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Patrick Johnson
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06-06-2020, 11:07 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
I know the system and you donít.
Yet you seem unable to answer a simple question about it.

Quote:
Youíre firing blanks.
One of us is.

pj
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Dan White
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06-06-2020, 11:08 AM

[QUOTE=stan shuffett;6668319]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan White View Post
I don't know why, but I just don't get it. Maybe you can repeat what Stan said in your own words? The question is this: Given that the ball throws different amounts when hit soft vs hard, how do you pocket a ball center pocket each time using CTE without making any adjustments?[/QUOTE



I’m going to try to clarify.

This is known. The 15 I yields a slight overcut to center pocket.

Let’s assume the shot is the match winning 9 ball. How would a pro execute the shot?

He would not slow roll it, but if he did he’d likely make it. He has an overcut to begin with. A nicely struck finesse with a little top can produce a clean entry into the pocket. So, that shot involved two positives and a negative. The overcut and the top are friendly to the shot. The off-speed hit is a negative for a few reasons: throw, skid and stroke quality.


A pro would hit the shot in one of three ways.

1. Low outside with speed offers 3 positives and then the overcut is built in.

2. Straight center axis draw with speed. That offers two positives along with the overcut.

3. A great option for a pro is stun with a touch of inside. Line up to center as usual and swivel the cue by a tick or two for a smidgen of inside. Since the overcut is built in the player must be careful with the inside. The amount of inside is so minute that a bystander would not notice it being applied.

So, the CTE player learns to exercise various options when faced with a given shot...center cue ball and others options that consists of various positives as well as negatives.

Hope this helps.

Stan Shuffett
What I like about this post is that you are acknowledging that throw is variable (categorized into pluses and minuses) and has to be factored into the shot. I think you are saying that CTE starts you off with an overcut and that a firm, vertical axis shot with follow will send it center pocket and if you use other "positives" to minimize throw it will also go pretty close to center pocket, correct?

So can we now revisit your video on hard vs soft hits? Soft or even just medium hits are necessary and are not just aberrations that can be minimized as "well, a pro wouldn't hit it that way." When you hit soft the ball throws more and so you need to use a little outside or tweak the aim or something IF you want the ball to go center pocket or if you want to even pocket the ball if it is near a rail where there is less room for error. You seem to be saying the opposite in this video. Is it an oversight when you said hitting soft vs hard both send the ob to center pocket without any subjective adjustment required from the player?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFrpI-5rKbM&t=6s


Dan White

Last edited by Dan White; 06-06-2020 at 11:15 AM.
  
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06-06-2020, 11:21 AM

[QUOTE=Dan White;6668508]
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post

What I like about this post is that you are acknowledging that throw is variable (categorized into pluses and minuses) and has to be factored into the shot. I think you are saying that CTE starts you off with an overcut and that a firm, vertical axis shot with follow will send it center pocket and if you use other "positives" to minimize throw it will also go pretty close to center pocket, correct?

So can we now revisit your video on hard vs soft hits? Soft or even just medium hits are necessary and are not just aberrations that can be minimized as "well, a pro wouldn't hit it that way." When you hit soft the ball throws more and so you need to use a little outside or tweak the aim or something IF you want the ball to go center pocket or if you want to even pocket the ball if it is near a rail where there is less room for error. You seem to be saying the opposite in this video. Is it an oversight when you said hitting soft vs hard both send the ob to center pocket without any subjective adjustment required from the player?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFrpI-5rKbM&t=6s

No. Heck no! When I shoot softly I do not HAVE to tweak for anything for 15s 30s and 45s and about the same for the 60s.
There’s no need to add outside for a soft cut. Now I may do so for positional purposes.
And I promise you there’s no need to tweak my aim.
You’re problem is...you’re giving way too much credit to throw as a negative force.

I can demonstrate what I teach all day long.

Stan Shuffett
  
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06-06-2020, 11:50 AM

50th page coming right up
  
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06-06-2020, 12:20 PM

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Originally Posted by JoeyInCali View Post
50th page coming right up
Its only page 34 for me ,,,,,
It is truly amazing how much time and effort you guys go through with all the back-and-forth
I’ve said it before to just go on with your lives and let each other be but that never happens
Carry on men
Sorry to interrupt
you all
  
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06-06-2020, 12:30 PM

.................................

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06-06-2020, 04:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
Not like you do it when you adjust by just hitting it a little thinner.

I donít have to think about it, not one little bit.

Stan Shuffett
And neither do ghostball players or contact point or fractional players. We automatically align for a slight overcut. It's called experience. We don't aim to shoot a ball center pocket when throw is involved. We don't line up for center pocket and then tweak our aim to account for throw. Just as with CTE, we simply align to overcut the ball from our psr. At least I do, and most good players I play with. It's that simple. CIT is typically not an issue an experienced player has to think too much about.
  
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06-06-2020, 04:31 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BC21 View Post
And neither do ghostball players or contact point or fractional players. We automatically align for a slight overcut. It's called experience. We don't aim to shoot a ball center pocket when throw is involved. We don't line up for center pocket and then tweak our aim to account for throw. Just as with CTE, we simply align to overcut the ball from our psr. At least I do, and most good players I play with. It's that simple. CIT is typically not an issue an experienced player has to think too much about.
You don’t get it.

