ABP Failing to Make Friends

[truefan]

Someone needs to teach these guys to play nice. CSI sounds really pissed off. See: http://www.azbilliards.com/2000storya.php?storynum=10480

 

[JCIN]

Someone needs to teach these guys to play nice. CSI sounds really pissed off. See: http://www.azbilliards.com/2000storya.php?storynum=10480

I don't understand. Is it CSI's fault the ABP is using the name of its event without permission ? There were attempts to clear this up quietly but they went by the wayside. The whole thing is classic Charlie passive/aggressive bullshit.

He pulls a move, someone calls on him on it and then instead of addressing his initial action he pulls the "We all need to work together for the greater good of the game." Its been the same story for a long time. I dont expect much is going to change besides more people beginning to publicly call out the BS moves when they happen.

Edit to add: I misread your post. I see you meant the ABP was pissing people off. My bad. I stand by the statements made above though. SSDD for the most part.

 

[itsfroze]

Someone needs to teach these guys to play nice. CSI sounds really pissed off. See: http://www.azbilliards.com/2000storya.php?storynum=10480

I wouldn't say CSI sounds pissed off, I would say that they sound disappointed and irritated that they have to come out with their own
press release to set the record straight. I would be to if somebody like (CW) came along and tried to piggy-back on to events that I started and promoted, without my approval, for their own benefit. Especially if it
was somebody I didn't like, like CW. Why would I want to be associated
with his under handed type of dealings in any way?

There is another thread that someone started about CW. In that thread someone asks can you forgive CW's? Someone else goes on to say when
he was young he stepped on a lot of peoples toes and who knows if he was just young back then when all that transpired maybe a lot more people would feel forgiving now.

But he didn't just do things in an underhanded manner then, he has continued to do things in this fashion right up to this day. To do with pool and apparently in other parts of his life as well from what I read by a certain woman in the other thread, and that's not the only inappropriate type of behavior that I've read about concerning him and a woman.

As far as the original poster goes, you seem almost gleeful that CSI
was unhappy with CW actions and really up on things for having only
44 posts, just saying. Curious which side of this issue you stand on?

My feelings on CW, I don't care for him, or the way he does business.

 

[itsfroze]

Here's what CSI said in their signed Press Release!
So you don't have to go looking for it:

Cue Sports International
CSI Responds to ABP Press Release and Supports BCA

CueSports International, Henderson, Nevada (September 28, 2012) – CueSports International (CSI), the organization which owns and produces the US Open 10-Ball Championship, wishes to correct erroneous information that was presented in a recent press release. On September 19, 2012, the Association of Billiard Professionals (ABP) distributed a press release that proclaimed their ranking list. There was an attachment to this release that listed the 3 events that were used for these calculations; Hopkins Player’s Championship, the US Open 10-Ball, and Turning Stone.

By sending out this information, the ABP suggested that all 3 events have sanctioned or recognized the ABP. That is NOT TRUE. The only event that actually recognized the ABP was the first event. This type of release misleads and confuses the players and the fans.

In a statement distributed to the mainstream billiard media on January 17, 2012 entitled “CSI Supports BCA as Governing Body for Cue Sports in North America” CSI clearly recognized and continues to support the Billiard Congress of America (BCA) as the Governing Body of Billiards in North America. The BCA point system is the only recognized system in North America used for inviting players to compete in WPA sanctioned World Championship events.

One of the responsibilities of a governing body is to insure that events do not conflict with previously scheduled events – particularly world events. The ABP has shown that they will schedule events that conflict with previously scheduled WPA world events. That is unacceptable, when the goal is to get North American players to participate in world events.

The US Open 10-Ball Championship will be held at the Rio All Suite Hotel & Casino (July 19-23, 2013) in Las Vegas. It will be a Billiard Congress of America (BCA) Point Event. It has been scheduled and will be played using the BCA guidelines. There is a very high probability that the US Open 8-Ball (held immediately after the US Open 10-Ball) will also be a BCA Point event. The 14th US Open One Pocket is also scheduled; that will make 3 US Open events with $60,000 in added money. All these events are played alongside the 37th Annual BCAPL National Championships – “The Greatest Pool Tournament in the World”.

