Rule Differences Between APA & BCA

DolphinNoSharks

New member
Thanks to many replies, I've updated the list with additional rule differences.

Call Shots?
BCA: Yes, call shot (ball and pocket only)
APA: No, slop counts except the 8 ball. 8 ball shots must be marked.

8 on the break
BCA: Rerack or it gets spotted and the breaker keeps shooting...breaker decides
APA: Shooter Win the game.

Scratch while attempting to make the 8 ball
BCA: *Make 8: Lose, *Don't Make 8: Ball in hand for opponent
APA: You lose

Make a ball on the break
BCA: The table is open, you can shoot any ball
APA: You have to shoot the suit you make, (ex: Make Solid, Shoot Solids)

Jump Cues
BCA: Yes
APA: No

Legal Break
APA: If a ball isnt pocketed and four balls (not counting the cue ball) don't touch a rail, its a re-rack. Repeat until there's a legal break or the breaker fouls, at which time the other player breaks. No limit.
break until they make a legal break or scratch on an otherwise non-legal break
BCA: If you don't drive four balls to a rail, it's a foul and the incoming player can shoot or have the balls re-racked and break or have the original breaker break again

Scratch on break
APA: Opponent shoots from the Kitchen
BCA: Ball in hand, anywhere

Ball off the table
APA: spot ball, no foul
BCA: Is a foul and doesn't get spotted (unless it's the 9-ball in 9-ball) (8-ball off table is a loss in 8-ball)

Accidentally move a ball with your hand or stick
APA: MUST be moved back by opponent to the original position. The ball must remain in current position only if moved ball contacts the cue ball, which is a BIH foul.
BCA: opponent has the option to leave it in current position or return it to previous position. The ball must remain in current position if a foul occurs due to it's movement.

Touching an object ball
APA: It is not a foul, however, to accidentally move any other balls (including the 8-ball) unless, during his turn at the table, a player moves a ball and it in turn comes in contact with the cue ball.
BCA: it is not a foul if you accidentally touch or disturb a single stationary object ball with any part of your body, clothing or equipment, unless the disturbed ball has an effect on the outcome of the shot.
* "Effect on the outcome of the shot" means that either the disturbed ball makes contact with any ball set in motion as a result of the shot, or that the base of any ball set in motion as a result of the shot passes through the area originally occupied by the disturbed ball. That area is defined as a circle approximately seven inches in diameter centered on the position originally occupied by the disturbed ball
1) you disturb the cue ball;
2) you disturb more than one object ball
3) a disturbed ball contacts any other ball;
4) you disturb a ball that is in motion.
5) If the game-winning ball is disturbed in conjunction with a violation of (1) through (4) and falls into a pocket, it is loss of game

Call Safe on made ball
APA: No
BCA: Yes, opponent would shoot

Practice During Match
APA: Yes
BCA: It is a foul if you practice at any time during your match, including during time-outs and periods of suspended play

Object ball on floor
APA: It is not a foul unless the shooter fouled in some other fashion. The balls would be immediately spotted unless the shooter also pocketed one of their object balls at the same time. In that case, the ball is NOT spotted until they miss or, if the ball knocked off the table is their suit, until they have shot all of their other object balls and then it is spotted and they continue their turn at the table
BCA: An object ball knocked on the floor is a foul and the ball(s) stay down.

Judge whether the cue ball or an object ball would fit through a gap
APA: The shooter may measure the distance with part of body or equipment. Shooter can also remove a dropped ball and check if ball fits in gap. It would not be a foul if object ball is moved, it must be moved back before shooting.
BCA: Shooter may only use their vision to judge whether the cue ball or an object ball would fit through a gap, or to judge what ball the cue ball would contact first. You may not use any ball, cue, rack, or any other equipment
or other part of your body as a width-measuring device.
 
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buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Not sure about 3 break attempts. I think its 2. If first attempt is an illegal break, same person breaks again. If Second attempt is illegal, then opponent breaks.
If first attempt is illegal break and results in a scratch, opponent breaks.
 

Donny Lutz

Ferrule Cat
Silver Member
rules

I've created a list of the rule differences that I know. Please verify them. Please add anything I've missed.

Call Shots?
BCA: Yes, call shot (ball and pocket only)
APA: No, slop counts except the 8 ball. 8 ball shots must be marked.

8 on the break
BCA: Re-rack or it gets spotted and the breaker keeps shooting...breaker decides
APA: Shooter wins the game.

