Billy Thorpe conceded with 7 balls left.

KRJ · Mar 11, 2017

j_zippel said:
I've seen dozens of pros show poor etiquette, far worse than this. Joey could have missed, but I'd say the point of him raking them was that he didn't deserve to win the match, missing that out.

If only you folks were on a live stream more often, might see who the hypocrites are around here

What does live stream matter, they don't even think about that. I've never given anyone more than one ball in a match, ever. And it would have to be a gimme, cb off the rail, and ob not near a rail

I've give some folks up to 3 or 4 balls in practice games just cause they are so damn slow, I'd just prefer to start a new game then watch them take 5 minutes to shoot in the last 3 balls.

But hill/hill is beyond stupid. Plus, why take victory away from the guy running out, it's like striking out the last better in a tense baseball game. Very anti climatic just to say, never mind, don't throw the ball, you win. ???

He'll learn, and he'll never do that again.

j_zippel · Mar 11, 2017

ChicagoRJ said:
What does live stream matter, they don't even think about that. I've never given anyone more than one ball in a match, ever. And it would have to be a gimme, cb off the rail, and ob not near a rail

I've give some folks up to 3 or 4 balls in practice games just cause they are so damn slow, I'd just prefer to start a new game then watch them take 5 minutes to shoot in the last 3 balls.

But hill/hill is beyond stupid. Plus, why take victory away from the guy running out, it's like striking out the last better in a tense baseball game. Very anti climatic just to say, never mind, don't throw the ball, you win. ???

He'll learn, and he'll never do that again.

Imagine if the batter was like "stop, no need to pitch the last strike, I'll give it to ya". Haha

I'm saying live stream matters so the harsh critics can be the ones being critiqued for once. There are a lot of people out there that say they would do this or wouldn't do that but I find it hard to believe.

I've only given the last ball, usually after a great shot to get position. Raking 7 is crazy but if that's what he wants to do so be it. He's a young buck with high expectations for himself, shit happens.

Cornerman · Mar 11, 2017

I've seen top players from across the country concede more than one ball on the final game. I find it hard to believe that some of you seem to suggest that this is a somehow something other than a "meh" moment.

Should Billy have let Joey shoot some balls in first? Sure. Is it a big deal? I don't think it is at all on the last game.

If it were some other game, then that's a different story.

Freddie

poolf4natic · Mar 11, 2017

JC said:
Kind of a silly proud statement there.

Joey was in a position to win by "getting lucky" prior to the rake wasn't he? Didn't see him whining that he didn't deserve it. Probably didn't even cross his mind.

There is no "level of pool" where easy layouts can't be screwed up or easy shots missed. Billy proved that moments earlier. And this has been proven so many times in the history of pool that it's really not up for debate. Joey was probably going to run out. Or was he? We'll never know.

JC

Point taken. You're absolutely right, 'easy' shots and layouts can be screwed up by anyone and yes it happens all the time. 110% in agreement.

And yes people will take rolls and not 'whine' about them, of course!

My basic point is he did something which isn't very rational BUT I feel like I understand on some level.

Clearly he didn't want to watch the match play out the 99% certain runout hoping, praying, dare-I-say begging for a flub. I certainly don't when I screw up the money ball, and that happens a whole bunch (true story) so I have had a lot of chances to change my MO. I can only imagine how much worse it would be if I was any better, although I'd never ever rake a whole rack in competition. To your point though, I guess I worded my previous post poorly as I just as certainly would jump at the opportunity to get back at the table.

If that makes me 'silly proud' then guilty as charged

gregcantrall · Mar 11, 2017

ChicagoRJ said:
Nobody should concede 7 balls, nobody. This was not a fuggin valley for heavens sake. Plus, if he doesn't miss, it's gonna take all of 60 seconds anyways.... shit, start packing your shit up, and by the time you are ready to break down your cue it's over

Packing your shit is a concession same as unscrewing.

