Do the rules have a section on turning back the table? I don’t have time to look now. That could be a minefield in itself.
Class Move by Tyler Styer in Iowa, 10 Ball Showdown , against Justin Bergman
- Thread starter Duane Remick
- Start date
Lmao I saw this live, was hilarious! The way they kept giving the cueball back and forth to each other, I thought they were gonna start making out.
Mob parents. Parents should be stay at home while kids go out to playI remember that. Some Chinese guy. Bad scene all around. Nit vs Gangsters...
Intentional fouls is dumb. Must be carry over from UP English 8 ball where intentional foul is penalised
There are 15 balls on table enough balls for someone
8intheside
Well-known member
If they were playing a casual match, I can see how this would
if this were a casual match with nothing on the line I can see this being ok, I could also understand if it were a questionable call and maybe the referee making a mistake, but this was Justin’s mistake and taking ball In Hand would have been ok in my book,
I can't speak to other rulesets but the CSI rules clearly define what they mean by "Obvious" to avoid any such confusion or arguments:
It may seem a little ambiguous if the non-shooting player or referee accepts the shot, but the exceptions list explicitly considers these types of shots as "not obvious" and so they must always be called. Jump Shots also meet this standard and should be added to the exception list for clarity.
A couple notes I would make:
1) In 10-ball, such a non-called shot would be a legal hit and the opponent would just become the shooter. I'm not sure why the ref called it BIH in this case.
2) In 10-ball, if a non-called ball is pocketed, the opponent has the option to give the shot back. So in this case the opponent could have overridden the referee's call by simply giving the shot back.
Yes, I was saying the CSI rules are clear that every combo must be called no matter how obvious. The only rules I could find for Ultimate Pool are close to the WPA rules.
When I watched the video of this incident it looks like the ref called loss of turn and not a foul on Justin.
That's the thing. There's a very fine line between integrity and self-righteousness. Pt109 has argued very successfully that we should all just abide by the rules, even if the rules are stupid. He convinced me to change my position years ago. The problem with pool is that we are all left in this gray area, where the game is not a gentlemen's game by most measures, but we are sometimes arbitrarily expected to treat it as such.
Do we all call fouls on ourselves or do we not? Picking and choosing random times to call fouls on yourself in a refereed match, only handicaps the player who calls the foul, especially when your opponent doesn't even understand the basics of calling fouls, which is very common. Promoters are almost always vague on the expectation here.
I don't feel any obligation to call fouls on myself, as I've been cheated way too many times in my life. What I've settled on is -- I will not lie to my opponent. If they are responsible for being the "referee" and they would rather sit and stare at their phone while I'm shooting, I'm not going to babysit them. There's some wiggle room based on the circumstances, but being honest about questionable hits and situations is sort of my baseline.
You seem to forget that we're dealing with pool players.
Under the World Standardized Rules, there is no "turning back" or "turning over" except on a push out. You must shoot a shot when it's your turn.
Edit: at ten ball, you can force the opponent to shoot again if they pocket an uncalled ball but don't pocket the called ball.
Last edited:
I agree .. if thats a match room event he takes that ball in hand and shoves it up his ass hahaha
Except in 10b where you make a ball no intended, no? So if you have a rule (or practice) that all combos must be called and Justin didn’t call it, then he made an uncalled ball and Tyler could make him shoot again (as he would do if somehow Justin made an uncalled ball and hooked him).
Yes, that would be another exception. Another would be a concession.
Only in the sense of the player has the option if his/her opponent pockets a non-called ball.
Last edited:
Sorry if Bob or anyone else here wrote the WPA rules, but why are they written so poorly/ambiguously. In this "calling obvious shots" case, the CSI rules are so clear for what must be called, while the WPA leaves one scratching their head. Same thing for the push and double hit shots from last week. The WPA rules stink the way they are written.
I vaguely recall Mark Griffen wanted the CSI rules to be written from scratch to be clear, because the other rule sets were always ambiguous.
I vaguely recall Mark Griffen wanted the CSI rules to be written from scratch to be clear, because the other rule sets were always ambiguous.
That's my least favorite UP rule
I don't like it in this context, but I love the rule in general. They want to keep the games from dragging out.