It is unfortunate that we have to take this action, but CSI must clarify that neither the tournament nor CSI are affiliated with the ABP. CSI does not recognize, endorse or sanction with the ABP as an official player ranking organization in the United States. CSI has never agreed to promote an ABP sanctioned event. CSI has requested that ABP send out a corrective press release, however with the way that several websites have reported the ABP press release as accurate, we felt compelled to set the record straight.

CueSports International is dedicated to creating more choices for all players. In the past 8 years CSI has directly paid out $8,000,000 to players. CSI is the parent company of the BCA Pool League and the USA Pool League. CSI also produces independent events such as the US Bar Table Championships, the Jay Swanson Memorial, the US Open One Pocket Championship, the US Open 8-Ball Championship and the US Open 10-Ball Championship. Visit www.playcsipool.com, www.playbca.com, and www.playusapool.com for more information about CSI and its divisions.
By CSI - 2012-10-02

 

[itsfroze]

DP news just posted 5 threads on page one main forum, so as long as you're here maybe you can answer this. Why do you think it's ok to list tournaments that you have nothing to do with as if you are affiliated with them in some way? You most likely will not answer, as that is your typical MO, just thought I'd ask.

 

[fast&loose designs]

Sounds like more unnecessary conflicts. The pool & billiard industry will continue to look like a circus to onlookers with this kind of ridiculousness.

It's important for me to note that I have no affiliation with either organization. However, this seems to me like a small, insignificant, and unintentional mistake by the ABP that has been blown out of proportion by CSI. Nobody cares, and the mistake has no real impact on the sport, players, or fans, as they claim. The press release by CSI sounds like it was written with too much emption and hate for anyone who isn't CSI or BCA.

Let's all get along. Squabbles about nothing blown into such ridiculousness lead to less credibility for our sport, ESPECIALLY when they come from larger organizations.

 

[itsfroze]

Sounds like more unnecessary conflicts. The pool & billiard industry will continue to look like a circus to onlookers with this kind of ridiculousness.

It's important for me to note that I have no affiliation with either organization. However, this seems to me like a small, insignificant, and unintentional mistake by the ABP that has been blown out of proportion by CSI. Nobody cares, and the mistake has no real impact on the sport, players, or fans, as they claim. The press release by CSI sounds like it was written with too much emption and hate for anyone who isn't CSI or BCA.

Let's all get along. Squabbles about nothing blown into such ridiculousness lead to less credibility for our sport, ESPECIALLY when they come from larger organizations.

You're out of touch if you think, either this was unintentional or that it has no real impact, there are plenty of people that care. Apparently you don't or else you would not make a statement such as this, as this type of underhanded practice by CW's is unfortunately is all to common.
More and more people are waking up to this fact. Hear the alarm?

I agree that the pool and billiard industry will continue to look like a circus as long as this continues, most likely the reason CSI is trying to make things straight in this matter. Perhaps you missed the part where CSI says they tried to handle this and straighten it out privately, but they were ignored.

I as you, also have no affiliation with either organization and that is basically, at least to me, what CSI is plainly saying in their press release. They are not affiliated with the ABP.

I just reread the CSI press release and I can't find "the to much emotion and hate" part anywhere in this signed press release. Are you sure you're not reading that into it for some unmentioned reason?
It's plain to me they are just saying this is wrong, do not continue this practice.
It seems CSI is only asking for accuracy and truth, how can you say that this, in your words are "squables about nothing blown into ridiculousness"? Accuracy and truth should be the backbone of any press release, not to mention it should be signed or taken credit for by whom ever produced it. Anything less is ridiculousness and underhanded.

 

[fast&loose designs]

You're out of touch if you think, either this was unintentional or that it has no real impact, there are plenty of people that care. Apparently you don't or else you would not make a statement such as this, as this type of underhanded practice by CW's is unfortunately is all to common.
More and more people are waking up to this fact. Hear the alarm?

I agree that the pool and billiard industry will continue to look like a circus as long as this continues, most likely the reason CSI is trying to make things straight in this matter. Perhaps you missed the part where CSI says they tried to handle this and straighten it out privately, but they were ignored.

I as you, also have no affiliation with either organization and that is basically, at least to me, what CSI is plainly saying in their press release. They are not affiliated with the ABP.