Nine ... corner · Mar 11, 2017

StrokeofLuck said:
Did you watch the stream? There was no "bad roll', he missed the match 8 ball after getting just a little funny on his second to the last ball before the 8. He tried a risky position play and left himself a makeable but tough 8 for the match. I would say Thorpe's chance of getting out with the 3 balls he had left was about 95-99%, probably the same of Joey running out his open table after the miss. I understand the frustration but not smart to concede, IMO He messed up, Joey could've too.

My point exactly ... just take out the bad roll part.

jay helfert · Mar 11, 2017

I'm more concerned with his mindset that he gets this frustrated after making a mistake. That's not a good sign because ALL good players make mistakes from time to time. It's how you handle it that defines you.

Nine ... corner · Mar 11, 2017

jay helfert said:
I'm more concerned with his mindset that he gets this frustrated after making a mistake. That's not a good sign because ALL good players make mistakes from time to time. It's how you handle it that defines you.

Excellent post Jay. Many posts that try and justify/understand/excuse the move are missing the point. He needs to learn how to control his emotions in pool and probably other parts of his life.

book collector · Mar 11, 2017

ERIC MOREMAN said:
billy is the best pool and the best player in the world. From ohio

i am eric robert moreman i play pool at kings of billiards in akron ohio one day a week just fridays.

I'm coming up there soon and check out your poolroom bud, sounds like a nice place to play, have fun.
I just got Moby back on the road , need some tires and I'm rollin.

JAM · Mar 11, 2017

j_zippel said:
I've seen dozens of pros show poor etiquette, far worse than this. Joey could have missed, but I'd say the point of him raking them was that he didn't deserve to win the match, missing that out.

If only you folks were on a live stream more often, might see who the hypocrites are around here

Me personally, I work on a computer just about 24/7, and I much prefer to see pool in person, up front and close, and not on my computer monitor or TV screen.

With that said, I've seen hundreds of poor etiquette in my lifetime, to include breaking cue sticks.

I agree with others on this thread that raking that many balls, even if one is frustrated, is not good. Yes, it happens, but it's not good. I think that is what most people are saying on this thread.

Back in the old days, the opponent would rake the balls, giving the other player the benefit of the doubt, showing a little respect, not making him run the remaining balls on the table. That's considered a foul today in most events, but it happened quite often back in the day.

Here's one with Keith giving Earl a freebie on the 9-ball, but I've seen him do it with 3 or more balls in this match. I just don't have time to find it, but here's one. --> https://youtu.be/TQWG8huaHo8?t=148

jojopiff · Mar 11, 2017

Nine ... corner said:
Excellent post Jay. Many posts that try and justify/understand/excuse the move are missing the point. He needs to learn how to control his emotions in pool and probably other parts of his life.

I can't speak for others but my point is assumimg that he has emotional problems in other parts of his life because he made one poor decision is very much over the top, and quite frankly, a very classless post on your part.

JAM · Mar 11, 2017

Nine ... corner said:
Excellent post Jay. Many posts that try and justify/understand/excuse the move are missing the point. He needs to learn how to control his emotions in pool and probably other parts of his life.

I agree with you and Jay both.

I remember watching Jayson Shaw's debut at the U.S. Open 9-Ball Tournament on the TV table with Shane a few years back. He displayed a little anger from time to time while the match was in progress, but I think he has definitely seasoned since that time to be the beast of a player he is today. I remember thinking at that time at the Open, though, that this guy could be such a good player if he kept his temper in check. Looks like he found a happy medium because he's now on fire in the pool world.

jojopiff · Mar 11, 2017

There was a 10 ball tourney in which rules were call all 10balls & SVB didn't and was called on that and quit his match. I don't see a line of people talking about his emotional problems & how he's immature.

Again, I say let's let one mistake be just that, one mistake.

j_zippel · Mar 11, 2017

JAM said:
Me personally, I work on a computer just about 24/7, and I much prefer to see pool in person, up front and close, and not on my computer monitor or TV screen.

With that said, I've seen hundreds of poor etiquette in my lifetime, to include breaking cue sticks.