Scratch while attempting to make the 8 ball
BCA: *Make 8: Lose, *Don't Make 8: Ball in hand for opponent
APA: You lose

Make a ball on the break
BCA: The table is open, you can shoot any ball
APA: You have to shoot the suit you make, (ex: Make Solid, Shoot Solids)

Jump Cues
BCA: Yes
APA: No

Legal Break
APA: you have 3 tries to make a legal break (at least four balls other than the cue ball driven to the rail)
BCA: if you don't drive four balls to a rail, it's a foul and the incoming player can shoot or have the balls reracked and break or have the original breaker break again

Ball off the table
APA: spot ball, no foul
BCA: Is a foul and doesn't get spotted (unless it's the 9-ball in 9-ball) (8-ball off table is a loss in 8-ball)

Accidentally move a ball with your hand or stick
APA: MUST be moved back by opponent to the original position
BCA: opponent has the option to leave it in current position or return it to previous posiiton

One can see the actual rules by visiting the websites of APA, BCAPL, VNEA, ACS, TAP or any of the other many league systems...
 

Luxury

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Bca is now ball in hand anywhere on the table after fouling on the break. I'm guessing APA is in the kitchen.
 

nobcitypool

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
APA is clearly geared towards leveling the playing field and attracting beginners and recreational players. The rules reflect that. All I ever ask of the rules is they're clear and the same for all participants. APA rules meet that criterion. If one doesn't like the rules, they simply shouldn't play.

In my area, the BCA and NAPA leagues are an hour drive from me. I prefer their rules and handicapping systems but I'm not driving that far to play when APA is 15 minutes away. If the frustration with their rules reaches a point that it exceeds the enjoyment I gain, I'll quietly walk away.
 

the chicken

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hey! Thanks for putting this comparison together. Excellent! It will help our local league members who sometimes get the two versions of the rules confused.

Shoot safe.

John
 

BryanB

Huge Balls
Silver Member
APA is definitely ruled to help beginner players. APA does offer a Masters division where there are no handicaps and jump cues are allowed. Unfortunately, slop still counts. Masters is a race to 7
 

gxman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Thanks for the comparison! Seems like whenever I play someone new at the pool hall, I'm always asked, BCA or APA rules. I have no clue which rule applies and just say open after the break, and BIH after fouls.
 

wrickyb

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Also on the No Jump Cue do not confuse that with no jumping. In the APA you can jump with your shooting cue and a correct jump stoke no scooping. But the Rule says No Jump Cue or Specialty Cue Such As a Break Cue.
 

Celophanewrap

Call me Grace
Silver Member
In the APA:
I think the 3 break rule montioned (or the 2 break ruke) is a local rule. Unless it has changed since last summer the number of break attempts is unlimited.
Scratching on the break - To be clear, you opponent (in 8 ball) shoots from the kitchen, in 9 ball it's BIH anywhere on the table.
Some things have changed since last summer though. I know that as of last summer and up through the winter session use of the magic rack was forbidden in APA play. Currently though that rule has changed. As it was explained to me recently, if both players (not teams) agree to it's use (though both don't have to use it) the magic rack can be used in weekly play. It can be used through out the session playoffs, but for some reason is not to used beyond weekly play, for instance not at LTC or regional singles competition or further
 
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KMRUNOUT

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Would have been shorter to do this:

APA: rules for kids
BCA: rules for players

Definitely would have been shorter, but much less accurate. There are some fine players in the APA, and there are some downright terrible players in the BCA, and vice versa. I have played APA for almost 20 years. The rules are fine. It is not extremely common that matches are determined by the rules of either. Most of the emphasis in APA is on finishing the match in a timely fashion. Thus many of the rules are specifically geared towards this idea. I really doesn't take much imagination to take a dump on the APA, or really any league system, or heck why not some silly tournament formats, heck I think slop counts in the WPC no?

I played an 8 ball match with a very good bar table player named Jeff Sargent on a bar table in Vegas recently. It was an absolute dogfight of a match, and came down to the bitter end. I ran out from a great bank at hill hill for the win. Jeff and I had some friendly words after, and both remarked what a great match. I thoroughly enjoyed the match, and would have if I had lost. We both just played awesome, and really tried hard to the end. I can't speak for Jeff, but I'm fairly certain he isn't a kid. I'm not either. I won $1000 for that match alone. Without APA I would not have had that experience. I could name a bunch more. To be fair, this is APA singles at the national level, but I think the people that believe the rules determine the outcome of matches probably shouldn't play league, or do really anything competitive.

While I *personally* prefer some of the rules of BCA, I have no real issue with APA rules. In fact, I like the familiarity and simplicity of the rules. Also, I strongly prefer match play to rack play, which is a major reason I like APA better.

How long have you played APA? I am assuming you have based on your familiarity with the rules and knowledge of exactly how those rules play out in an actually competitive context.

Point is, you are welcome to your opinions and any way you wish to express them here. It's just that saying APA rules are for kids just sounds...well...like something a kid would say.

