Correct but as detailed below, the billiards are more rewarding objective wise.
Is the 3 Cushion game picking up like the pool game is?
- Thread starter iusedtoberich
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I have to agree, it doesn't seem like you have played billiards very much straightline. You may just be doing thought experiments.
It is OK though because skepticism is a good way to learn.
Try it on a pool table, keep an open mind, and be honest.
There is no billiards where I'm at. There aren't even facilities to train at. This includes pool. What we do have is one table bars frequented by non players.
Regardless, billiards are part of my warm up and indeed craft. I can do threes if they come up that way. My ball control is more pool oriented and biased heavily on the accuracy of the hit and carom.
BUT, the examples I cite are real and I could GAF what the Sanchezes think. To make a billiard shot you need only orient correctly and roll the ball. In pool you need to be much more attuned to the precise quality of the hit. There is no fudge on any of the components excepting maybe when shooting hangers or the cue ball directly into the pocket.
As an example of the approximate nature of caroms, a long time ago when I was discovering pool, I was at the original Palace in Bellflower cluelessly banging at the balls. One of the denizens there walked over to set me on track This guy was legally blind and started raining billiards on me. Banks, tickies, umbrellas, name it... Granted a blind beginner would not fare nearly as well but that experience helped form the premise of _this_interchange on beginner shots.
I am friends with a top 3 cushion player from the 1980’s
we argue all the time is pool or 3 cushion more difficult
i say in pool the hit on the 2nd ball is determined because you have to pocket it
and then play position
he says in 3c you have to control the 2nd ball to be able to have high runs
ie In pool you control the cue ball
in 3c you control 2 balls and have to go at least 3 rails to score
we never agree which game is harder
we argue all the time is pool or 3 cushion more difficult
i say in pool the hit on the 2nd ball is determined because you have to pocket it
and then play position
he says in 3c you have to control the 2nd ball to be able to have high runs
ie In pool you control the cue ball
in 3c you control 2 balls and have to go at least 3 rails to score
we never agree which game is harder
Well, if we look at records, that's false. The record for consecutively pocketed balls is under 800. The record for consecutive caroms it is over 240,000. Those caroms were easy, but it took skill to set up the easy situation and touch to maintain it.
If we look at a much harder carom situation, 18.2 (47/2) balkline, the record in a major tournament for consecutive shots made is by Ludo Dielis in a pentathlon competition. Across six games to 400 points he scored 2010 consecutive points without a miss. He ran out from the break five matches in a row and then only got to 10 in his first inning of the sixth match.
What do you feel the USBA should do? And who will do the work? It's a volunteer organization. Are you going to volunteer?
What should they do?
Try and promote, shouldn't be super hard members have been on here in the past.
Who? Anyone that uses azbilliards and Facebook in the organization
I did offer to volunteer once to promote for them, got crickets, it's their trademark and seem comfortable with it
Which person did you talk to? Have you tried to organize a USBA tournament in Houston? (There are quite a few tables there.) Did you join? Did you go to any tournaments?
I think carom is still dominant in most South American countries, Korea, Vietnam, and Turkey. I'm not sure what's happening in the rest of Europe.
At one time carom was more popular in the US than pool, at least in certain areas. Willie Hoppe got mentioned in a 1930s movie when one character quizzed another on which form of carom Hoppe had his championships in (balkline, answered correctly, which was pretty good for a girl).
Today in the US, I'd say that carom is primarily a game for the immigrants from South and Central America, Korea, Vietnam, and Mexico. Recently a Turkish guy reopened a room with five tables near me. I've heard of immigrant-run rooms with 10 to 15 10-foot heated tables. If you look at the US National Champions in the past 20 years, few native-born Americans appear:
At one time carom was more popular in the US than pool, at least in certain areas. Willie Hoppe got mentioned in a 1930s movie when one character quizzed another on which form of carom Hoppe had his championships in (balkline, answered correctly, which was pretty good for a girl).
Today in the US, I'd say that carom is primarily a game for the immigrants from South and Central America, Korea, Vietnam, and Mexico. Recently a Turkish guy reopened a room with five tables near me. I've heard of immigrant-run rooms with 10 to 15 10-foot heated tables. If you look at the US National Champions in the past 20 years, few native-born Americans appear:
Last edited:
CanadianGuy
Well-known member
really wish a few more carom players took the plunge into pool
Why?
