I just bought a box of elkmaster tips and thought id try my hand at soaking and pressing a couple. Anyone know how this is done as far as what to soak them in and the correct way to press them? Also how do they play after this is done and will they still fray out bad when scuffed like regular elkmasters do? All info will be appreciated. Thanks.
Anyone know how to soak and press an elkmaster?
- Thread starter DJordan816
- Start date
pooldawg8
Why would you even want to try, Just contact Pooldawg8 He has perfected the process. It's very unlikely you will get it right the first time you try. I'm sure anyone can soak and press a tip but to get it right to the point the tip playes like Pooldawg8's tip not very likely you will get it right.
Just contact (pooldawg8) his name is Jeff, He is a great guy but I doubt he will share his secrets on how he does his tips. He sells them for $3.00 each.
Why would you even want to try, Just contact Pooldawg8 He has perfected the process. It's very unlikely you will get it right the first time you try. I'm sure anyone can soak and press a tip but to get it right to the point the tip playes like Pooldawg8's tip not very likely you will get it right.
Just contact (pooldawg8) his name is Jeff, He is a great guy but I doubt he will share his secrets on how he does his tips. He sells them for $3.00 each.
If they wanted you to soak them in milk and press them or microwave them............well .. they would have already done it and would be selling them in that state if that made them better.
When you get done, you will still have a soft elk master that has been soaked in milk and pressed.
Why don't you just buy a real tip???
Kim
When you get done, you will still have a soft elk master that has been soaked in milk and pressed.
Why don't you just buy a real tip???
Kim
There is some good info on this site on making your own;
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/MILK DUD CUE TIPS.htm
Here are tools for pressing;
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/PRODUCTS.htm
Dan
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/MILK DUD CUE TIPS.htm
Here are tools for pressing;
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/PRODUCTS.htm
Dan
Experiment a bit. Use different combinations of milk and other liquids. maybe microwave them (i do). Then press them with a vice for a few days or heat dry them. I put them between metal plates with one side drilled out a bit so they already have a dome shape. It makes it easier to shape because when mine are ready to install, they are hard as hell (i like a hard tip) which, without a lathe make then even harder to shape. I love making my own as I can get exactly what I want. And not paying $20 a tip is a plus.
To answer your other question no they do not fray like the out of the box soft ones do.
To answer your other question no they do not fray like the out of the box soft ones do.
DJ -
Have fun and keep us posted.
Gustav -
I have out-of-the-box-soft Elkmaster tips on several cues. They work fine for me. If "fray" means "to wear down so threads are showing", I have never had one do that.
What do you mean by "fray"?
Rick
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> no they do not fray like the out of the box soft ones do.
Have fun and keep us posted.
Gustav -
I have out-of-the-box-soft Elkmaster tips on several cues. They work fine for me. If "fray" means "to wear down so threads are showing", I have never had one do that.
What do you mean by "fray"?
Rick
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> no they do not fray like the out of the box soft ones do.
That's Pool Target Ray! I knew that guy from Barley's Billiards in Atlanta about 20 years ago. I remember when he invented that pool target thing. :grin:
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/Pool_Target.htm
Looks like he has been busy. Thanks for the link. I think I'll get one of those presses and try to make some of those Milk Duds.
Rick, he probably means that if you are using a lathe and a blade to cut them to size, sometimes and more often than not, they seem to shred a bit on the sides.
Little Fuzzy Wuzzies on the sides.
Kimaroonie, you can also take a stock Camaro, Challenger etc, off the lot and make dem much faster too.
Thats what they are doing with the EM's. They are Hot Rodding them.
It is fun to experiment. If you change your mind, just get a hold of Dawg.
I put one of those on my Meucci and it works great. Talk about draw.
The plans that were posted on that site look like they would make a nice Dud.
If you want a pre made press, go to EBay and search for pool cue tip presses. Joe Piccone's store will come up. He makes a great press.
You can also use a small smooth jawed hobby vice and that will work just fine too.
Some flat fender washers with a bolt in the middle to press them works.
Altho, pressing between 2 washers and they tend to get a little skewed sideways from tightening the bolt.
Lots of ways to skin a cat tho.
Myself, I just eat a can of Spinach and press them between my thumb and index finger.
The instructions posted on the Dud site are about as good as they get. You can soak them for a straight 24 hrs and quite often, I will put them in the Micro just to give them a head start.
I press mine for 24 and have never put them in the oven but I'm thinking that I will give that a try next time around.
If you have a pair of calipers, here is something you can use to judge the hardness.
This is compliments of Joey Bautista.
.220" thick, soft
.200" thick, medium
.180" thick, hard
Somewhere around the Med to Hard are the ones I like to go for.
Little Fuzzy Wuzzies on the sides.
Kimaroonie, you can also take a stock Camaro, Challenger etc, off the lot and make dem much faster too.
Thats what they are doing with the EM's. They are Hot Rodding them.
It is fun to experiment. If you change your mind, just get a hold of Dawg.
