Digicue Blue. Guys are Afraid to Know?

I can only speak from my own experience. I have great results from the Digicue Blue. Put it this way at one point mine broke and I searched the web obsessively when OB went out of business. I finally found a page buried on Raymond Linares site. He didn't have a new one but I bought his own personal one.

When I started with the device I had a very straight stroke already in the scoring high in most areas. I really questioned why I bought it. But after more time and I discovered that I really struggled with what was marked as follow through. I didn't understand this because I had a long follow through. I discovered that my stroke was very rushed. Follow through was a deceiving word for what it's measuring. I found that my backstroke was way too fast and then a good pause but then a very quick stroke forward. Over time and a lot of work, I have a much smoother slower more progressive stroke now. This definitely came with more accuracy and control. I was also known by teammates and coaches as someone that stays down on the ball but this definitely catches me at times that I don't. Though it's rare it is always a great reminder that you need to do it on every stroke. It catches me at times I would have never have noticed.

Now, I use it regularly before tournaments just to check for bad habits. Probably should use it more! Every time I use it my play increases just a good tune up of the stroke. It catches any bad habits that have creeped into my game. I find that when I first put it on I very conscious of every aspect of my stroke to get good score. I have to work with until I again the stroke completely subconscious, yet still getting good scores. It just forms great habits in your stroke.

Is this proof? NO
But the correlation of good play when using vs not is very hard to argue. Will it replace coaching absolutely no. But, it will catch things that coaches will not. I've used it while working with coaches they are amazed it see's thing that they missed.
 
I have no intention of buying one. I look at the cue ball while I pull the trigger. I can see clearly where I'm striking the rock, _as I strike it_.
This is plenty resolution for my purposes. Most people however, don't dare take their eyes off the object ball. This drone ball may be the only way they'd be able to tell where they're hitting the cue ball.
 
lfigueroa said:
Looking through that thread there appear to be a few guys who felt it helped with little reference to their level of play — so to claim “many” is a bit of a stretch.
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The question was whether or not they improved their stroke according to the device, not whether or not their play improved.

I was trying to force you to stay on-topic for one f**king second so we could agree on one single point and work from there, but you're back to this "MAYBE THEIR PLAY DIDN'T IMPROVE!" nonsense.

Fine, you got me, I don't have any PROOF that improving a person's stroke will improve their level of play. Nobody does.

A player is chicken-winging like nuts and never hitting the ball where he intended? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.
A player is dropping his shoulder so bad that he miscues half the time? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.
A player is jumping up as he hits every shot? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.
A player is jabbing at the ball so bad that half the time he barely even hits the cue ball and it's a foul? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.

You have successfully argued that how well a person hits the cue ball has nothing to do with how well they play pool. You have won our debate. Can you please post your mailing address so I can send you your trophy. Thank you.
 
BilliardsAbout said:
One reason is that there are more cost-effective solutions available. For example, I have a laser pointer that only costs a few dollars. By adding a lens to split the dot into a line, I can project it vertically onto a wall. This allows me to observe if a student's stance or grip adjustments reduce their deviation when attempting straight strokes.
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There's no point to getting your students to hit the ball straight.

As Lou Figueroa has pointed out to all of us here, there's no proof that it will improve their play.
 
I am the inventor of this device and I posted my thoughts a few pages ago. It was completely stepped over lol.

If you are a late adaptor of technology or don’t like new products invading your tradition, or are simply disenchanted by training devices for the sake of being training devices, then don’t buy one.

If you believe the only way to improve in pool is to develop it as an art form as a whole, as Lou believes, without any type of specific focus, then this is a completely different philosophy. Nothing wrong with that at all. I just think it is an inefficient way to learn.

If you want to shine a flashlight on your fundamentals and if you think doing so will help you, then buy the product.

This product was the combination of my love of engineering and billiards, but has always been a side gig. It isn’t my day job. I want people to enjoy learning the way I did and still do. I don’t make very much money off of this project, and I didn’t create it to make a profit. After OB went under, I stopped making them due to the global chip shortage. I’ve been constantly emailed by various people around the world wanting to know when they would be available again, without any marketing at all, so I relaunched the project myself. The huge demand suggests to me that people get something beneficial out of it.

