1 Stroke Practice: Aiming While "Up". No grinding!

[David Beck]

I don't know what unknownpro means by it, but I "aim my tip" by simply knowing where it's pointed in relation to the OB contact point.

Your tip is never aimed directly at the OB contact point even when you're hitting centerball on the CB (except for dead straight shots), so it doesn't really matter whether you're using sidespin or not. Just know where your tip is pointed ("that much to the side of the OB contact point") on each shot and your subconscious will collect a "picture library" of tip/contact point alignments for you that will eventually match all the shots that come up.

It's like the picture library of CB/OB overlaps that your mind collects, except it's more accurate because you're relating two "points" (tip and OB contact point) rather than two "discs" (CB and OB overlap).

pj
chgo

This is what I assumed Unknownpro was talking about. This is very good information. I use both the CB/OB overlap and the tip line in relation to contact point just to gather as much data as I can about each shot. It does give you a more accurate line of aim, but it will also force you to pay more attention to english and deflection.

 

[JoeyInCali]

Aiming with your mind's eye, not some geometrical system?
Impossible.
Next thing I'm gonna read is you can actually imagine the cueball path and stroke through that line.
Or imagine the cueball pass through the object ball and pocket balls better?

 

[ribdoner]

Aiming with your mind's eye, not some geometrical system?
Impossible.
Next thing I'm gonna read is you can actually imagine the cueball path and stroke through that line.
Or imagine the cueball pass through the object ball and pocket balls better?

IMAGINE...:smile:

 

[Fatboy]

+++++++++++great Post+++++++++++++

EXCELLENT thread....thanks for the new suggestions,I'll give the technique a go tomorrow.

I found my game went up,just from consciencely "stepping in" with alignment in mind.Something else I read here fwiw.

This new drill may help me hone that even farther.Very cool stuff.

SORRY THIS POST IS NOT ON TOPIC FOR THIS THREAD BUT ITS STILL GOOD>

"Stepping in" and keeping your eye on the ball is perhaps the most important fundemnetal in pool, Archer is a close friend we rarely talk pool or play(i dont mention him much here either), but one night we were banging the balls around and talking pool and he said "Keeping my eye on the spot I want on the OB and stepping into the shot is why I'm the best-because I dont lose that spot, never take your eye off it" (how strong is that!!) , He showed me a super tough shots to test my ability to do this(the only time he has ever showed me anything about playing) he made the shot 5/6 times and I made it the other 1 out of 6 times or less-it was a tough shot, LOL it was super hard but clearly showed me what he told me(in a very clear way)-I knew this before, but to hear it come from him, out of nowhere, (he never teaches me, only that nite and almost never play) it was cool and i want to share that nite with everyone here.

I hope ALOT of people see this-SORRY THIS WAS NOT PART OF THE THEAD- BUT WHEN JA TALKS WE LISTEN :thumbup:


I want to add, that was one of the very few times I ever heard him say "I'm the best" or anything like that, he wasnt bragging he was showing me something, he knew I knew it, he was just reenforcing it for me and himself(i'm sure) when he referanced himself as "The best" in all the years I know him 22 (wow were getting old) I have only heard him say something like that maybe 2 other times. He dosent joke about it, or brag-nothing. This is a rare thing for me to say this, I will add he called me today and I said "hey man I say your #1 again on the points thing" He said "yeah I saw that on AZ today, anyways whats up Big E???" We didnt talk about pool for the next 45 minutes except that he was very happy with how he played this week, he only said "yeah I felt pretty good about my game and played good this week" then not one word more about pool, 4th in the US Open??? Come'on?? how happy would the other 9,245,645 players feel taking 4th??. Amazing man, father, friend and player.


I just want to add this, as a after thought, if you can get out there and support him and Earl on their tour , this post isnt a undercover advertizment, i just added this now; bfdlad here on AZ is the promoter and its a school and is $200 for hours of instruction, i think i have the price right, ask him i dont know for sure, I know JA likes doing it and Earl does too,

 

[JoeyInCali]

I hope ALOT of people see this-SORRY THIS WAS NOT PART OF THE THEAD- BUT WHEN JA TALKS WE LISTEN :thumbup:


,

Great post Eric.
I watched Johnny in the early and mid 90's when he and Efren were just trading trophies.
He shot differently then imo.
He used to approach the table with head down already. Like he was swimming to the shot.
Now he looks like he's more upright going in to the shot then bends and sets up and shoots.

