Aiming Systems • Techniques • ETC

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Just finished 3rd in our elite league playoffs, lost 7-5 in B final because I rattled a ball trying to create an angle. I used Pro One 100% and picked up 2K for my efforts, 5K last season.

Some of the matches were recorded. Was down 6-0 and won 7-6 :)

Pro One works and is a complete shooting system. Results speak - the rest is just noise.

Gerry
 
I really don't know PJ any better than other long-term AZB members know him, but IMO he wouldn't do something like that. I didn't always agree with PJ's "approach" to dealing with people, but he seems like an honest and respectable guy to me.

Catch you later,
Dave


Man, is that some stinky bait Joey threw out there, or what?!

Lou Figueroa
 
Just finished 3rd in our elite league playoffs, lost 7-5 in B final because I rattled a ball trying to create an angle. I used Pro One 100% and picked up 2K for my efforts, 5K last season.

Some of the matches were recorded. Was down 6-0 and won 7-6 :)

Pro One works and is a complete shooting system. Results speak - the rest is just noise.

Gerry

Congratulations Gerry. That's what counts.
 
Just finished 3rd in our elite league playoffs, lost 7-5 in B final because I rattled a ball trying to create an angle. I used Pro One 100% and picked up 2K for my efforts, 5K last season.

Some of the matches were recorded. Was down 6-0 and won 7-6 :)

Pro One works and is a complete shooting system. Results speak - the rest is just noise.

Gerry

Congrats, Gerry !

Great job!

Stan Shuffett
 
John, in the name of all things holy, please stop talking about yourself in the third person. You are scary enough without there being two of you.

Lou Figueroa

Once again you don't know what you are talking about. Roadie didn't insult you, he didn't break any rules, and you don't know who Roadie is. Just because Wilson abused his power and made a claim doesn't mean anything. The fact is Roadie smashed you to bits with patient and 100% factual quotes from your posting history.

You just could not handle the truth when you had no one to insult ad hominem.
 
Confessions of an aiming system addict

I've tried every major aiming system except 90/90, and I did try a simple version of that as well. I had some initial success on some shots with the systems and failed other shots. But after all this experimentation I have not found a system that works better than back of the ball/ghost ball aiming. Admittedly I didn't properly understand how to use CTE/Pro One until a couple of weeks ago (having only purchased the first DVD and apparently not being to smart, I misunderstood how to do it). After this I did try it a bit and the results were pretty much the same as with any other system. I would say that none of the systems worked perfectly for me. The See system did help a bit with some issues I had and was about equal for me to ghost ball aiming in terms of ball pocketing and I still use parts of it for alignment etc, but every system has had some kind of weakness or problem area that I can't work through.

My problem is not with aiming. That's what all this has thought me. I suspect that is the case for many others as well. Unless you can shoot a pool ball in diagonally the length of the table and follow the ball in with the cue ball perfectly with some degree of consistency, you should IMHO not even bother with aiming systems. At the times when I can do this almost every time, my aiming is not a problem at all, I suspect it never is. I recently broke the 100 mark in straight pool, which shows that I at least know a little bit about playing the game, although I may be a hack compared to many on the forum. The main problem for me is with delivery and alignment (mechanics).

For the last six months I have been working on line up drills on the snooker table for a lot of my practice time and it has showed in my game. My alignment and delivery is at a much higher level than before. I wish I had been doing this instead of spending all this time and money on aiming systems which have pretty much been wasted. Aiming systems might all be hoaxes as far as I know. None have worked better than ghost ball for me and other methods of training have proved to be far more effective in elevating my game. Sure, if your stroke is laser straight, but you keep missing balls on strokes which were otherwise well excecuted, then maybe you should work on you aiming. If I am honest I feel that this is the case with maybe 1 or 2 percent of my misses. All the rest are due to sloppiness in the PSR (especially rushing shots) or stroke errors. Be really honest with yourself when you miss a ball: Did you finish with the wrist perfectly aligned? Did you accelerate through the stroke? Was your body perfectly on the shot line? Did you chickenwing ever so slightly? Was your followthrough perfectly straight. Did you in fact hit the cueball at the precise point you attempted? All of these and many other questions like them should be answered well before you even consider spending any time with the act of aiming the ball.
 
I've tried every major aiming system except 90/90, and I did try a simple version of that as well. I had some initial success on some shots with the systems and failed other shots. But after all this experimentation I have not found a system that works better than back of the ball/ghost ball aiming. Admittedly I didn't properly understand how to use CTE/Pro One until a couple of weeks ago (having only purchased the first DVD and apparently not being to smart, I misunderstood how to do it). After this I did try it a bit and the results were pretty much the same as with any other system. I would say that none of the systems worked perfectly for me. The See system did help a bit with some issues I had and was about equal for me to ghost ball aiming in terms of ball pocketing and I still use parts of it for alignment etc, but every system has had some kind of weakness or problem area that I can't work through.