I put one of those on my Meucci and it works great. Talk about draw.
The plans that were posted on that site look like they would make a nice Dud.
If you want a pre made press, go to EBay and search for pool cue tip presses. Joe Piccone's store will come up. He makes a great press.
You can also use a small smooth jawed hobby vice and that will work just fine too.
Some flat fender washers with a bolt in the middle to press them works.
Altho, pressing between 2 washers and they tend to get a little skewed sideways from tightening the bolt.
Lots of ways to skin a cat tho.
Myself, I just eat a can of Spinach and press them between my thumb and index finger.
The instructions posted on the Dud site are about as good as they get. You can soak them for a straight 24 hrs and quite often, I will put them in the Micro just to give them a head start.
I press mine for 24 and have never put them in the oven but I'm thinking that I will give that a try next time around.
If you have a pair of calipers, here is something you can use to judge the hardness.
This is compliments of Joey Bautista.
.220" thick, soft
.200" thick, medium
.180" thick, hard
Somewhere around the Med to Hard are the ones I like to go for.
Last edited:
Thanks for all the info guys, going to give it a try. The only reason i dont want to buy the ones already done is because i like to expirament and try new things for myself.
I truly hope everything works out well for you and your experimentation's. I had thought about doing the same thing but for that its just better to get 3 for $9 from Jeff PoolDawg8
Tips play freaking awesome, move whitey around like ballet dancer.
@bumpa
- I played with out of the box elkmasters for years and every so often when shaping them or freshly installing them they would start to fray or shred a bit. This would not be every tip, but some would do this. Also when burnishing the sides of the tip, i could never obtain a "hard" side and they would mushroom for the first few weeks until they would compress enough.
Then I started experimenting with harder tips and I like the way they felt. That led me to try and make my own "milk duds". I can say that the tips I press are very hard. I used to go through 4-6 elkmasters a year (I'm OCD about my tip and don't like to play them too short) , but now I've had the same one on for at least a year and it barely looks used.
- I played with out of the box elkmasters for years and every so often when shaping them or freshly installing them they would start to fray or shred a bit. This would not be every tip, but some would do this. Also when burnishing the sides of the tip, i could never obtain a "hard" side and they would mushroom for the first few weeks until they would compress enough.
Then I started experimenting with harder tips and I like the way they felt. That led me to try and make my own "milk duds". I can say that the tips I press are very hard. I used to go through 4-6 elkmasters a year (I'm OCD about my tip and don't like to play them too short) , but now I've had the same one on for at least a year and it barely looks used.
milk duds
I have tried to soak elk masters and le pro tips in milk and pressing them.
and i tried other liquids
for about 8 years i have made milk dud tips , over all my tips have been a failure.
the tip worked good for about 1 week of heavy playing then it started to misc cue the tip glazing over and it was a constantly being shaped.
this is what it has turned out for me . i would use almost everyones elses tips than one of my own.
i want a tip that plays like a sniper or a moori ,kamui onxy ultra skin.
my tips where not cutting it .
i pressed between two oak blocks 1x1x5
1/4 hole drilled on each end then put washers an a 1/4 bolt and nuts made a diy tip press. this press works really well
but I have tried milk dud tips that I thought were great i just cannot get them any more.
on a le pro soaking in milk expanded 0.030 to 0.040 in one hour
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' 0.085 in one week of soaking max expansion. i do not have a duro meter and from what everone has told me most duro meters collect dust as in being almost a total waist of money ,
it was also said that not every duro meter will work on testing tips.
i was using scales for hardness rating
pressed tips back to 0.238 height . pressing time 3 week
pm if want aq pic of my press
MMike
I have tried to soak elk masters and le pro tips in milk and pressing them.
and i tried other liquids
for about 8 years i have made milk dud tips , over all my tips have been a failure.
the tip worked good for about 1 week of heavy playing then it started to misc cue the tip glazing over and it was a constantly being shaped.
this is what it has turned out for me . i would use almost everyones elses tips than one of my own.
i want a tip that plays like a sniper or a moori ,kamui onxy ultra skin.
my tips where not cutting it .
i pressed between two oak blocks 1x1x5
1/4 hole drilled on each end then put washers an a 1/4 bolt and nuts made a diy tip press. this press works really well
but I have tried milk dud tips that I thought were great i just cannot get them any more.
on a le pro soaking in milk expanded 0.030 to 0.040 in one hour
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' 0.085 in one week of soaking max expansion. i do not have a duro meter and from what everone has told me most duro meters collect dust as in being almost a total waist of money ,
it was also said that not every duro meter will work on testing tips.
i was using scales for hardness rating
pressed tips back to 0.238 height . pressing time 3 week
pm if want aq pic of my press
MMike
I've done it with milk, tea, tequila, vodka, water, and even moonshine. The moonshine tip, I soaked overnight and pressed the crap out of it to try and make a break tip. It worked out pretty well, surprisingly.
The best method: Put it on your cue, bang balls for a couple hours, put it back in the lathe and reshape it.