Lou, you can’t prove anything is helpful for anybody. I think you are just masking your distaste for something different that you didn’t have access to when you were learning to play.
 
nataddrho said:
...
This product was the combination of my love of engineering and billiards, but has always been a side gig. It isn’t my day job. I want people to enjoy learning the way I did and still do. I don’t make very much money off of this project, and I didn’t create it to make a profit. After OB went under, I stopped making them due to the global chip shortage. I’ve been constantly emailed by various people around the world wanting to know when they would be available again, without any marketing at all, so I relaunched the project myself. The huge demand suggests to me that people get something beneficial out of it.

Lou, you can’t prove anything is helpful for anybody. I think you are just masking your distaste for something different that you didn’t have access to when you were learning to play.
Click to expand...
Thanks for making this product. It sounds very cool and I just ordered one on Amazon. I'm looking forward to trying it out.

It's amazing that some people are so quick to s**t on a product with such obvious benefit. You really have to do some mental contortions to dismiss the value of immediate objective feedback on your stroke like e.g. "you didn't follow through on that shot" or "you put unintentional side spin on that shot."

Hopefully this doesn't dissuade you from continuing to work on your projects. I see you have a new cue ball coming out that looks very interesting.
 
tomker said:
Thanks for making this product. It sounds very cool and I just ordered one on Amazon. I'm looking forward to trying it out.

It's amazing that some people are so quick to s**t on a product with such obvious benefit. You really have to do some mental contortions to dismiss the value of immediate objective feedback on your stroke like e.g. "you didn't follow through on that shot" or "you put unintentional side spin on that shot."

Hopefully this doesn't dissuade you from continuing to work on your projects. I see you have a new cue ball coming out that looks very interesting.
Click to expand...
No it doesn't at all. The ones that are quick to dismiss are usually conservative older people with victim mentalities and neural crystallization.

Same ones who complain that laser levels are useless gadgets to build houses when good old string, gravity, and hard work is all you need.
 
nataddrho said:
No it doesn't at all. The ones that are quick to dismiss are usually conservative older people with victim mentalities and neural crystallization.

Same ones who complain that laser levels are useless gadgets to build houses when good old string, gravity, and hard work is all you need.
Click to expand...
String is a crutch for young people.

Used to be, all people needed was decades of experience building crooked houses.
 
mr3cushion said:
Whatever stroke a player executes under pressure and gets the job done, that's the stroke for 'That' player.
Click to expand...
You don't learn how to punch from losing boxing matches. You don't learn how to drive golf balls by playing in tournaments. And you don't learn how to stroke well from being under pressure.

You learn fundamentals of any sport by structured and focused practice of fundamentals. Then later when pressure is applied, you have properly conditioned responses.

Não é Senor Bill?
 
nataddrho said:
You don't learn how to punch from losing boxing matches. You don't learn how to drive golf balls by playing in tournaments. And you don't learn how to stroke well from being under pressure.

You learn fundamentals of any sport by structured and focused practice of fundamentals. Then later when pressure is applied, you have properly conditioned responses.

Não é Senor Bill?
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That's an 'Obvious' in any sport. So, this device is just for beginners that have not developed fundamentals?
 
mr3cushion said:
That's an 'Obvious' in any sport. So, this device is just for beginners that have not developed fundamentals?
Click to expand...
I would say that it leans towards beginners. However quite a few advanced players, some that I personally know, use it every now and then for a ‘tune up’, but definitely not all the time.

For the DigiBall, which we have discussed in the past, knowledge of the exact tip position is subject to the user. For 3C we both know that tip position is extremely important so it can greatly benefit students learning the game. For experienced players who already know the patterns it can be used as a teaching tool, or also for a tune up, or live in matches for the audience, etc.
 
tomker said:
The question was whether or not they improved their stroke according to the device, not whether or not their play improved.

I was trying to force you to stay on-topic for one f**king second so we could agree on one single point and work from there, but you're back to this "MAYBE THEIR PLAY DIDN'T IMPROVE!" nonsense.

Fine, you got me, I don't have any PROOF that improving a person's stroke will improve their level of play. Nobody does.

