10' Tables Future Of Pro Pool??

vjmehra

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When there is no money in a sport at the highest levels, you have to try something different. Pool rooms can keep their 9 foot tables, but bring in 1 ten footer for those up for the challenge. Snooker is very popular in England with much higher prize money because it's harder . Mosconi said that playing on the smaller 9 foot tables took away the excellence of the game. The top golfers don't play from the lady's tees. Prize money hasn't increased much since the 1970's. Lets find out who the best is now.

From a practical point of view, would a 9 foot Chinese table make sense (if people want something different) as it would fit into the same space as a conventional 9-footer, but plays harder because of the rounded pockets?
 

Geosnooker

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
From a practical point of view, would a 9 foot Chinese table make sense (if people want something different) as it would fit into the same space as a conventional 9-footer, but plays harder because of the rounded pockets?

Chinese 8 ball is now the world’s most played billiard game and second only to Snooker in viewer audience and Organization. Here in Canada it now has a foothold in Chinese communities.

Much of the popularity is the air time it gets on Chinese Television and the promotion from Joy billiard table. It will be interesting to see if it gets any foothold in countries like Brazil and Indonesia. It’s attracted some big names from the Snooker world by offering big tournament prizes and picking up expenses and offering endorsements to Snooker players.
 

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Almost 10yr old thread and 10ft'rs are still not "taking over pool". Never gonna happen. A few niche events but not mainstream. Too big, expensive, and in a poolroom would cost most owners $$. I don't see Chi.8b ever being big in the States either. Too tough, too slow. Recreational players(the ones that pay the bills) would try this game and walk away due to the difficulty and the pace.
 

vjmehra

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Chinese 8 ball is now the world’s most played billiard game and second only to Snooker in viewer audience and Organization. Here in Canada it now has a foothold in Chinese communities.

Much of the popularity is the air time it gets on Chinese Television and the promotion from Joy billiard table. It will be interesting to see if it gets any foothold in countries like Brazil and Indonesia. It’s attracted some big names from the Snooker world by offering big tournament prizes and picking up expenses and offering endorsements to Snooker players.

That's interesting, I think there's a couple of clubs with Chinese tables here in the UK too, but not sure.

It will be interesting to see if it really takes off, I'm not convinced it makes sense for 9-Ball, but for 8-Ball (obviously) and possibly 14.1 it could be interesting.

That said, watching some of the clips on You tube, the pro's actually run out in 9-Ball far more often than I would have imagined, albeit they are exhibition matches.
 

Bavafongoul

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If you aren’t in attendance or watching it live, then highlights are the best.
Imagine if ESPN offered a weekly 1/2 hour show centered about just pool.

Tune in Wed.. Nights at 9 pm to watch Pool Central, the latest & greatest
news in billiards covering amateur & pro tournaments and equipment news.
The outdoor channel does this with guns so why not pool? It would be cool.
 

u12armresl

One Pocket back cutter
Silver Member
I was looking for a 5x10 table forever. Great one hole tables. Don't really enjoy any other games on it. My problems with 9ft'rs are magnified on 10ft's and don't show up as much on 6 and 7ft'rs.

LOL it's letting me use 'rs without auto correcting it.

Ten foot pool tables are not much harder than nine footers. Any notion otherwise in my opinion is a myth. The long shots are a little. longer but there is less traffic.

There is basically zero interest in 5x10 tables in pool halls and for sure home tables. I have one that was installed in my basement for 20 years. I tried 2 times and couldn't even sell it for $250 LOL. It sits in my crawl space broken down. A 5x10 snooker table sits in it's place and that *is* harder due to the rounded pockets. I doubt it will make me a better pool player because it honestly changes my shot selection. But I bought it to play snooker so it doesn't matter to me.

As it may be a while before pool halls open again, pleasing myself is all that matters!
 

u12armresl

One Pocket back cutter
Silver Member
Someone the other day was looking for a bridge on a Valley.
I mentioned that back in the day you couldn't use a bridge or jump cue, and the thing that changed the most was cueball sizes and weights.

He said that pool players have to be able to reach shots and we talked about it for a few minutes.

10fts are discriminatory to short folks
So in my opinion the bar table is king;)

#shorttrackmatters
 

u12armresl

One Pocket back cutter
Silver Member
I love and play darts, soft tip and steel if you can find them.

If you aren't in the UK, the amount of darts you can play is incredibly limited. Also, the money is rubbish. I placed top 3 in a big tournament and the money was awful, but the trophy will be forever.

There is a whole new group of younger darters who look very promising, but steel just isn't prevalent in the US, not sure about Canada.

I've said somewhere else already but American pool needs to adopt the the pro darts atmosphere. Pool is not snooker and the notion that it will ever aspire to be is a fool's errand.

I'd hazard to say that a Wimbledon atmosphere back in the all white era would have never lasted in the USA as well. There's a reason the USopen is more akin to a Nascar crowd in pro tennis.

All a 10ft table would do is create less clutter after the break. Any top player worth their salt already aims for a portion of the pocket on the 9ft.

You want money and/or interest in American Pool. Tell the Nascar fans they can bring in their foam fingers, and beer holding hard hats. Let them cheer for their favourites... The Mosconi Cup is the only time everyone wants to see every ball hit.
 

straightline

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I learned and developed basic shotmaking with pool balls on 10' snooker tables so pool on a 10' pool table seems somewhat of a joke. Getting hooked for instance is retarded stoopid. Other advantages include the dimensions allowing more shots without the rails jacking you up; not to mention the pockets (pool tight or wutt) are buckets.

That's interesting, I think there's a couple of clubs with Chinese tables here in the UK too, but not sure.

It will be interesting to see if it really takes off, I'm not convinced it makes sense for 9-Ball, but for 8-Ball (obviously) and possibly 14.1 it could be interesting.