The best method: Put it on your cue, bang balls for a couple hours, put it back in the lathe and reshape it.
Blue -
> Little Fuzzy Wuzzies on the sides.
Burnishing with a piece of rough brown shopping bag paper and a little beeswax has prevented fuzzies on the sides of my tips.
I admire you guys for experimenting, but I have so much to learn about playing, I think I will spend my time trying to learn how to use what I have. I'm a two-year newbie old guy who is still struggling to keep his head down and follow through.
Have fun.
Rick
> Little Fuzzy Wuzzies on the sides.
Burnishing with a piece of rough brown shopping bag paper and a little beeswax has prevented fuzzies on the sides of my tips.
I admire you guys for experimenting, but I have so much to learn about playing, I think I will spend my time trying to learn how to use what I have. I'm a two-year newbie old guy who is still struggling to keep his head down and follow through.
Have fun.
Rick
It seems that there as many methods to making milk duds as there are people making them... For the last year I have worked on perfecting a method to ensure that every tip turned out will be consistent in hardness and elasticity. While I do not make milk duds I did some experimentation with them in the early stages of process development...
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/MILK DUD CUE TIPS.htm
Will actually produce a decent quality milk dud but I need to point out several things not mentioned or mentioned incorrectly...
1)Elk Masters are not overly consistent out of the box... Without a scale, durometer and COR Tester you are on your own to figure out which tips are suitable for processing... One "tip" from the old school is the "witch" test... IF the tip floats in water it is a witch and should be burned at the stake..... Other types of tips can be dudded but they require different preparation ranging from extended boiling to acetone baths.... You would be amazed at how far and in how many ways you can deconstruct a tip when you put your mind to it.....
2)Milk is not all the same.... The author mentions milk fat in the write up but it is actually the casein or proteins in the milk which causes the changes to the milk dud... Casein based glues were used as an adhesive in early aircraft and are still in use in safety matches...... While milk is graded by milk fat content this is in no way an indicator of which milk to use since it's the proteins you are after.... Skim milk contains the same protein as whole or butter milk... Pasteurization damages some proteins and the breed of cattle actually impacts the percentages of the different types of protein found in it.... If you can get fresh milk you will have the highest casein content otherwise I guess you will have to just read the labels.....
3)Most ovens are not very accurate at low temperatures... You need to heat the tips at about 130 degrees to keep from causing damage to the leather fibers... If I cook a Le Pro for an hour @145 in my oven I can guarantee it will split when I press it... Go Lower and just go longer... Cooking is only to drive the water out of the tip and crystallize the casein.....
Good luck with the tips. If you give up... Pooldawg8 does make a very good Milk dud and I have Tech Duds on www.Outsville.com... The Tech Duds go thru rigorous testing from start to finish and the extra super secret ingredient is not milk =) The site is still under construction but I should have the tweaks finished in the next few days... I'll take all constructive criticism.. Hell I'll even take suggestions on a name besides Tech Dud... Maybe "The 6Million Dollar Tip".... We have the technology... Better, Stronger, Faster....
http://www.gladiators-usa.com/MILK DUD CUE TIPS.htm
Will actually produce a decent quality milk dud but I need to point out several things not mentioned or mentioned incorrectly...
1)Elk Masters are not overly consistent out of the box... Without a scale, durometer and COR Tester you are on your own to figure out which tips are suitable for processing... One "tip" from the old school is the "witch" test... IF the tip floats in water it is a witch and should be burned at the stake..... Other types of tips can be dudded but they require different preparation ranging from extended boiling to acetone baths.... You would be amazed at how far and in how many ways you can deconstruct a tip when you put your mind to it.....
2)Milk is not all the same.... The author mentions milk fat in the write up but it is actually the casein or proteins in the milk which causes the changes to the milk dud... Casein based glues were used as an adhesive in early aircraft and are still in use in safety matches...... While milk is graded by milk fat content this is in no way an indicator of which milk to use since it's the proteins you are after.... Skim milk contains the same protein as whole or butter milk... Pasteurization damages some proteins and the breed of cattle actually impacts the percentages of the different types of protein found in it.... If you can get fresh milk you will have the highest casein content otherwise I guess you will have to just read the labels.....
3)Most ovens are not very accurate at low temperatures... You need to heat the tips at about 130 degrees to keep from causing damage to the leather fibers... If I cook a Le Pro for an hour @145 in my oven I can guarantee it will split when I press it... Go Lower and just go longer... Cooking is only to drive the water out of the tip and crystallize the casein.....
Good luck with the tips. If you give up... Pooldawg8 does make a very good Milk dud and I have Tech Duds on www.Outsville.com... The Tech Duds go thru rigorous testing from start to finish and the extra super secret ingredient is not milk =) The site is still under construction but I should have the tweaks finished in the next few days... I'll take all constructive criticism.. Hell I'll even take suggestions on a name besides Tech Dud... Maybe "The 6Million Dollar Tip".... We have the technology... Better, Stronger, Faster....