A player is chicken-winging like nuts and never hitting the ball where he intended? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.
A player is dropping his shoulder so bad that he miscues half the time? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.
A player is jumping up as he hits every shot? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.
A player is jabbing at the ball so bad that half the time he barely even hits the cue ball and it's a foul? No problem! No need to fix that, because there's no PROOF that fixing it would result in better play.

You have successfully argued that how well a person hits the cue ball has nothing to do with how well they play pool. You have won our debate. Can you please post your mailing address so I can send you your trophy. Thank you.
Click to expand...

Well perhaps, ala Hoppe, Greenleaf, McCready — and others using chicken wings, pump strokes, floppy wrists, BHE, and shoulder dropping — are all hitting the ball exactly where and how they want.

You think?

And somewhere further down the food chain are thousands of pool players who have played for decades and have unorthodox strokes but play lights out.

Pool is art as much as it is science.

Lou Figueroa
 
nataddrho said:
I am the inventor of this device and I posted my thoughts a few pages ago. It was completely stepped over lol.

If you are a late adaptor of technology or don’t like new products invading your tradition, or are simply disenchanted by training devices for the sake of being training devices, then don’t buy one.

If you believe the only way to improve in pool is to develop it as an art form as a whole, as Lou believes, without any type of specific focus, then this is a completely different philosophy. Nothing wrong with that at all. I just think it is an inefficient way to learn.

If you want to shine a flashlight on your fundamentals and if you think doing so will help you, then buy the product.

This product was the combination of my love of engineering and billiards, but has always been a side gig. It isn’t my day job. I want people to enjoy learning the way I did and still do. I don’t make very much money off of this project, and I didn’t create it to make a profit. After OB went under, I stopped making them due to the global chip shortage. I’ve been constantly emailed by various people around the world wanting to know when they would be available again, without any marketing at all, so I relaunched the project myself. The huge demand suggests to me that people get something beneficial out of it.

Lou, you can’t prove anything is helpful for anybody. I think you are just masking your distaste for something different that you didn’t have access to when you were learning to play.
Click to expand...

Oh please, I’m all for tech.

I was one of the first to buy all kinds of stuff I saw some value in. But some gadgets are just gimmicks and snake oil.

Lou Figueroa
 
nataddrho said:
No it doesn't at all. The ones that are quick to dismiss are usually conservative older people with victim mentalities and neural crystallization.

Same ones who complain that laser levels are useless gadgets to build houses when good old string, gravity, and hard work is all you need.
Click to expand...

Sure, and the young guys all feell sorry for the innovators and thought Sam Bankman-Fried and Elizabeth Holmes got raw deals, lol.

Lou Figueroa
 
lfigueroa said:
Well perhaps, ala Hoppe, Greenleaf, McCready — and others using chicken wings, pump strokes, floppy wrists, BHE, and shoulder dropping — are all hitting the ball exactly where and how they want.

You think?

And somewhere further down the food chain are thousands of pool players who have played for decades and have unorthodox strokes but play lights out.

Pool is art as much as it is science.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...
Sir. All of those players stroke straight through the ball during the forward stroke. They would all receive high scores on the DigiCue.

Oh please, I’m all for tech.

I was one of the first to buy all kinds of stuff I saw some value in. But some gadgets are just gimmicks and snake oil.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...
I am starting to think you may not know what the DigiCue does.
 
lfigueroa said:
Maybe you should watch some videos of these guys.

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...
This is actually a good point. I indeed have. For example look at Buste. He has some wild warm up strokes, but watch his follow through... perfectly straight. Same for Efren, same for McCready, Breedlove sometimes. A swerve that you might see would only be after contact with the ball, and the DigiCue does not measure this part. Only before contact.

Backstroke pause and finish might score low if the player is rushed, but those are features that can be turned off. Straightness is the core of the product.
 
nataddrho said:
I would say that it leans towards beginners. However quite a few advanced players, some that I personally know, use it every now and then for a ‘tune up’, but definitely not all the time.

For the DigiBall, which we have discussed in the past, knowledge of the exact tip position is subject to the user. For 3C we both know that tip position is extremely important so it can greatly benefit students learning the game. For experienced players who already know the patterns it can be used as a teaching tool, or also for a tune up, or live in matches for the audience, etc.
Click to expand...
Not that much.
 
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