 

[Fatboy]

Great post Eric.
I watched Johnny in the early and mid 90's when he and Efren were just trading trophies.
He shot differently then imo.
He used to approach the table with head down already. Like he was swimming to the shot.
Now he looks like he's more upright going in to the shot then bends and sets up and shoots.

i noticed that too, he used to take his cue and set it about 2" behind the OB line it up, leave his tip on the cloth and walk behind the CB, see the spot on the OB from behind the CB then move his cue away THEN step into the shot, thats what he did that night we were banging them around, I dont see him doing that as often nowdays-I wouldnt mention that to him though. I have mentioned ther lint and he dosent pick it as often, but who am I to tell him anything about pool??? I rack for him. LOL.

 

[JB Cases]

Great post Eric.
I watched Johnny in the early and mid 90's when he and Efren were just trading trophies.
He shot differently then imo.
He used to approach the table with head down already. Like he was swimming to the shot.
Now he looks like he's more upright going in to the shot then bends and sets up and shoots.

I love the visual, swimming to the shot. I wonder if players start second guessing themselves as they get older?

 

[JimS]

Second guess or evolve using new methods as they grow.

The correct placement of the back foot and the subsequent stepping into the shot, then the precise placement of the bridge hand would be the foundation for the shot it seems.

I've also found JoeW's "Quiet Eye" to be a major component to making the shot. Taking just an extra second or three to let the eyes focus on the shot, while standing, makes a big difference for me.

 

[Fatboy]

I love the visual, swimming to the shot. I wonder if players start second guessing themselves as they get older?

speaking for JA and ALL the other pro's I know, have known, talked to or listened to, there is one consistant thing they NEVER EVER second guess anything, which may explaine why they are pros(among other reasons) the only thing I have seen aging pro's do is complain about their eyesight, which as we all know is normal-sux, but a fact of life. So they succomb to aging but other than that they never second guess themselfs, they are all bubbling over with confidence-rightfully so.

 

[scottjen26]

Eric, Thanks for the post on Johnny. I've been working on trying to get that 2% or 3% better to step up to the next level, and trying a bunch of things in the process. One thing I tried was really focusing on the spot on the OB when stepping into the shot, actually just focusing more on the OB in general. I tend to be more CB focused, hard to let go of that after years of playing a certain way. I always likened it more to golf, I watch the putter contact the ball, not the hole the ball is going into. If I'm lined up right, and hit the ball square and where intended (either CB or golf ball), the shot will go in. But lately been working more on setup and pre shot routine, and the OB focus does help, although I always feel like I'm going to foul the CB by not watching it as intently... On certain shots the OB focus even helps eliminates any last minute steering that may occur.

Anyway, thanks for sharing, sometimes we try things and are not sure if it's the right thing, to hear a top player reaffirm something like that is very helpful.

BTW, just watched the Derby ring game you were in from earlier this year I think, would have liked to see you play some but man you didn't get a lot of chances to shoot at anything to get going. Those ring games can be brutal, especially with that crowd...

Thanks again!
Scott

 

[unknownpro]

That makes sense Patrick. It seems sort of simple after he/she says that so few do it.

The tip doesn't play a role in my aim. I just put it where I want for the action I need and then aim the cb to the ob.

I'm glad the one-stroke practice is helping. I always practice that way now. I use one stroke instead of none because I try not to pause in my stroke. If you have a pause, then I'd try using no stroke practice some of the time.

When I'm aiming I am trying to get as far removed from pocketing the object ball as possible so that thought never enters my mind during the stroke. The object ball contact point is a step removed but is not a good aiming reference, simply because you can almost never aim at it with the cueball or the cuestick. The object ball contact point is the biggest shark in pool.

The center of the ghostball is the real aiming reference first removed from pocketing the object ball. Anybody who can focus on delivering the cueball through the ghostball position without looking at the object ball contact point should play better once they get used to it. Without focusing on the object ball contact point you don't tend to try and steer the object ball, instead keeping your mind on the cueball's speed and direction.

But your weapon is your pool stick. And if you use wide side english, especially with no top or bottom (arguably the most powerful weapon on the pool table) you will find you need to aim your tip for a significant squerve getting you well off the line from the cueball to the center of the ghostball. There will be a lot of squirt and very littler curve.

With such a wide variance depending on english I want to know my cue line before I get down -otherwise you must twist and adjust. To know your cue line you must guess or know how much squirve you will get. Since it's possible to get just about any amount you want you must decide your best bet option and commit fully to the speed and aim required.

The key is knowing how to do this. I feel like the most consistently obtainable squirt is often larger than most people are comfortable using so they wind up aiming too close to the contact point and letting curve bail them out. Then when they put a good stroke on the ball they blame squirt for their miss instead of the lack of curve.

With the cueline being one more step removed from pocketing the object ball, concentrating only on the cue line and speed you tend not to steer the object ball or the cueball. This greatly reduces the fear factor because you no longer are even trying to control the cueball, only the stick which is much easier and almost never scratches.

