CTE questions

Fancy and complicated aiming systems are a waste of time until you have a perfect or near perfect PSR and stroke .
In fact, they make people's game worse by over complicating it .

Ghostball is a waste of time until you have a perfect or near perfect PSR and stroke . In fact pool is a waste of time without those. Except for the people drinking and having fun of course.
 
Ghostball is a waste of time until you have a perfect or near perfect PSR and stroke . In fact pool is a waste of time without those. Except for the people drinking and having fun of course.

Actually, it isn't .
The ghost ball can be incorporated in your PSR.
The middle of that gb is the shot line.
 
Have you been to this website? There's a lot of information on CTE in it.
http://www.billiardsthegame.com/offset-and-pivot-aiming-systems-395

I have watched a LOT of CTE videos and I am no closer to understanding it than before I watched the first one. Just when I think I am beginning to get it someone else explains it differently. At least it seems different to me. I would really like to give it a fair try but don't even see exactly what to try. Many of the videos aren't even teaching CTE they are talking about advanced CTE concepts or why it works or why some say id doesn't work, etc.

I assume Stan Shuffett is the authority but I can't find an ABC how to do it video by him. Howard Berger teaches it and so does 'Lil Chris but they don't explain it the same way. It could be I am just thick headed but I know others who have the same issue.

One person says (Berger I think) you line up with a 1/2 tip offset to the A B or C quadrant of the object ball then pivot to the center. Center of which ball, the object ball or cue ball. Back hand pivot or front hand or just a shift. How do you decide to use the A B or C? And so forth. They say things like "I would line up to the B quadrant ..." but they don't say why. How you decide which quadrant is the decision making point of most systems. 1/2 ball / 1/4 ball, 3/4 ball it is always an estimate of the approximate angle to begin with as far as I can tell. So if your first step is an estimate you still have to see how much of the ball you are hitting or how ever you want to define don't you?

Is there a clear simple step by step explanation video somewhere?
 
Pat.

No! It is 90/90 with an air pivot.

Pops

I've heard of this, the "air pivot". It's all pretty subjective.
Any pivot method that doesn't have an exact pivot point that can be used for every shot is a very subjective method of aiming, requiring a lot of trial and error. I mean, the only way to pivot perfectly onto the correct shot line everytime is to be able to recognize the shot line and the exact pivot needed that puts your cue on that line.

All of these pivot methods seem about as time consuming to learn (or develop consistency) as ghostball or traditional fractions or contact point aiming, so why pivot at all? In other words, since you have to develop the ability to recognize where the cue needs to be in order to make a pivot work out just right, why not just step right in and line up with the recognized shot line without pivoting? Some will say they don't have to know or recognize the shot line, that the pivot takes them to it, but it doesn't, not everytime. Sometimes it just works out, like when a fractional aimer just happens to be on a dead halfball shot or a straight in. It happens a lot, but you must learn to recognize (through experience and practice) every other shot that doesn't happen to line up perfectly for a halfball or straight in.

It's no different with pivot aiming. It'll work out great for some shots here and there, but for every other shot you must work with the pivot points in order to make it work out, which is why it takes a lot of practice -- because you have to develop the skill of recognizing when it looks like you are lined up correctly.
 
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...the only way to pivot perfectly onto the correct shot line everytime is to be able to recognize the shot line and the exact pivot needed that puts your cue on that line.
I see pivoting differently - as a way to "scan" across a range of cut angles until you recognize the correct one. In fact, I think many of us do it to some degree as part of our "final fine tuning", whether or not we think of it as pivoting. I don't believe pivot system users really know in advance where to place their bridge for pivoting to the perfect center ball cut - I think the bridge placement and pivot are part of the "feel" needed for the shot.

pj
chgo
 
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I see pivoting differently - as a way to "scan" across a range of cut angles until you recognize the correct one. In fact, I think many of us do it to some degree as part of our "final fine tuning", whether or not we think of it as pivoting. I don't believe pivot system users really know in advance where to place their bridge for pivoting to the perfect center ball cut - I think the bridge placement and pivot are part of the "feel" needed for the shot.

pj
chgo

I understand, but I'm talking about defined/planned pivots, where the initial alignment of the cue is several degreed from the shot line, lined up in reference to the cb edge or a half tip from ccb or whatever. I think you are talking about the tweaking that occurs once you are down on the line, sweeping or pivoting a little right or left as needed, which I wouldn't call a pivot. When I get down on the shot I'm not doing any pivoting or browsing around for center cb. If I don't feel or recognize that I'm on the line, I stand up and reposition my bridgehand and stance a little. I try to never adjust for being off a touch while I'm down. It's a bad habit. I see players get down on the cb and then start moving their cue around looking for the line and I think, wow that looks iffy.
 
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I've heard of this, the "air pivot". It's all pretty subjective.
Any pivot method that doesn't have an exact pivot point that can be used for every shot is a very subjective method of aiming, requiring a lot of trial and error. I mean, the only way to pivot perfectly onto the correct shot line everytime is to be able to recognize the shot line and the exact pivot needed that puts your cue on that line.