My problem is not with aiming. That's what all this has thought me. I suspect that is the case for many others as well. Unless you can shoot a pool ball in diagonally the length of the table and follow the ball in with the cue ball perfectly with some degree of consistency, you should IMHO not even bother with aiming systems. At the times when I can do this almost every time, my aiming is not a problem at all, I suspect it never is. I recently broke the 100 mark in straight pool, which shows that I at least know a little bit about playing the game, although I may be a hack compared to many on the forum. The main problem for me is with delivery and alignment (mechanics).

For the last six months I have been working on line up drills on the snooker table for a lot of my practice time and it has showed in my game. My alignment and delivery is at a much higher level than before. I wish I had been doing this instead of spending all this time and money on aiming systems which have pretty much been wasted. Aiming systems might all be hoaxes as far as I know. None have worked better than ghost ball for me and other methods of training have proved to be far more effective in elevating my game. Sure, if your stroke is laser straight, but you keep missing balls on strokes which were otherwise well excecuted, then maybe you should work on you aiming. If I am honest I feel that this is the case with maybe 1 or 2 percent of my misses. All the rest are due to sloppiness in the PSR (especially rushing shots) or stroke errors. Be really honest with yourself when you miss a ball: Did you finish with the wrist perfectly aligned? Did you accelerate through the stroke? Was your body perfectly on the shot line? Did you chickenwing ever so slightly? Was your followthrough perfectly straight. Did you in fact hit the cueball at the precise point you attempted? All of these and many other questions like them should be answered well before you even consider spending any time with the act of aiming the ball.

I respect you 1000% more than the Pat Johnsons and the Playapools and all the knockers who can't be bothered to try. At least you tried and have some experience now and have made the decision to focus on another part of your game.

Before I learned any aiming systems I used to set up shots and practice them for hours. One shot I was inconsistent with but still able to improve my make % quite a bit. But in a game I would dog that shot every time. To the point that I started avoiding taking it. I would play safe instead of shoot it or try any other way to avoid getting shape on it if possible.

The day I met Hal he asked me to set up a shot I had trouble with and I immediately set up this one. First try I dogged it and the second try with my brain SCREAMING I was not lined up right I nailed it clean. Third try the same and so on....just nailed it....all the while with my brain telling me I was not lined up right.

This is simply because what I THOUGHT was right for that shot was not right. Back then I had the stroke, I had two VERY strong players working for me, players who would work out with me every day or so. I had a table five feet from my desk.

Hal simply opened my eyes to another level in aiming. Of course not everyone had a problem with aiming and the insidious part is that when you miss you often don't really KNOW if it was because of aiming or mechanical error.

I do agree with you though. It is important to be able to not only make the ball and follow it in from any distance it is important to be able to draw it into the opposite pocket from any distance. I have seen Shane set this shot up and do it over and over - that's the ultimate in mechanics in my opinion.
 
Bowling - Traditional vs. two-handed delivery

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQkJXz4ebq4

So the other day I was watching bowling and saw something I had never seen before in a pro event. Pros using two hands to hold the ball and throw it. In fact I had only seen complete novices trying to bowl by holding the ball with two hands previously in bowling alleys once in a while.

Don't you all think it's really silly to continue to speak out against methods that people want to try?

Just leave people alone to discuss and try the methods they want to try.

http://stevesbowlingblog.blogspot.com/2010/03/argument-against-two-handed-bowling.html Even bowling has debates on methods. :-)
 
I think we have a winner

Eddie Robbins book winning one pocket covers this. The cushion nose to cushion nose of a 1x2 ratio might not have been the best choice. Neither are where the diamonds are placed. The reason is if you follow the center of the ball (the gully line) it does not measure 1x2 like the cushion to cushion measurement does.

Reminds me of this from a Few Good Men

Capt. Ross: But you just said that you didn't make it back to the Windward barracks until 1645.

Downey: Sir?

Capt. Ross: Well, if you didn't make it back to the barracks room until 1645, how could you be in your room at 1620?

Downey: Well, you see, sir, there was a blow out.

Capt. Ross: Private, did you ever actually hear Lieutenant Kendrick order a code red?

Downey: Well, Hal said that...

Capt. Ross: Private, did you ever actually hear Lieutenant Kendrick order a code red?