There's more out there then you might think.
So I could show them how I feel when I play them!?!?
I got to play 3c yesterday and I laughed and cried about it.
Here in Tulsa the only place that has a 3c table is a Mexican joint that's not super anglo-friendly. Used to be a Asian spot where they gambled like crazy but cops finally shut them down. Place i play at used to have one but it got so little play and took up space that two pool tables would fit in so its gone. Basically 3c is deader than HulaHoop in Oklahoma.
I am friends with a top 3 cushion player from the 1980’s
we argue all the time is pool or 3 cushion more difficult
i say in pool the hit on the 2nd ball is determined because you have to pocket it
and then play position
he says in 3c you have to control the 2nd ball to be able to have high runs
ie In pool you control the cue ball
in 3c you control 2 balls and have to go at least 3 rails to score
we never agree which game is harder
It may be because I have only played 3C for maybe 30 hours total, without any real instruction, but I think it's a harder game to get hits at vs making a ball. If you think about it, making an average of 1.0 in 3C is a good player. Making 1 ball a rack in pool is a shitty player LOL.
A good pool player going to 3C I think will do even worse than them going to a snooker table to compete against a decent player in that endeavor.
So take a B pool player, a B 3C player and a B snooker player, if that B pool player plays the other two in a round robin, they are likely to be closer in score to the snooker player than they would be to the 3C player at their game, percentage wise. Just my gut feeling from watching and playing the games.
That is what I have seen when traveling for work, the billiard places are almost always Asian or Hispanic rooms.
i am not sure your example is apples with apples
pool and snooker have similar skills and objectives,,,ie pocket a ball /play position for the next shot
so i would not be surprised if they score close to each other playing 3 cushion.
i do not know how to predict how well the 3 cushion player would do playing pool or snooker since the 3 cushion player doesnt practice hitting the 2nd ball to a specific spot but rather to a zone
jmho
for what its worth
the first time i played on a billiard table i ran a 4
so how well a pool/snooker player would do would be based on their skill in cue ball control and knowledge of getting around the table
as an aside
it turns out this first time i was hitting balls on the billiard table with this top 3 cushion player
i was proud of my 4 so i asked him
what did he think of my 3 cushion play?
he said
"you play 3 cushion like a pool player !!!!!!"
which i took as non complimentary
it took me years to learn that he meant i had no idea (at that time) about position play in 3 cushion or that 3 cushion players played position to put the balls into favorable areas to continue their runs
One of the first times I played I ran a 5, simlar to you. I just cut a few long table shots like a pool player and went short-long-short. That never happened again.i am not sure your example is apples with apples
pool and snooker have similar skills and objectives,,,ie pocket a ball /play position for the next shot
so i would not be surprised if they score close to each other playing 3 cushion.
i do not know how to predict how well the 3 cushion player would do playing pool or snooker since the 3 cushion player doesnt practice hitting the 2nd ball to a specific spot but rather to a zone
jmho
for what its worth
the first time i played on a billiard table i ran a 4
so how well a pool/snooker player would do would be based on their skill in cue ball control and knowledge of getting around the table
as an aside
it turns out this first time i was hitting balls on the billiard table with this top 3 cushion player
i was proud of my 4 so i asked him
what did he think of my 3 cushion play?
he said
"you play 3 cushion like a pool player !!!!!!"
which i took as non complimentary
it took me years to learn that he meant i had no idea (at that time) about position play in 3 cushion or that 3 cushion players played position to put the balls into favorable areas to continue their runs
After years of studying and playing the game, I now realize that short-long-short shots are quite difficult, and I simply got lucky with ball position. I didn't posess the correct skill at the time to repeat what I did. Even though I got a 5 once, my average was probably like 0.05.
Now I'm probably around a 0.2-0.33 depending on the day and my focus, which actually is not too bad.
for me i had several "corner 5 " shots and knew the system
3 cushion is simultaneously the most fun and most frustrating game there is. The best I ever did was beat a pretty good player a game to 15 pts in 17 or 18 innings. If my 2nd contact ball could be replaced by a baseball, I could be pretty good at that game