not really.
Does it take pro-speed playing ability to learn solid construction or knowledge of good materials?
 
PRED said:
Who can't play a lick and makes great playing cues?
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Bob Frey. He'll tell you he's not a player but he makes a pretty nice cue and made a whole pile of the old logo Scruggs cues I love before he left Scruggs to go on his own. So there's 1.
 
thanks to those above who responded...............:thumbup:
i appreciate your opinions on the subject.....:)
 
carguy said:
Someone recently mentioned that it is not hard to make a "good" guitar, and that the same thing seemed to be true with pool cues.
Click to expand...

That was probably me. I know of many luthiers that don't play at all. It's a lot more common with luthiers that build violins family instruments than those that build guitars, because let's be honest - it's just not that hard to strum a few chords on a guitar and everyone learns. Violin is significantly more difficult to make something musical happen.

But with that said, I'll put it out there that ESPECIALLY with the guitar it helps to be a somewhat strong player. Body shape, neck shape, pickup selection, setup, the ultimate tone you achieve, etc...it's much more difficult to determine if you're a weak player because you don't have the skill and touch to really take your instrument for a test drive and see where you stand.

Violin family instruments are a little more formulaic. Other than aging, it would be difficult to distinguish between an instrument made today and an instrument made hundreds of years ago, so it's much less of a big deal if you play or not. Just follow the rules.
 
jasonlaus said:
Are engine builders race car drivers? That's all
Jason
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They may not have nerves of steel & cat-like reflexes required to race, but you can bet anybody building engines knows how to drive.

IMO, it's possible for somebody to make a nice cue without being a good player. However, repeatable consistency won't be so easy to pull off if you don't know what the cue is supposed to do & can adequately test them. I don't believe a guy has to be "A" level+, just competent. The two kinda go hand in hand. Personally, my game suffers dramatic swings from C-level to running packs & gambling, depending on how much table time I'm getting. If you play me when I'm not playing much, you'd not think much of my game. If you play me when I have been putting in a lot of hours, you'd have to take consideration in making a fair game before gambling. Two totally different players, same guy. It's not that my knowledge fades, but rather my muscle memory, speed control, and focus. I have to keep those things in shape in order to play well. My game doesn't translate much into my cues. If anything, being a cue maker has helped my game.
 
Bank it said:
Bob Frey. He'll tell you he's not a player but he makes a pretty nice cue and made a whole pile of the old logo Scruggs cues I love before he left Scruggs to go on his own. So there's 1.
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That is a very good point. If someone was trained by a good cuemaker then they can become a good cuemaker without being a player for sure. All they have to do is what they were told and trust the results.
 
qbilder said:
They may not have nerves of steel & cat-like reflexes required to race, but you can bet anybody building engines knows how to drive.

IMO, it's possible for somebody to make a nice cue without being a good player. However, repeatable consistency won't be so easy to pull off if you don't know what the cue is supposed to do & can adequately test them. I don't believe a guy has to be "A" level+, just competent. The two kinda go hand in hand. Personally, my game suffers dramatic swings from C-level to running packs & gambling, depending on how much table time I'm getting. If you play me when I'm not playing much, you'd not think much of my game. If you play me when I have been putting in a lot of hours, you'd have to take consideration in making a fair game before gambling. Two totally different players, same guy. It's not that my knowledge fades, but rather my muscle memory, speed control, and focus. I have to keep those things in shape in order to play well. My game doesn't translate much into my cues. If anything, being a cue maker has helped my game.
Click to expand...

Eric's post is on the money and I found myself chuckling, nodding and saying "Yup!" while reading it. My own experience is similar.

Years ago I read an interview of Jim Hall, prime mover behind the Chaparral race cars, which, at the time, with team driver Hap Sharp and himself at the wheel, were winning....everything. The subject in particular was how they went about developing their engines and chassis, given that they had the might of General Motors engineering department figuratively just outside their back door. What more could one want? They had their own test track elaborately instrumented to harvest data. The interviewer wanted to talk dino readings and torque curves but when asked point blank what made their engines sooo good, what instruments are the best, which data were the most important, Hall patted his ass and smiled and said "It's all right here".

I think the same is true with pool cues and most other sporting equipment. The only way to know what "good" is, is to use the equipment. I can think of possible exceptions, pool vaulting perhaps. How else do you find out that "Damn, that wood combination looks great! But it hits like a couch cushion. It'll burn well though".

Robin Snyder
 
Makes me wonder, how many cue makers have a pool table at home or easy access to a pool table ( a 9 footer I hope ) .

My late mentor had two basic tests for his cues for him to tell how the cue hit. Neither one involved a pool table .
 
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