9 ball rules back in the day

[KoolKat9Lives]

2 shot shoot out was the cornerstone of the 'free shot'. The great players that could cut the hair off a ball (Rempe) would roll out a 70 degree lengthwise up/down table 5 rail cut and make it almost every time. Roll out made you a better player quicker and made you more aware of table speed and the free shot.

I learned to play in 1975 in the Philly area. If someone came up to you that you didn't know, we'd simply confirm the game by saying "Push-out, 2 misses BIH." That's all we needed to say. As dabarbr mentioned, if you pushed, & your opponent took it, he had to make a good hit or it was BIH.

IMO, WITHOUT QUESTION, it made for more of a shotmakers game than TX Express. You either learned the long cut and other tough shots, or you learned to hate your money! And it paid to know your opponent's strengths and weakness, far more so than Tx Ex. Exploiting weaknesses was huge strategy.

 

[Underclocked]

When did the jump shot become an allowable shot? I've never liked to see players using the jump shot.

It should also be illegal. :smile:

 

[KoolKat9Lives]

When did the jump shot become an allowable shot? I've never liked to see players using the jump shot.

It should also be illegal. :smile:

Earl started jumping with his playing cue sometime (I think) in the mid to late 80's. How it evolved into shortened jump cues, I dunno. Jay and surely many other old timers know. J/K!

 

[jay helfert]

Earl started jumping with his playing cue sometime (I think) in the mid to late 80's. How it evolved into shortened jump cues, I dunno. Jay and surely many other old timers know. J/K!

Earl jumped a ball on ESPN in the Caesars Tahoe finals against Mizerak in 1983. He made the shot and got position. That started the whole thing. Within a couple of years Sammy Jones was jumping full balls from half an inch (and less) away using a shaft! That's when the jump cues started becoming popular. It started out a novelty and evolved into a lethal weapon.

 

[jay helfert]

I learned to play in 1975 in the Philly area. If someone came up to you that you didn't know, we'd simply confirm the game by saying "Push-out, 2 misses BIH." That's all we needed to say. As dabarbr mentioned, if you pushed, & your opponent took it, he had to make a good hit or it was BIH.

IMO, WITHOUT QUESTION, it made for more of a shotmakers game than TX Express. You either learned the long cut and other tough shots, or you learned to hate your money! And it paid to know your opponent's strengths and weakness, far more so than Tx Ex. Exploiting weaknesses was huge strategy.

We used to say, "Push out, two fouls in a row by the same player is BIH." It was assumed that everything spotted up back then. It was either that or "Try to hit the ball", where if a player missed the object ball you could make him shoot again. I would play either way if I felt like I had a good game.

 

[Underclocked]

The jump shot has always been a lethal weapon (to the tables). I can't remember ever going into a pool room as a young man and not seeing that "No Jump Shots" sign on the walls. It wasn't unknown, it simply wasn't done out of respect for the equipment.

If I had a pool room today, those signs would get posted.

 

[jay helfert]

The jump shot has always been a lethal weapon (to the tables). I can't remember ever going into a pool room as a young man and not seeing that "No Jump Shots" sign on the walls. It wasn't unknown, it simply wasn't done out of respect for the equipment.

If I had a pool room today, those signs would get posted.

This may refer to an era when players would jump balls by "scooping" the cue ball. A good way to rip or tear the cloth and it should be banned.

 

[oldzilla]

Earl started jumping with his playing cue sometime (I think) in the mid to late 80's. How it evolved into shortened jump cues, I dunno. Jay and surely many other old timers know. J/K!

not sayin it was me me me but,
heck, way before earl showed the world how to jump in the 80's, back in the late 60's early 70's i realized i could pop the cueball over the edge of an object ball.
i kept in a secret to use as my advantage ! but people watch and learn and tecniques developed soon after. i had a simple trick shot jumping through the 2 balls set up with not enough room for a ball to go between. to me it was elementary but back then it amazed those that did not realize that you could get tha cueball airborn.
and those tavern turkeys who couldn't hit a rail with bih decided that the scoop shot was a great way to jump. many many times i tried to explained to those kind of half in the bag idiots that was not a legal shot and it ussually got ugly. knowitalls are always right somehow !

 

[Pushout]

I wish a lot of members on AZ would try and get the old "Push Out" 9-ball game played with a few players in their poolroom. Who knows, it might catch on all over the country. Johnnyt

I taught some of my son's friends to play this way years ago and they agreed it was a better game but they didn't stick with it. This is not a game the lesser player will win as often as in the way the game is played currently.

 

[Pushout]

Here in the Roanoke valley they play rings games with a stupid version of roll out rules, you must make an "honest effort" to hit the lowest numbered ball. This makes for a game where if you can't get out you kick at a 100 mph and hope for the best.

Dick,
This is how ring games were played where I played also, which is probably the reason I was never much of a ring game player. There a few guys who played their best in such games and made out pretty well.

 

[randyg]

When did the jump shot become an allowable shot? I've never liked to see players using the jump shot.

It should also be illegal. :smile:

I have a Billiard book published in 1852 that describes the jump shot. It's been around since pool begain.....SPF=randyg

 

[hippiepool]

This may refer to an era when players would jump balls by "scooping" the cue ball. A good way to rip or tear the cloth and it should be banned.

That's why you used to see " no masse' shots " signs ...