I agree with others on this thread that raking that many balls, even if one is frustrated, is not good. Yes, it happens, but it's not good. I think that is what most people are saying on this thread.

Back in the old days, the opponent would rake the balls, giving the other player the benefit of the doubt, showing a little respect, not making him run the remaining balls on the table. That's considered a foul today in most events, but it happened quite often back in the day.

Here's one with Keith giving Earl a freebie on the 9-ball, but I've seen him do it with 3 or more balls in this match. I just don't have time to find it, but here's one. --> https://youtu.be/TQWG8huaHo8?t=148

I agree Jam, And I can only imagine what you've seen happen over the years.

When the best players played each other back in the day (in my area) would rake balls all the time playing 8 ball the excuse was made that they didn't want to let the other guy use the open table as a way to loosen up. I always viewed it as being arrogant. I think this whole thing with Billy is being magnified a but and I'm sure he'll learn from this as time goes on.

Get_A_Grip · Mar 11, 2017

jay helfert said:
I'm more concerned with his mindset that he gets this frustrated after making a mistake. That's not a good sign because ALL good players make mistakes from time to time. It's how you handle it that defines you.

That's what I was thinking too. But what drives most of these top pros is their ego. If you think about it, they really do need to have a big ego to expect to win these tournaments, playing against the best.

Especially on a barbox, they have to expect that to win that they don't make many mistakes at all -- and that a single mistake or missed ball could cost them the match.

In this match, other than dry breaks if one player didn't run out, the other did. So on hill-hill, I can see where mentally Billy's thought was that if he didn't get out -- he lost. Because that was so ingrained in his mind, as soon as he missed that 8-ball -- that was it -- he lost in his mind and so he gave up the match.

Nine ... corner · Mar 11, 2017

jojopiff said:
I can't speak for others but my point is assumimg that he has emotional problems in other parts of his life because he made one poor decision is very much over the top, and quite frankly, a very classless post on your part.

I said 'probably' which would not be too much of a leap in logic if his reaction to missing a shot caused a loss of emotional control that other more important life events might result in the same loss of control. Quite frankly, I think your attack is classless as it indicates your lack of ability to process points of view that differ from your own. The whole point of a forum is to promote different points of view, not attack people who put forth a different perspective than your own.

j_zippel · Mar 11, 2017

..............

pt109 · Mar 11, 2017

onepocketron said:
Shit happens when you are frustrated. Who can say they have always made the correct decision, and have never made a bad one when they were a little upset. NONE is my guess.

It was his entry fee, and his game. If he wanted to concede after the first rack that is his business. I saw Ronnie O. concede a snooker match, not just a game but the entire match, to Hendry early on. I really don't see the horror of it all.

Ronnie O'Sullivan's fine for that concession exceeded first prize in many tournaments over here...
...and rightfully so.

Any time there is added money, paid admission, calcutta, etc.....
...a player has no right to concede ANY ball.....
...when you're gambling and betting your own money...then you can do what you want.

Tobermory · Mar 11, 2017

Get_A-Grip (Post #55) is dead on correct. Both players knew that in that rack to miss was to lose.

poolnut7879 · Mar 11, 2017

pt109 said:
Ronnie O'Sullivan's fine for that concession exceeded first prize in many tournaments over here...
...and rightfully so.

Any time there is added money, paid admission, calcutta, etc.....
...a player has no right to concede ANY ball.....
...when you're gambling and betting your own money...then you can do what you want.

A person can do whatever that want to do provided that they understand the consequences. If the player concedes a rack knowing that there is a one game penalty that is their decision. If a player concedes a rack knowing that it costs them the match that is their decision. If a player concedes a rack and they get barred from the tournament that is their decision. If a player concedes a rack and gets kicked out of the tournament and was bought in the calcutta, well buyer beware. Know who you're putting your money on. The buyer in the calcutta assumes inherent risk.

Now do I agree with all this. No, but we are dealing with humans, not robots.

Billy Thorpe conceded with 7 balls left.

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