All of these pivot methods seem about as time consuming to learn (or develop consistency) as ghostball or traditional fractions or contact point aiming, so why pivot at all? In other words, since you have to develop the ability to recognize where the cue needs to be in order to make a pivot work out just right, why not just step right in and line up with the recognized shot line without pivoting? Some will say they don't have to know or recognize the shot line, that the pivot takes them to it, but it doesn't, not everytime. Sometimes it just works out, like when a fractional aimer just happens to be on a dead halfball shot or a straight in. It happens a lot, but you must learn to recognize (through experience and practice) every other shot that doesn't happen to line up perfectly for a halfball or straight in.

It's no different with pivot aiming. It'll work out great for some shots here and there, but for every other shot you must work with the pivot points in order to make it work out, which is why it takes a lot of practice -- because you have to develop the skill of recognizing when it looks like you are lined up correctly.

So you think pivot based systems only work for half ball hits and straight ins. Wouldn't make it much of a system then would it.
How about this. Why don't you actually learn a pivot based system, doesn't matter which one, in it's entirety then come back with an opinion. I think your mind would be changed if you really learned one.
 
So you wouldn't agree that a two line system would be better then an imaginary ball. I certainly think it would. And i would also use contact points before ever relying on a ghostball. But if ghostball improves your PSR go for it.
Well, there's a video proof there of someone who spent a day with Stan and has been touting the system for over a decade .

Sure, contact points can be better than GB, after all you see pros line up the contact points when making combos. Even the ones who claim they use this heavenly system . Heck , I saw the kid line up the contact point on an open table shooting the 10-ball.
Contact points eventually come with experience.

The GB is a good basis for your PSR. Even if your stroke is not perfect yet.
At least you can get your PSR going.
Starting from your rear foot. Why place it dead straight to the OB when it's a cut shot ?
Snooker coaches teach it . Should we argue with them ?
 
So you think pivot based systems only work for half ball hits and straight ins. Wouldn't make it much of a system then would it.
How about this. Why don't you actually learn a pivot based system, doesn't matter which one, in it's entirety then come back with an opinion. I think your mind would be changed if you really learned one.

No I don't think pivot systems only work for halfball hits or straight ins. I never said that. I said using a pivot will work for some shots if the pivot happens to land on the shot line, if the balls just happen to be laying right for the pivot to work. But in order for the same pivot to work on other shots the player must learn to judge where the pivot point needs to be in order for the cue to end up on the shot line, whether it's an air pivot or a bridgehand pivot.

I only mentioned halfball and straight in shots in reference to fractional aiming. If a fractional ball user thinks every shot can be aimed with a halfball hit or a straight in, based on the fact that many times those aim points happen to work, then they will miss every other shot because the balls don't happen to fall right in position for a halfball or straight in shot. The player must develop the ability to tweak the aim based on experience, and recognize when they are on the correct shot line.

Now, looking at pivot aiming, it's equally as absurd to think one or two pivots can make every shot simply because they happen to work on a few shots when the balls are in the right position. On every other shot, when the balls aren't lying perfect for the pivot, the player must develop the ability to either tweak the offset or tweak the pivot point in order to arrive on the shot line, and they must be able to recognize that they are on the shot line.
 
Well, there's a video proof there of someone who spent a day with Stan and has been touting the system for over a decade .

Sure, contact points can be better than GB, after all you see pros line up the contact points when making combos. Even the ones who claim they use this heavenly system . Heck , I saw the kid line up the contact point on an open table shooting the 10-ball.
Contact points eventually come with experience.

The GB is a good basis for your PSR. Even if your stroke is not perfect yet.
At least you can get your PSR going.
Starting from your rear foot. Why place it dead straight to the OB when it's a cut shot ?
Snooker coaches teach it . Should we argue with them ?

American coaches teach all kinds of things, should we argue with them?
And Tyler has been coached by several including Mark Wilson and JOHAN RUIJSINK, Haven't heard a single word about them talking him out of using CTE.
 
No I don't think pivot systems only work for halfball hits or straight ins. I never said that. I said using a pivot will work for some shots if the pivot happens to land on the shot line, if the balls just happen to be laying right for the pivot to work. But in order for the same pivot to work on other shots the player must learn to judge where the pivot point needs to be in order for the cue to end up on the shot line, whether it's an air pivot or a bridgehand pivot.

I only mentioned halfball and straight in shots in reference to fractional aiming. If a fractional ball user thinks every shot can be aimed with a halfball hit or a straight in, based on the fact that many times those aim points happen to work, then they will miss every other shot because the balls don't happen to fall right in position for a halfball or straight in shot. The player must develop the ability to tweak the aim based on experience, and recognize when they are on the correct shot line.

Now, looking at pivot aiming, it's equally as absurd to think one or two pivots can make every shot simply because they happen to work on a few shots when the balls are in the right position. On every other shot, when the balls aren't lying perfect for the pivot, the player must develop the ability to either tweak the offset or tweak the pivot point in order to arrive on the shot line, and they must be able to recognize that they are on the shot line.

So how many shots or angles could a true pivot system be used for? Talking no adjustments or anything, strictly follow the instructions. You say a few shots, what are they?
 
Sure, contact points can be better than GB, after all you see pros line up the contact points when making combos. Even the ones who claim they use this heavenly system . Heck , I saw the kid line up the contact point on an open table shooting the 10-ball.
Contact points eventually come with experience.

If you have a key shot do you rely on the middle of the ghostball or do you use every available thing you know?
 
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