 

[jay helfert]

not sayin it was me me me but,
heck, way before earl showed the world how to jump in the 80's, back in the late 60's early 70's i realized i could pop the cueball over the edge of an object ball.
i kept in a secret to use as my advantage ! but people watch and learn and tecniques developed soon after. i had a simple trick shot jumping through the 2 balls set up with not enough room for a ball to go between. to me it was elementary but back then it amazed those that did not realize that you could get tha cueball airborn.
and those tavern turkeys who couldn't hit a rail with bih decided that the scoop shot was a great way to jump. many many times i tried to explained to those kind of half in the bag idiots that was not a legal shot and it ussually got ugly. knowitalls are always right somehow !

It was a common shot to elevate your cue and jump over the edge of a ball. Every decent player had that shot in his arsenal, even in the 60's. But no one was jumping full balls, especially up close and with their playing cue. Earl was the first I saw do this accurately. He began to revolutionize pool in that way.

 

[JB Cases]

I am currently in Oklahoma City and am days away from being 42. I learned to play pool at Johnny's Game Room, Tiger's Pool Room in Edmond and Jamacia Joes in Midwest City. At Jamaica Joe's I learned to jump in 1987 using a full cue. A few years later I saw that Joss was offering a short handle Joss jump cue. Meucci was too and Huebler had something called a Break Jump Cue.

I grew up playing two foul nine ball and it was always ball in hand after the second foul by anyone. The pushout was just a deliberate foul and the incoming player had to choose to take the shot OR give it back and the whoever shot next HAD to make a legal hit.

So the good players could KILL the weaker players by pushing to tough shots, banks, kicks, and yes, even jump shots. There was a lot more strategy involved and sometimes a game could go a while before it finished. The idea was to trap your opponent into taking shots that were beyond their skill level. Pushing was a very creative endeavor.

I will give you an example of how a person from the 2-foul rollout(pushout) era trapped a well known and established champion (once) with his knowledge of pushout strategy.

In the mid 90s we (Instroke) sponsored a tournament in Germany. In the finals or semi-finals it was Rafael Martinez against Ralf Souquet. Ralf Souquet grew up on the World Rules which were like Texas Express one foul ball in hand - pushout after the break. Rafael was a veteran of the 2-foul rules.

In the first game Rafael pushes out to a kick shot where the object ball is close to the rail. It's a fairly standard kick-stop where the cue ball stays there and the object ball goes toward the side pocket and if it misses then it goes down table leaving lots of distance.

Ralf looks puzzled that Rafael pushed to a kick and immediately gives the table back. Rafael kicks the one in the side and runs out the next four racks.

Years later I asked Ralf about that and if he knew at the time that Rafael had pushed to a kick shot on purpose. Ralf said he didn't know it until he saw what Rafael did and then he knew right away that he shouldn't have given the shot back.

The old days were more fun because people did have to come with shots. If you chose to take the shot then you had to be prepared to make it. I mean you could duck and that was part of the game but you definitely had to be able to run out when you got a shot. It was a different game for a different time.

Texas Express brought a new way of playing the game. I think that players are better now overall but they are also luckier. Luck and rolls play a much bigger factor under the current rules than they did under the old rules.

Thus people have to learn to kick, masse, and jump to a much higher level now to combat those rolls and luck.

 

[dabarbr]

We used to say, "Push out, two fouls in a row by the same player is BIH." It was assumed that everything spotted up back then. It was either that or "Try to hit the ball", where if a player missed the object ball you could make him shoot again. I would play either way if I felt like I had a good game.

Sorry to say Jay but it was played mainly "any two fouls" and not necessarily by the same person.

"Try to hit the ball" was for cheap games. Too many funny things could happen in that game. One would be that if you were hooked you would kick and make sure you didn't hit it so that now you may shoot again and not being hooked you might be able to try something even if it was difficult. Safety play also presented a lot of problems if there was no penalty.

 

[Biggz]

Refresh my memory.

Back in the day, 1960s, we played 9 ball where you could push out at any time. What were the rules?

As I remember if you committed a foul (failed to contact the lowest numbered ball and a cushion) the incoming player could make you shoot again or take the shot himself (like a push out). If you committed two consecutive fouls the incoming player had ball in hand.

After a scratch the incoming player shot from behind the head string and the lowest numbered ball was spotted if in the kitchen.

All balls made on the break were spotted if the breaker scratched.

I think balls made on a scratch stayed down unless it was the ball before the money ball. We often played the 5-7-9 or 3-6-9 were money balls.

These rules applied in both heads up games and ring games.

I think it paid double for a 9 nine on the break or a run out from the break.

This was central Jersey in the mid to late 1960s and as most pool games, rules are regional.

What am I forgetting?

I kinda like this rule better than today.

 

[Mikjary]

Usually if you scratched on the eight ball it was spotted. You shot from the kitchen and you had to shape the nine to get out. If somebody gave or got weight, the ball before the money (say 6,7,8 as a spot) also got spotted. No gimmes. In today's games you don't have to win. The opposition just has to scratch on the eight.

 

[randyg]

Usually if you scratched on the eight ball it was spotted. You shot from the kitchen and you had to shape the nine to get out. If somebody gave or got weight, the ball before the money (say 6,7,8 as a spot) also got spotted. No gimmes. In today's games you don't have to win. The opposition just has to scratch on the eight.

Rules say you still have to shoot the 9-Ball. BIH or not you still win the game....SPF=randyg