Sure experience is involved. Experience is involved in learning about anything.

IN CTE THE SYSTEM LEADS THE PLAYER TO AN ALIGNMENT THAT IS AN OVER-CUT. IT’S A NATURAL ASPECT OF THE SYSTEM. ( There is nothing like that inherent to conventional systems.)

In conventional systems players align and adjust until it feels right. There’s no “ feels right” to it with CTE. Learn the system and the over-cut is a bonus.

Stan Shuffett

Last edited by stan shuffett; 06-06-2020 at 04:54 PM.
  
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06-06-2020, 05:02 PM

[QUOTE=stan shuffett;6668513]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan White View Post


No. Heck no! When I shoot softly I do not HAVE to tweak for anything for 15s 30s and 45s and about the same for the 60s.
Thereís no need to add outside for a soft cut. Now I may do so for positional purposes.
And I promise you thereís no need to tweak my aim.
Youíre problem is...youíre giving way too much credit to throw as a negative force.

I can demonstrate what I teach all day long.

Stan Shuffett
Seems like we are going backward again. OK, if you expect to hit center pocket on soft vs hard shots then why in your throw video does one ball go center pocket and the other ball graze the right facing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFrpI-5rKbM&t=6s


Dan White
  
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06-06-2020, 05:12 PM

[QUOTE=Dan White;6668687]
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post

Seems like we are going backward again. OK, if you expect to hit center pocket on soft vs hard shots then why in your throw video does one ball go center pocket and the other ball graze the right facing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFrpI-5rKbM&t=6s


You’re nitpicking, Dan.

CTE PRO ONE works as described. I am an imperfect human being and don’t always perform visually and/or physically at 100%. Am I not allowed to pocket a ball in an untidy fashion?

This has to be a joke at this point because for you to continue this silly stuff is looney tunes.

I hope that your harassment to me concerning this topic gets reported.

Stan Shuffett
  
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06-06-2020, 05:15 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
You donít get it.

Sure experience is involved. Experience is involved in learning about anything.

IN CTE THE SYSTEM LEADS THE PLAYER TO AN ALIGNMENT THAT IS AN OVER-CUT. ITíS A NATURAL ASPECT OF THE SYSTEM. ( There is nothing like that inherent to conventional systems.)

In conventional systems players align and adjust until it feels right. Thereís no ď feels rightĒ to it with CTE. Learn the system and the over-cut is a bonus.

Stan Shuffett

No. The player doesn't align until it feels right. It's simple. On a straight in shot you align to a center pocket aim. On a left cut you align slightly away from a center pocket aim, a slight overcut. Instead of looking at where the cb needs to be in order to hit center pocket, you look at where needs to be in order to provide a slight overcut. No mystery, and not based on how it feels, but how it looks.
  
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06-06-2020, 05:19 PM

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Originally Posted by BC21 View Post
No. The player doesn't align until it feels right. It's simple. On a straight in shot you align to a center pocket aim. On a left cut you align slightly away from a center pocket aim, a slight overcut. Instead of looking at where the cb needs to be in order to hit center pocket, you look at where needs to be in order to provide a slight overcut. No mystery, and not based on how it feels, but how it looks.
Totally incorrect!

Stan Shuffett

Last edited by stan shuffett; 06-06-2020 at 07:44 PM.
  
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06-06-2020, 05:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BC21 View Post
No. The player doesn't align until it feels right. It's simple. On a straight in shot you align to a center pocket aim. On a left cut you align slightly away from a center pocket aim, a slight overcut. Instead of looking at where the cb needs to be in order to hit center pocket, you look at where needs to be in order to provide a slight overcut. No mystery, and not based on how it feels, but how it looks.

whoops.

Lou Figueroa

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06-06-2020, 05:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stan shuffett View Post
You donít get it.

Sure experience is involved. Experience is involved in learning about anything.

IN CTE THE SYSTEM LEADS THE PLAYER TO AN ALIGNMENT THAT IS AN OVER-CUT. ITíS A NATURAL ASPECT OF THE SYSTEM. ( There is nothing like that inherent to conventional systems.)

In conventional systems players align and adjust until it feels right. Thereís no ď feels rightĒ to it with CTE. Learn the system and the over-cut is a bonus.

Stan Shuffett

er, what happens if that's not the way the player sees it?

What if I just perceive that shot -- any shot -- differently? You seem to be arguing that everyone sees shots on the table *exactly* the same way at an absolute, mathematically, geometrically, 3D way similar way when clearly, this cannot be so due to physical difference from Player A to Player B to Player C.

It's why your system is an epic fail.

Lou Figueroa
  
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06-06-2020, 05:59 PM

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Originally Posted by lfigueroa View Post
er, what happens if that's not the way the player sees it?

What if I just perceive that shot -- any shot -- differently? You seem to be arguing that everyone sees shots on the table *exactly* the same way at an absolute, mathematically, geometrically, 3D way similar way when clearly, this cannot be so due to physical difference from Player A to Player B to Player C.

It's why your system is an epic fail.

Lou Figueroa
You canít explain CTE, so you really donít know what takes place. Youíre firing blanks.

Stan Shuffett
  
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