That’s all good by me.
But so far none of that has been proffered.
Lou Figueroa
Digicue Blue. Guys are Afraid to Know?
- Thread starter Bobkitty
- Start date
That’s all good by me.
But so far none of that has been proffered.
Lou Figueroa
I don’t know, I was minding my own beeswax and all of a sudden I got sucked back into a five year old thread.
Lou Figueroa
You seem to be the only person who doesn't see the intrinsic value of an improved stroke.
Sort of like refusing to acknowledge that gold bars have value.
Baffling.
someusername
Well-known member
Those would be anecdotes, not proof. You'd need properly structured independent studies published in peer reviewed academic journals to have any proof.
I don’t think we need to go that far.
It’d just be nice to see something more solid than anecdotal accounts and assumptions.
Lou Figueroa
If anyone was really interested the first questions would be where does this thing go and what does it weigh? I knew these things once for an old model but I have slept a bunch of times since then. If the test equipment itself changes your stroke while it is installed that invalidates the testing.
I think a video camera would give more information and most of us have one in our pocket these days.
Hu
I think a video camera would give more information and most of us have one in our pocket these days.
Hu
Because many people report that they can see improvement according to the device.
Do you have reason to believe that the device might not accurately measure the quality of a person's stroke?
Like, do you think the accelerometers aren't accurate enough? Or what?
Who is these “many” people?
And yes, I do question the device can accurately measure “the quality” of a person’s stroke. What it can measure are particular parameters of motion which do not automatically translate to better performance. Much as with a Coke bottle, all you can achieve is being able to accurately poke through a Coke bottle. It does not mean you have a better stroke nor guarantee you improved performance.
Lou Figueroa
I found a thread from this site after three seconds of googling:
DigiCue Blue improving your game?
I haven't seen any posts in a while concerning this new tool. Now that they have been out for a little bit, who has one? Anyone bearing down and seeing improvements with it?
forums.azbilliards.com
Let's posit that the device correctly measures what it claims to measure: straightness, tip steer, follow-through, and "jab."
Are you saying that if a person's stroke is perfectly straight, with no tip steer, good follow through, and no "jabbyness," that that person's stroke might still actually not be very good?
What aspect of stroke quality do you think the device might not measure?
Or do you think the device doesn't accurately measure the things that it claims to measure?
I have a giant closet full of gizmos and doodangys to help you play better, all half off. Holla at me.
Looking through that thread there appear to be a few guys who felt it helped with little reference to their level of play — so to claim “many” is a bit of a stretch.
Also oh BTW, in that thread were many valid issues with the device and its measurements (just sayin’).
So what I’m saying is that a straight no jab no steer etc stroke, as measured by a device, does not mean you will play better. Just take one look at all the best players out there, now and through the history of the game, and there’s huge variations that allow each individual to be one of those best players, whether it’s a swoop or a steer or a elbow pump or a swipe.
Pool is as much art as it is science. And poking a cue through a Coke bottle is just going to get you good at poking a cue through a Coke bottle. Personally, I’m not swayed by an APA 3 saying they got better because they got good measurements. I mean oh my goodness gracious, virtually anything a lower level player does which gets them practicing is going to mean some kind of improvement or an attempt to limit cognitive dissonance from a new purchase.
Lou Figueroa
with apologies to
Rodgers and Hammerstein
I know that feeling.
I was comparing launch monitors and all their 'supposedly' useful data to these pool gizmos and their 'useful' output. Try to keep up.
boogieman
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
Can the device help to get a stroke straight? I'm sure it can with practice and also watching the feedback of the balls. Only watching the feedback of the balls can also do this, especially when combined with a camera and/or just paying attention to what you are doing. Sometimes having "body awareness" can be a challenge. Some people don't have it but it can be practiced. Some days I don't have it very well, other days I do. The funny part is when I feel like a floating pair of eyeballs with no body awareness, I play my best. When things are perfect in this game I almost forget "I" exist. Flow state? If you've never hit a good stroke, it's hard to have a goal to shoot for... Once I hit it really sweet I chase that feeling on every shot.
I'm sure that there is some usefulness to the Digicue, but like anything it all depends on if you practice well with it and actually incorporate that into your game. It's a tool but obviously not needed to reach high level pool.
Personally I don't need a "tattletale" letting me know when my stroke is bad, I can feel it and it's easily observable based on what the balls do. Of course this is assuming one has consistent enough fundamentals and has played enough to understand what's supposed to happen and how it's supposed to feel. I could see this device being really useful for newer students of the game. The more time you spend getting solid fundamentals at the beginning the better. I know every league night I see many people that could improve their game with something like this, or a coke bottle. When the planets align they shoot great, but there are so many moving parts to their stroke that it's easy for something to go wrong. They've hit/stroked good before, but there are so many moving parts that it's almost up to chance if it happens.
I'm sure that there is some usefulness to the Digicue, but like anything it all depends on if you practice well with it and actually incorporate that into your game. It's a tool but obviously not needed to reach high level pool.
Personally I don't need a "tattletale" letting me know when my stroke is bad, I can feel it and it's easily observable based on what the balls do. Of course this is assuming one has consistent enough fundamentals and has played enough to understand what's supposed to happen and how it's supposed to feel. I could see this device being really useful for newer students of the game. The more time you spend getting solid fundamentals at the beginning the better. I know every league night I see many people that could improve their game with something like this, or a coke bottle. When the planets align they shoot great, but there are so many moving parts to their stroke that it's easy for something to go wrong. They've hit/stroked good before, but there are so many moving parts that it's almost up to chance if it happens.
Zerksies
Well-known member
I don't have the product, but i would think that if it had a live view and you could see in realtime how much your stroke is out of wack. Red is out of alignment and green is perfectly straight.
One reason is that there are more cost-effective solutions available. For example, I have a laser pointer that only costs a few dollars. By adding a lens to split the dot into a line, I can project it vertically onto a wall. This allows me to observe if a student's stance or grip adjustments reduce their deviation when attempting straight strokes.
Man this is a fun read....
What does a good** stroke have to do with improved play..?
**What is good...?
I would think a good stroke is one that is repeatable. It may be mechanically straight as an arrow, or looping chicken wing. Either one can get the job done. Is a straight stroke easier to reproduce...?..., maybe. Is a loopy stroke more difficult to perform consistently...?..., maybe.
Will a device that tells you that your stroke is not straight do anything to fix your stroke. It could just as easily cause you months of worse play if you choose to make the device happy
What does a good** stroke have to do with improved play..?
**What is good...?
I would think a good stroke is one that is repeatable. It may be mechanically straight as an arrow, or looping chicken wing. Either one can get the job done. Is a straight stroke easier to reproduce...?..., maybe. Is a loopy stroke more difficult to perform consistently...?..., maybe.
Will a device that tells you that your stroke is not straight do anything to fix your stroke. It could just as easily cause you months of worse play if you choose to make the device happy
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