That said, watching some of the clips on You tube, the pro's actually run out in 9-Ball far more often than I would have imagined, albeit they are exhibition matches.

The glaring issue with the Cino tables is those dumb snooker pockets. They render most of the pool game impossible and leave players jockeying for dead outs. I think jawless / throatless 3.5" pockets would solve this by allowing all the pool at maximum tightness.
 

Justaneng

Registered
American billiards is a bit quirky because there’s no differentiation between the pro game and those who just play for fun. We approach the sport as if the end goal for everyone is to win some non existent greater world championship.

What percent of viewers play NFL rules football.....001 of 1%? MLB baseball? About the same? Likely most participants are playing slowpitch with shorter infield on a school diamond.

The two most viewed sports in the world are Soccer and Cricket. Neither have large adult participation. The most viewed billiards Sport is Snooker...again, what percent of the 80 million world viewers actually play?

Anyways, American billiards is stuck in rut at the pro level. It isn’t going anywhere without a major shake up. That’s fine as has No impact on me playing at the local pool hall or Legion with 9 foot tables and 4.75 inch basketball hoops.

Until American pro pool differentiates itself from the bar game, it’s not going anywhere. Millions aren’t going to watch the best baseball players playing Slowpitch or best football players playing no tackle flag football. Most pro sports have added elements of skill that make it an extra challenge. 10 foot tables? 4” pockets?...something is needed make it ‘special’.

American pool lacks a centralized lobby to fight for it.

Case in point:

(1) We've just had a 4 month break in live sports, and the major sports networks flailing to show whatever new content they could - down to broadcasting video games and Korean baseball.

(2) Every pool hall in the country was a big empty building, and pool is among the easiest sports to socially distance (lag on 2 different tables and measure if you want to take that step, otherwise neither player really needs to be within 15 ft. of each other). Next to no staff is required, and you can pull off a well produced event without anyone close to each other. This should be 100x easier (and faster) to pull off than any other sport that has worked to come back.

(3) Alternatively, there's a ton of commented pool content already out there …. and NOBODY thought to start pitching it to networks when there was a gigantic entertainment window in the US to step through. Seriously, there was no live (or previously unseen) competition out there - during the one time in our lives all 300 million+ Americans were simultaneously bored.

(4) The last time pool was widely shown (I remember it from the 90's - ESPN2 era I believe), it suffered from the belief that common among all broadcasters at the time that they need to pander to the least knowledgeable viewer, this lead to a lot of "that's a great shot (with no explanation given)" type comments. . From other sports, (whether Tony Romo in football, the various metric-derived analysis from the other sports, etc...) it is now clear that if you go into proper level of details, the less knowledgeable viewers appreciate it more than they appreciate being pandered to - and this ends up creating its own subculture centered around the details. Getting into more details on the announcing side may help close the perception that run-out pool is "boring" to watch.
 

RiverCity

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
American pool lacks a centralized lobby to fight for it.

Case in point:

(1) We've just had a 4 month break in live sports, and the major sports networks flailing to show whatever new content they could - down to broadcasting video games and Korean baseball.

(2) Every pool hall in the country was a big empty building, and pool is among the easiest sports to socially distance (lag on 2 different tables and measure if you want to take that step, otherwise neither player really needs to be within 15 ft. of each other). Next to no staff is required, and you can pull off a well produced event without anyone close to each other. This should be 100x easier (and faster) to pull off than any other sport that has worked to come back.

(3) Alternatively, there's a ton of commented pool content already out there …. and NOBODY thought to start pitching it to networks when there was a gigantic entertainment window in the US to step through. Seriously, there was no live (or previously unseen) competition out there - during the one time in our lives all 300 million+ Americans were simultaneously bored.

(4) The last time pool was widely shown (I remember it from the 90's - ESPN2 era I believe), it suffered from the belief that common among all broadcasters at the time that they need to pander to the least knowledgeable viewer, this lead to a lot of "that's a great shot (with no explanation given)" type comments. . From other sports, (whether Tony Romo in football, the various metric-derived analysis from the other sports, etc...) it is now clear that if you go into proper level of details, the less knowledgeable viewers appreciate it more than they appreciate being pandered to - and this ends up creating its own subculture centered around the details. Getting into more details on the announcing side may help close the perception that run-out pool is "boring" to watch.

 

The_JV

Local_Pro
If you aren't in the UK, the amount of darts you can play is incredibly limited. Also, the money is rubbish. I placed top 3 in a big tournament and the money was awful, but the trophy will be forever.

There is a whole new group of younger darters who look very promising, but steel just isn't prevalent in the US, not sure about Canada.

I'm not a dart player, so take my comments about the game with a grain of salt. That said, based solely on the televised UK tournaments I've stumbled across, there seems to be a market for it, which means advertising dollars.

That's really all it boils down to, is advertising income.

I equate American Pool to darts because both games are rooted in our bar/tavern culture. ....and easily the most entertaining tournament of the calendar year for the USA is the Mosconi Cup. Which has an atmosphere closer to pro darts, then snooker. It's also the only time you're likely to see an pool "arena" seating at full capacity.

The simple truth is, the game is boring to the uninitiated. Much like golf or tennis... Those that don't actively embrace the game and who's exposure amounts to swinging at balls while pounding back a few beers with the boys, can't grasp why SVB calls for a time extension so he can measure out a kick with his fingers for the 4th time.

In terms of increasing the popularity of the game. Making the table bigger does nothing. Making the table more difficult by cutting the pockets harder does nothing. However imo, the best part about the old pool videos are the few moments wherein the players interacted with the spectators. Unfortunately we have it in our heads that the game requires snooker level intensity and decorum.
 
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