Are you still improving or has your game leveled off ?

[Cameron Smith]

Not sure I agree with you. Time is the factor.

It takes time at the table just to maintain your current level.

Additional time to learn new knowledge, additional time to practice that new knowledge, additional time before it gets converted to improvement.

Solidifying my fundamentals and mechanics made my game jump. I am still getting better, just at a slower rate. I am in the cycle I described above. Maintain, learn, practice, improve. Repeat.

I suspect given the amount of time I can devote to pool, I will peak out about 1-2 yrs. from now and then it will be almost all maintenance and very little improvement.

Correct, I should have clarified that my stance is dependent on time and health. In a perfect world if you have the time to devote to regular deliberate practice and competition you should continue to improve steadily, but not necessarily quick enough to reach the top tier (that's an entirely different discussion).

For many people, it's just not possible to devote the time and that is fair. But I think it is still possible to improve with limited table time, albeit at a much slower rate.

 

[bad_hit]

Correct, I should have clarified that my stance is dependent on time and health. In a perfect world if you have the time to devote to regular deliberate practice and competition you should continue to improve steadily, but not necessarily quick enough to reach the top tier (that's an entirely different discussion).

For many people, it's just not possible to devote the time and that is fair. But I think it is still possible to improve with limited table time, albeit at a much slower rate.

I really think that the vast majority of pool players just don't practice like they should (unfortunately I gotta include myself in that statement, but I'm working on it). It's clear that some top pros would do 1000 hours of drills without ever playing a rack (Toasty Hohmann, Neils, the Ouchans). That's how they got there. Most of us don't have the discipline to practice that way, or don't know how and assume that we're practicing in a way that gets us on the fastest path to excellence.

Time, yes...but it can be much less time if the approach is right.

 

[Cameron Smith]

I really think that the vast majority of pool players just don't practice like they should (unfortunately I gotta include myself in that statement, but I'm working on it). It's clear that some top pros would do 1000 hours of drills without ever playing a rack (Toasty Hohmann, Neils, the Ouchans). That's how they got there. Most of us don't have the discipline to practice that way, or don't know how and assume that we're practicing in a way that gets us on the fastest path to excellence.

Time, yes...but it can be much less time if the approach is right.

For sure, and that is true of many pursuits. Many golfers for example either don't go to the driving range, or don't utilize it properly. Not knowing how to practice though is also a major factor. When I was teaching guitar a significant flaw in my approach was my failure to spend an adequate amount of time addressing proper practice habits. I gave them homework and instructed them to practice 30 min to an hour a day. Some students thrived, others never got past the first chapter of the practice book.

 

[mvp]

take a 1-2month break, don't read pool,don't play pool, don't think pool! Then go out and just have fun! You will be a little out of stroke but will see quick improvements and it may carry you to the next level! My thoughts on improving are this: if your thought process is the same and your stroke is the same how do you plan on improving? Every time I stalled I would do the opposite of my brain, for example if needed a draw shot I would use a follow shot, or I'd pick a different order than what was the easiest, it will expand your arsenal of shots and thoughts. It really made the game hard, then when you have an opponent play normal! Or a good practice game with a buddy is 2and over. Which is played (8ball) you make 2balls in a row no matter what happens on the 3rd shot you lose your turn. So it trains you to spot and setup safeties early on pourpose and not out of necessity!

 

[daphish1]

If you don't track your performance in drills how will you know if you are improving?

 

[CJH]

My improvement is very slow and I play/practice 7-10 hours per week. I recently beat the 9 ball ghost 2 games in a row but lost 8 of 10. I won 6 of 100 games over a 10 day period and almost busted a cue over my knee in frustration. The break means a lot to my chances and I need help with breaking. I can move the cue ball around ok but speed control kills me so I need to work on that. I'm 53 years old and just want to get back to the level I was in my late teens and 20's, then build from there. I didn't play for a long time. I love playing though and it clears my head from everyday life and work. When I'm playing, I don't think about any other crap I have going on. My table is an 8' Brunswick. I have a 9' Centennial being delivered later this month.

 

[octy81]

I have grown in keeping my composure, I don't get upset anymore if I lose , but I feel like my game has fallen way down 2 years ago I was running through everyone I played but now I can't win a game to save my life . It's my mental game I have to work on I psych myself out and I feel like I lose the game before I play . I become too anxious and can't perform to the best of my abilities.

 

[Celtic]

This "you've reached your natural limit" thing is a total crock.

I have very little natural talent at this game, and neither does Neils Feijen.

Actually saying Neils Feijen has very little talent at the game of pool is a $^%&ing joke, seriously. I know people like to say "he just practices a lot" but the guy reached world class level pool very quickly and has been a force in the pool world for decades. You do "not" do that on practice alone. His peak level he is able to reach is right near the top of the world. To say the guy has little natural talent for the game of pool is moronic.

