9 Ball Roll Out Situation

skogstokig said:
nope, perfectly not legal. that's why you have to spot/owe a ball after doing so
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In the US, it used to be not a foul to knock object balls onto the floor. If you had scored on the shot, you continued at the table. It was also the rule at 3-cushion billiards. Balls driven off the table would spot. There were carom fancy shots where a kiss could be avoided by flying the first object ball into the lap of an innocent spectator.

As I recall, this changed about 1980, plus or minus a decade.
 
I think the WPA rule is clear. Only two foul rules are suspended during a push out at nine ball. Any other foul still counts as a foul. The fouls that apply in a particular game, such as nine ball, are listed in the rules of that game and described in the common fouls section.
 
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Bob Jewett said:
So far as I know, there is no referee who is in the BCA Hall of Fame. Maybe some players in the HOF have acted as refs, but no one has entered for being one.

The only Tom in the HOF is Tom Rossman. I'm not aware of him ever acting as a referee for nine ball.
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Not in the BCA HOF....
He's in his late 80's from the Midwest, got his award from that area this past year.
50 yrs of service.
Reading the rule book, I came across the verbiage describing the situation.
When I asked him about this, He quickly gave me his thoughts nothing more.... by comparing this moment to 8 ball off table on the break.
Which he's never seen but it's in the rule book.
Attends all major league events.
CSI event recently, and was just in the Tri city area.
I just think the rule book, needs a change to describe this situation better is all.
Pocketing the nine, or intentionally/mistakenly driving it off table should not be the same.
The ACS rule book doesn't describe this situation.
 
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Island Drive said:
Not in the BCA HOF....
He's in his late 80's from the Midwest, got his award from that area this past year.
50 yrs of service.
Reading the rule book, I came across the verbiage describing the situation.
When I asked him about this, He quickly gave me his thoughts nothing more.... by comparing this moment to 8 ball off table on the break.
Which he's never seen but it's in the rule book.
Attends all major league events.
CSI event recently, and was just in the Tri city area.
I just think the rule book, needs a change to describe this situation better is all.
Pocketing the nine, or intentionally/mistakenly driving it off table should not be the same.
The ACS rule book doesn't describe this situation.
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WTF. Its CLEARLY stated in the current rules that a ball off the table, ANY BALL, is a foul. What part of that do you not get?? As Bob said only two rules are suspended on a push-out : wrong ball first and no rail after contact. Ball off the table is a FOUL.
 
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Island Drive said:
Not in the BCA HOF....
He's in his late 80's from the Midwest, got his award from that area this past year.
50 yrs of service.
Reading the rule book, I came across the verbiage describing the situation.
When I asked him about this, He quickly gave me his thoughts nothing more.... by comparing this moment to 8 ball off table on the break.
Which he's never seen but it's in the rule book.
Attends all major league events.
CSI event recently, and was just in the Tri city area.
I just think the rule book, needs a change to describe this situation better is all.
Pocketing the nine, or intentionally/mistakenly driving it off table should not be the same.
The ACS rule book doesn't describe this situation.
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A one minute google search led me to the ACS rule book. The rule is the world standard rule. The situation is what people are telling you in this thread. Driving the 9 off the table is a foul in the described situation. Pocketing it is not. The rulebook covers it clearly. The rule book is not the problem.
 
Island Drive said:
After the break.... the only ball that spots during a roll out situation is the 9.
If the shooter says ''roll out'' & intentionally hits the 9 off table, would his opponent get ball in hand?
Rules say No.
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Knocking a ball of a table is a foul, when doing a push out you must make a legal stroke so would be ball in hand. Not ALL rules are suspended when calling a roll out. For example, you can't move the ball with your hand, or the butt of the cue, you must execute a legal hit.
 
Thx guys, I thought it was wrong.
I knew it was a foul, but Rule 3.3 section (g) says any ball off table is a foul except the 8 ball, which is respotted, and incoming player has two options.
So thinking or not :) that the winning ball off table.... had options.
Accepting table as is, or BIH behind the headstring.
I was obviously wrong, his quick response made me think this might be true.
So I tossed it out there for discussion. :)
 
Island Drive said:
Thx guys, I thought it was wrong.
I knew it was a foul, but Rule 3.3 section (g) says any ball off table is a foul except the 8 ball, which is respotted, and incoming player has two options.
So thinking or not :) that the winning ball off table.... had options.
Accepting table as is, or BIH behind the headstring.
I was obviously wrong, his quick response made me think this might be true.
So I tossed it out there for discussion. :)
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WTF. This whole shitshow started with a 'NINE BALL' pushout but now you're talking about 8ball. What rules are u looking at btw? WPA rule 3.3 has nothing to do here.
 
garczar said:
WTF. This whole shitshow started with a 'NINE BALL' pushout but now you're talking about 8ball. What rules are u looking at btw? WPA rule 3.3 has nothing to do here.
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Yeah, but Tom mentioned 8 ball off table comparing it to 9 ball off table, and my mind gave me an un Zar moment is all. But can you foul on a push out, I'd think so if you pocketed the cue ball. But that's an interesting situation, rolling out/in to a pocket, I think that would be BIH. I've never seen someone intentionally roll out in that manner.
 
you could shoot it in as trying to get it close or maybe in the jaws.

so then its is ball in hand if under those rules, or the opponent could give it back to you as ball in hand.
 
garczar said:
WTF. This whole shitshow started with a 'NINE BALL' pushout but now you're talking about 8ball. What rules are u looking at btw? WPA rule 3.3 has nothing to do here.
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