Downey: No, sir.

Galloway: Please the court, I'd like to request a recess in order to confer with my client.
 
Reminds me of this from a Few Good Men

Capt. Ross: But you just said that you didn't make it back to the Windward barracks until 1645.

Downey: Sir?

Capt. Ross: Well, if you didn't make it back to the barracks room until 1645, how could you be in your room at 1620?

Downey: Well, you see, sir, there was a blow out.

Capt. Ross: Private, did you ever actually hear Lieutenant Kendrick order a code red?

Downey: Well, Hal said that...

Capt. Ross: Private, did you ever actually hear Lieutenant Kendrick order a code red?

Downey: No, sir.

Galloway: Please the court, I'd like to request a recess in order to confer with my client.

The gulleys don't matter because the ball's edges never touch them. The playing field is still 2x1.

Diamonds don't matter in CTE/ProOne, they are never used. You could tape over them and it wouldn't matter.
 
It would seem the only argument the Pro One naysayers have left is now "prove it is mathematically correct". If that's the best they got, clearly the aiming wars are essentially over. You have many high level players staying unequivocally the system works. I know of no professional that has tried the system and says it doesn't work.

Pool isn't about math, it's about pocketing balls. By all accounts, pro one does that extremely well. Stan, I have no idea why you continue to respond to these trolls. You constantly have a month backlog of lessons booked and a bunch of professional and high level players who swear by your system. All the proof that matters is in place.
 
... I recently broke the 100 mark in straight pool, which shows that I at least know a little bit about playing the game, although I may be a hack compared to many on the forum. ...

Congratulations! And I think you are underrating yourself. I would say that the VAST majority of members here, and the vast majority of posters, never have run 100 balls in 14.1 and never will. You used the word "many," and I wonder how many members have done so. In any event, it is a fine accomplishment. May you do it again soon!
 
I'm not the one making a claim. Have you never taken a science or math class? You're asking me to prove Zeus isn't real. He made a claim that it is math-based. Where is the math? That's right, it doesn't exist. As for your other statement that you were once an average player.. sure, so was every pro, too. I was once an average math student, too.

How many years have these claims been made with absolutely no real proof? Better yet, do you think these claims, in particular the geometry one, would hold up in court? The judge wouldn't be asking for proof that they're wrong, he'd be asking if they're correct. Just ask Trudeau.

Bump that post.

No, in court it's innocent before proven guilty. Prove guilty.
 
Like I said results not typical ,,, what do you consider average and what do you consider excellent results ,,

I tried some of his stuff I saw on you tube ,,
personally other than my eyes not what they used to be I never thought aiming was ever one of my problems ,,

1

Going from finishing 8-12 in good local tournaments to finishing 1-4. That's excellent in my opinion, and a big money jump.
 
Like I said results not typical ,,, what do you consider average and what do you consider excellent results ,,

I tried some of his stuff I saw on you tube ,,
personally other than my eyes not what they used to be I never thought aiming was ever one of my problems ,,

1

What are you basing the "not typical" on ?
If you have no problem aiming, why are you here? and yes i know it's a free country you can post where ever you want. I just don't get people continually trying to hold others back from what they want to do.
 
Once again you don't know what you are talking about. Roadie didn't insult you, he didn't break any rules, and you don't know who Roadie is. Just because Wilson abused his power and made a claim doesn't mean anything. The fact is Roadie smashed you to bits with patient and 100% factual quotes from your posting history.

You just could not handle the truth when you had no one to insult ad hominem.


OK, Roadie, er, John. Whatever you say. Roadie got whacked just for being a swell guy.

Lou Figueroa
 
I place a given system between snake oil and money in the bank based on whether it is based on real geometry, physics and logic. For example, the lights and shadows systems get dicey when the light fixtures are changed!

I keep a variety of systems in my pocket for any given student as you don't know which will work best based on their perception and personal visuals and style.
 
Some people.............

I place a given system between snake oil and money in the bank based on whether it is based on real geometry, physics and logic. For example, the lights and shadows systems get dicey when the light fixtures are changed!

I keep a variety of systems in my pocket for any given student as you don't know which will work best based on their perception and personal visuals and style.


That is exactly right! That's my point of the thread. In addition to what you said about perception, personal visuals and style, I might add that some individuals will interpret the same information differently. Add in the physical and emotional differences between each of us and it seems that it is quite apparent why leeway should be given to those who teach things that some think, is incorrect.

I think the naysayers just want to be right and have their day in the sun. Someone should tell them that their day has come and gone and that they should just admit that they didn't know what they were talking about.:bash:

JoeyA
 
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