I just reread the CSI press release and I can't find "the to much emotion and hate" part anywhere in this signed press release. Are you sure you're not reading that into it for some unmentioned reason?
It's plain to me they are just saying this is wrong, do not continue this practice.
It seems CSI is only asking for accuracy and truth, how can you say that this, in your words are "squables about nothing blown into ridiculousness"? Accuracy and truth should be the backbone of any press release, not to mention it should be signed or taken credit for by whom ever produced it. Anything less is ridiculousness and underhanded.

What I am saying is that CSI's reaction to a mistake is sound, but not necessary. How does this benefit the sport, or CSI?

It seems AZB has become less of a forum for topics about how to get better at pool, have discussions about events and players, and more about who-screwed-who, who-overcharged-me, who-is-ruining-pool, and who-used-my-event-in-a-press-release. WHO CARES? Do we think less of CSI because ABP misrepresented CSI?

ABP screwed up and made a mess. A mess that no one noticed because it was too small for anyone to care. I'd say, if you took a poll, less than 1% of the pool and billiards population noticed, or cared. But now that CSI has called attention to the matter, many will question ABP's credibility in the industry. Why? Because they released erroneous information? Does anyone bring to light the good that they do for the industry?

It is no doubt our sport has no credibility and the world thinks of us as a bunch of drunks shooting pool and gambling, all the while talking shit about some other pool player. They think of us that way because even at the professional, business level, we do that. Instead of bettering ourselves and our businesses, we attack Joe Shmo for making a mistake.

Get it together, professional billiard companies/cue makers/pool hall owners/promoters. Your unprofessional handling of situations makes the rest of us ALL look like a bunch of drunk ball bangers.

 

[JAM]

Here's the thing about the ABP. They are trying to have a ranking system, but since there's no money in pool, no sponsor wanting to sponsor a real tour, they have to use the tournaments that are currently in existence to get that ranking system.

Now, I understand the tournament promoters being sensitive about the ABP using their events as a ranking vehicle. Mike Zuglan, the Joss Northeast 9-Ball Tour director, was strong-armed by an ABP member at a Turning Stone tournament to seed the players using a ranking system that had nothing to do with the Joss Tour. Mike, as he is wont to do, put his foot down and rightfully so. It was Mike's tour that he kept alive and well for 15 or more years. Why should he kowtow to the ABP?

The ABP should be kowtowing to Mike Zuglan and those like him. That's where the ABP is dropping the ball.

For sure, they need a public relations point man to field the questions about the organization. Johnny Archer and Charlie Williams may not possess the skills needed to do PR. A good public relations back-and-forth with the media and pool public would go a long way for the ABP.

I would like to see a tour for the American male pros. I'm not sure the ABP as it's currently set up is equipped to do it. They can't afford their own tournaments. If they would work with the pool tour promoters and directors out there, offer them something in return, it might help. :smile:

 

[TimKrazyMon]

What I am saying is that CSI's reaction to a mistake is sound, but not necessary. How does this benefit the sport, or CSI?

It seems AZB has become less of a forum for topics about how to get better at pool, have discussions about events and players, and more about who-screwed-who, who-overcharged-me, who-is-ruining-pool, and who-used-my-event-in-a-press-release. WHO CARES? Do we think less of CSI because ABP misrepresented CSI?

ABP screwed up and made a mess. A mess that no one noticed because it was too small for anyone to care. I'd say, if you took a poll, less than 1% of the pool and billiards population noticed, or cared. But now that CSI has called attention to the matter, many will question ABP's credibility in the industry. Why? Because they released erroneous information? Does anyone bring to light the good that they do for the industry?

It is no doubt our sport has no credibility and the world thinks of us as a bunch of drunks shooting pool and gambling, all the while talking shit about some other pool player. They think of us that way because even at the professional, business level, we do that. Instead of bettering ourselves and our businesses, we attack Joe Shmo for making a mistake.

Get it together, professional billiard companies/cue makers/pool hall owners/promoters. Your unprofessional handling of situations makes the rest of us ALL look like a bunch of drunk ball bangers.

If the ABP is involved, rest assured, that was not an accident. Also, the ABP's cred was shot way before this; CW took care of that. This is just the latest example.

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

...For sure, they need a public relations point man to field the questions about the organization. Johnny Archer and Charlie Williams may not possess the skills needed to do PR. A good public relations back-and-forth with the media and pool public would go a long way for the ABP...

That certainly is true, but all the spin in the world isn't going to cut it if they continue with some of the tactics you describe and the organization is used to pursue the personal agendas of a few select individuals.