I had a few good "It would have been shorter to just say..." comments ready, but I realized that this would not be a very friendly approach.

In any case good luck playing with the "players".

KMRUNOUT
 

KMRUNOUT

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
APA is definitely ruled to help beginner players. APA does offer a Masters division where there are no handicaps and jump cues are allowed. Unfortunately, slop still counts. Masters is a race to 7

Masters is extremely fun. My only experience of it is the national tournament. But man that is one fun tourney.

In that race to 7 against a well know national champ, he missed at 2-2 and I ran the set out on him. The last shot was a jump combo on the 1-9 in 9 ball. I was a mile from the 1 (as close to a mile as I could get on a bar box), and had an off angle on the 9 into the corner. Well I made the jump, rattled the 9, and disgustingly *crapped* it into the other corner pocket for the win and a nice 4 pack. But *really*, I only won because of shit luck... I mean I stunk that ball in for sure. So running out a nice 4 pack was irrelevant to the victory. It was the luck ;-) Hey wait a sec...that was the 9 ball part so it would have counted in BCA rules too! Ok I guess it was a good win then.

But seriously, masters is fun.

KMRUNOUT
 

Tony_in_MD

You want some of this?
Silver Member
In BCA 9 ball in the Baltimore area they play call pocket in 9 ball for all shots.

Not sure if this is just a local thing.

Masters is extremely fun. My only experience of it is the national tournament. But man that is one fun tourney.

In that race to 7 against a well know national champ, he missed at 2-2 and I ran the set out on him. The last shot was a jump combo on the 1-9 in 9 ball. I was a mile from the 1 (as close to a mile as I could get on a bar box), and had an off angle on the 9 into the corner. Well I made the jump, rattled the 9, and disgustingly *crapped* it into the other corner pocket for the win and a nice 4 pack. But *really*, I only won because of shit luck... I mean I stunk that ball in for sure. So running out a nice 4 pack was irrelevant to the victory. It was the luck ;-) Hey wait a sec...that was the 9 ball part so it would have counted in BCA rules too! Ok I guess it was a good win then.

But seriously, masters is fun.

KMRUNOUT
 

justadub

Rattling corners nightly
Silver Member
In the APA:
I think the 3 break rule montioned (or the 2 break ruke) is a local rule. Unless it has changed since last summer the number of break attempts is unlimited.
Scratching on the break - To be clear, you opponent (in 8 ball) shoots from the kitchen, in 9 ball it's BIH anywhere on the table.
Some things have changed since last summer though. I know that as of last summer and up through the winter session use of the magic rack was forbidden in APA play. Currently though that rule has changed. As it was explained to me recently, if both players (not teams) agree to it's use (though both don't have to use it) the magic rack can be used in weekly play. It can be used through out the session playoffs, but for some reason is not to used beyond weekly play, for instance not at LTC or regional singles competition or further

Re number of breaks, I believe you are correct. If a ball isnt pocketed and four balls (not counting the cue ball) don't touch a rail, its a re rack. Repeat until four balls do hit a rail, or the breaker scratches, then the other player breaks. No limit.
 

Jeff Rosen

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I play in the MegaBucks Pool League in the NYC metropolitan area. (I'm also in an APA league and a 14.1 league) As far as I know MegaBucks is part of the BCA, at least their website says they are BCA sanctioned, whatever that means. But their rules are different. All ball fouls (which I hate as I am clumsy), must sit while opponent is shooting, no talking except to say "you're on two",and call shot call safety in 10 Ball. Also vests in playoffs. The matches are race to 11 in 9 and 10 ball and race to nine in 9 ball. When a high skill level plays a low SL player (such as me, I'm a 3) besides games on the wire, the handicaps have balls off the table in 8 ball, and 8 and out and 9 and out in 10 Ball.
My main problem with APA is not enough table time. I spend more time keeping score and eating than playing. Some guys I play with wanted me on their APA 8-Ball team at Amsterdam in Manhattan. Living on Long Island I'd have to take the Long Is Rail Road and subway for an hour and a half each way for a race to two??? I don't think so!!! I don't mind the rules although I would love a pushout. I do like APA 9-Ball as I love straight pool and in a way the scoring reminds me of straight pool, even though the game is much different of course.
In my MegaBucks and straight pool league you show up, practice for an hour, then have a match for an hour and a half and go home. A lot more table time than APA.
 
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sbpoolleague

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Marking the Pocket

All I know is that if I ever found myself playing in an APA league, and I quickly knocked in a duck 8-ball that was hanging in a pocket without first marking the pocket, and my opponent jumped up and down in glee claiming he won the game because I didn't put a stupid token near the pocket, I'd shoot him. If I had a gun. Which I don't.
 
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