 

[unknownpro]

I've been trying to figure out exactly what that means.. aiming with the cue tip. How do I aim w/the cue tip when shooting w/low left.. for instance?

Aim along the top right edge of your tip at the bottom left edge of the ghostball is generally how I do it.

 

[JimS]

Aim along the top right edge of your tip at the bottom left edge of the ghostball is generally how I do it.

Hmmm. I get the picture.

I've never used the tip to aim with... only the center of the cb to the center of the gb. When using english I'd move the gb to reflect the squirt movement of the cb. I.e. if the cb is going to squirt right, and I'm shooting firm enough to have little or no swerve, I'd move the gb a commenserate amount to the left of the usual gb position for that shot. Never occurred to me to use any part of the tip as an aiming tool.

Another something new to try :thumbup:

Thanks, Jim.... likes new stuff to try as that must mean that I"m getting closer to the "secret".

 

[PKM]

Something I've wondered about - if you should aim before you are down on the shot, what is the advantage to keeping your head low? I've often heard that it makes it easier to aim for longer shots.

Incidentally I tend to keep my head fairly low, but maybe it is just more natural in terms of the mechanics of most peoples' stroke? (For example, you can then bring your hand closer to your chest)

 

[grindz]

I love the visual, swimming to the shot. I wonder if players start second guessing themselves as they get older?

I would think that everyone second guesses themselves more, but the pros
probably replace that thought with re-evaluate. Two similar thoughts a world apart.

I also feel that perhaps a part of Johnny's renewed success has to do with his teaching with Earl and having to re-explore his own game from the ground up in order to be able to teach it effectively. Teaching can be a great way to bring your own game up. JMNSHO

Great thread and helpful advice from the posters. I may just have to finally get rid of my own known bad habit of aiming while down. I know/knew, have been noticing how bad it had become....but this thread let me know it is no longer acceptable and it's time for a change.

It's always something........................:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

td

 

[dgem]

Thank you unknownpro. I tried this method and it is the nuts. It helped me to go dead stroke at a faster rate. I even apply back hand english with this method and it works better i think.

 

[enlightphoto]

Yeozza!! Man, Am I glad to have found this thread, and what timing as well. I'd read this on Wed. and was thinking, I should give this a try. That same afternoon, I snapped my back - old back injury - while riding my bike. So that night, thoroughly filled with pain meds and muscle relaxants, I head out to my table. I took a lot of extra time standing over the shot and checking the line with my foot and cue hand at my hip. The back pain was a good reason to go down on the shot very slow and deliberate. I wouldn't take any warm up strokes, but rather just take the shot I had envisioned. I only made minor adjustments in where I wanted the cue tip to contact the cb, a minor pivot if needed to ensure my 'feel' was good, and shot. The end results have been really impressive. Despite being in pain, my shotmaking has gone up a fairly decent percentage.

File under FWIW...

 

[enlightphoto]

SORRY THIS POST IS NOT ON TOPIC FOR THIS THREAD BUT ITS STILL GOOD>

He showed me a super tough shots to test my ability to do this(the only time he has ever showed me anything about playing) he made the shot 5/6 times and I made it the other 1 out of 6 times or less-it was a tough shot, LOL it was super hard

That was a great post, but I'm dyin' to know, what was the super tough shot? Any chance you could draw it out for us?

 

[terhje]

Unknownpro = Bert Kinister?

he talks about the onestroke in mightyX and the center
tip aim inn another(cant remember).

 

[pdcue]

Second guess or evolve using new methods as they grow.

The correct placement of the back foot and the subsequent stepping into the shot, then the precise placement of the bridge hand would be the foundation for the shot it seems.

I've also found JoeW's "Quiet Eye" to be a major component to making the shot. Taking just an extra second or three to let the eyes focus on the shot, while standing, makes a big difference for me.

JimS

Starting from the orig post and expanding somewhat - let me say
'welcome to phase one'

I couldn't agree more with the idea of aiming while you are up.

IMHO - you can't do more to improve your overall game than to add the concept of ' play position while you are up'

If you visualize the CB path and final destination before you zero in on
pocketing the OB - you have already decided which of the many possible
combinations of spin/speed/stroke you need to use. That will determine where you need to contact the OB.

The one stroke limit can be helpful for practice, esp for those who
are tempted to think and think while down in the stance.
But I feel the broader concept of determining everything yoiu are going to do before you ever bend over will improve your game more than any other single concept.

Once you bend down, there should be no thought about ANYTHING other
than where you hit the OB - if you pocket the ball - the CB will go wher it is supposed to.

I would recomend drills for pocketing - drills for position play - drills for
any aspect you can think of. That way you can sharpen the skills you
need to be able to know all you need to before getting down.

For playing the game, make one total decision, then execute.

It's improoved my game more than I could have ever immangined.

Dale