Why Pool Leagues Should Embrace “ALL BALL FOULS”

dr_dave

dr_dave

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FYI, I just posted a new video that discusses and demonstrates why all leagues should follow the WPA official rules of pool, including “All Ball Fouls,” where it is a foul if you touch or move the CB or any OB, even by mistake, at any time during play. Check it out:


Contents:
0:00 - Intro
0:52 - All Ball Fouls
2:36 - CB Fouls Only
6:06 - Why Switch to “All Ball Fouls”
11:01 - Proper Behavior
16:40 - Other Possible Rule Changes
18:21 - What Do You Think?

As always, I look forward to your feedback, comments, questions, complaints, and requests.

Enjoy!
 
InsertCleverNameHere said:
Will watch the video later but hard pass for me. Arguing over whether my shirt touched a ball or not doesn’t sound like a good time and leagues are about fun. Without referees, just forget all ball fouls imo.
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I address this in the video with examples and sound advice. This is not the problem you might think it is.

Please try to watch the video with an open mind, and let us know what you think after watching and thinking about the entire video.
 
I watched it and while I don't disagree, I think that too many TD's are afraid of scaring people off.

People forget. The rules don't exist to help, or to punish. They're just there to tell us how to play the damn game.

Nobody has ever said that they don't want to play baseball because they think they should get 4 strikes...
 
David in FL said:
I watched it and while I don't disagree, I think that too many TD's are afraid of scaring people off.
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I would think a league might be proud to say they were among the first to change. That might actually attract new member.

David in FL said:
People forget. The rules don't exist to help, or to punish. They're just there to tell us how to play the damn game...
Click to expand...

Well stated.
 
InsertCleverNameHere said:
Will watch the video later but hard pass for me. Arguing over whether my shirt touched a ball or not doesn’t sound like a good time and leagues are about fun. Without referees, just forget all ball fouls imo.
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I agree- the league I play in has enough arguments over petty things- don't want to add all ball fouls because it would just be another thing to argue about.
 
poolscholar said:
Shirt fouls, etc make it impossible without a ref at the table all the time
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If the players go at the game with the attitude of, "Screw him before he screws me," that's true. Maybe a change of attitude is needed.

The International Open is played with the strict rules and mostly no ref at the table, and somehow the players manage. Maybe they have the right attitude towards the game.
 
Is the WPA ready and able to govern the entire game of pool worldwide in the same manner as the USGA & R&A does for golf?

How do you get CSI, VNEA, NAPA, APA, TAP, Ultimate Pool USA etc etc to abandon their own rules & just go with what the WPA says?

Pipe dream comes to mind.
 
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poolscholar said:
Shirt fouls, etc make it impossible without a ref at the table all the time
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It is not impossible at all. I cover in detail how to deal with this in the video. Basically, with nobody observing, the shooter gets the benefit of the doubt if they don't admit the foul.
 
Fore Rail said:
Is the WPA ready and able to govern the entire game of pool worldwide in the same manner as the USGA & R&A?

How do you get CSI, VNEA, NAPA, APA, TAP, Ultimate Pool USA etc etc to abandon their own rules & just go with what the WPA says?

Pipe dream comes to mind.
Click to expand...
I think the for-profit US leagues are irrelevant to the international discussion.

Ultimate Pool rules are strict about not touching object balls.
 
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westcoast said:
I agree- the league I play in has enough arguments over petty things- don't want to add all ball fouls because it would just be another thing to argue about.
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Watch the entire video again when you can find the time. I think I make a strong case that "CB Fouls Only" is much more prone to arguments.
 
Fore Rail said:
Is the WPA ready and able to govern the entire game of pool worldwide in the same manner as the USGA & R&A?

How do you get CSI, VNEA, NAPA, APA, TAP, Ultimate Pool USA etc etc to abandon their own rules & just go with what the WPA says?

Pipe dream comes to mind.
Click to expand...

I will start by trying to convince VNEA to follow the new WPA rules (since I play in a VNEA league and know some of the leadership). There really are not that many differences, and the differences are small. I would think they would be proud to say (and market) that they are the first league to completely follow the official rules of pool.
 
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Bob Jewett said:
I think the for-profit US leagues are irrelevant to the international discussion.

Ultimate Pool rules are strict about not touching object balls.
Click to expand...
One of the things I like about golf is that there's no bifurcation of the rules.

With the exception of a very few minor local rules, the guys we see playing on TV on Sunday afternoon play by the exact same rules you and I do in our Saturday four ball...

Apples to apples.
 
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iusedtoberich said:
No sir, barking up the wrong tree. Local leagues cater to beginning guys and gals. Gals with long hair. Boys with big bellies. Many can barely make a bridge. Just let it alone.

All ball fouls should be reserved for high level tournaments.
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Did anyone in an old guys softball league ever quit because they had to run around 4 bases instead of just 3?

Teach them the rules as they exist, and move on....
 
iusedtoberich said:
No sir, barking up the wrong tree. Local leagues cater to beginning guys and gals. Gals with long hair. Boys with big bellies. Many can barely make a bridge. Just let it alone.

All ball fouls should be reserved for high level tournaments.
Click to expand...
Nah. I think anyone interested enough in the game to play in league can learn to play by all the rules. It might take more sportsmanship, though. If they are told what the rule is going to be, I think they would go along.
 
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