Very few people can "ever" reach the level of Neils no matter what they do.

If there was no such thing as limits to potential in any given thing for any individual I would have become a pro golfer. I would have put in 14 hours a day 7 days a week into it for years straight if that is what it took. I guarantee you that had I done so I would not have had a prayer of making the PGA tour no matter how much effort or proper training and coaching and practice.

Different people have different limits in different things, this is reality, a sad reality for some, but reality none the less.

 

[Dan White]

Curious for people who have been playing more than 3 yrs, are you still improving or has your game has leveled off ?

Forgive me for being blunt, but are you kidding me? The question should be:

Curious for people who have been playing more than 30 yrs, are you still improving or has your game has leveled off ?

If you've been playing for 3 years then you are still a baby. Babies don't stop growing after 3 years.

The point is that most people haven't even started to learn good fundamentals in 3 years (barring the rare individual who actually learned things correctly from the start). Leveling off for awhile is normal. Take a week off, come back and reevaluate your weaknesses HONESTLY. You can only improve from there. Oh, and pick up a copy of Play Great Pool by Mark Wilson.

 

[ronscuba]

Forgive me for being blunt, but are you kidding me? The question should be:

Curious for people who have been playing more than 30 yrs, are you still improving or has your game has leveled off ?

If you've been playing for 3 years then you are still a baby. Babies don't stop growing after 3 years.

The point is that most people haven't even started to learn good fundamentals in 3 years (barring the rare individual who actually learned things correctly from the start). Leveling off for awhile is normal. Take a week off, come back and reevaluate your weaknesses HONESTLY. You can only improve from there. Oh, and pick up a copy of Play Great Pool by Mark Wilson.

Sorry you did not like my question.

I stipulated 3 yrs because EVERYONE sees big improvement in the initial 3 years.

I know a ton of people that have not made any notable improvement after their initial 3 years. For them, basically it is their limited time to play and practice. They play once a week at team league.

I am 50. Started playing 5 yrs ago. I am still progressing, but available time is a big factor on how fast I am improving. My fundamentals while not perfect, are sound and I have been told so by instructors. That does not mean I don't practice or try to improve my fundamentals. It's just that I have had instructors tell me other areas of weakness need more attention.

Point of my post is one can level off on improvement because of the amount of time they can dedicate to pool. I put in about 7 hrs of table time a week. I won't be surprised if I hit a plateau unless I can put in more time than that. Father time on my body and eyes is also a factor. Just my opinion.

 

[Ak Guy]

Headed down hill.

My game is in the pits. These beautiful Alaskan summers make it hard to stay inside and a month long moose and caribou hunt is coming up and shortly after that is the state tourney.

Woe is me.

 

[Dan White]

Sorry you did not like my question.

I stipulated 3 yrs because EVERYONE sees big improvement in the initial 3 years.

I didn't mean to be negative. Sorry about that. I didn't know there was anything particularly special about the three year mark. I was simply making the point that even life-long players continue to improve.

I think if your fundamentals are really good, then reduced play time will not take away much of your ability, unless you play at the highest professional level. I think the better your fundamentals the easier it is to maintain your best play whether you play 30 hours a week or 3. Are you any less capable of riding a bike if you only do it one hour a week vs 30 hours?

So I think as long as you are playing and are actively working to improve your game, then by definition you will continually get better. I think you can only backslide if you rely on poor fundamentals, or if you have a deteriorating physical situation.

 

[greyghost]

From a long time players perspective and an instructors. The players that pay the most attention to detail progress the fastest. As your experience grows plateaus last longer and improvements are generally smaller and smaller. For example if john Schmidt and I got locked in a room together for a year I'm sure I would come out a much stronger player....I seriously doubt that much physicality in my game would change at all.


Hope that makes sense.

-greyghost


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[philly]

From a long time players perspective and an instructors. The players that pay the most attention to detail progress the fastest. As your experience grows plateaus last longer and improvements are generally smaller and smaller. For example if john Schmidt and I got locked in a room together for a year I'm sure I would come out a much stronger player....I seriously doubt that much physicality in my game would change at all.


Hope that makes sense.

-greyghost


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Makes perfect sense. Earlier in the post I had mentioned lengthening plateaus as you progress. The good part is that when you break through the plateaus you are a better player because the knowledge of the table that you glean never plateaus. That continues.

 

[Jimbojim]

To improve its about knowing what doesn't work and trying to do what's necessary to fix it.

Take a moment to analyse why you have plateau-ed and fix it at the core, there is always a solution available.

 

[ronscuba]

I didn't mean to be negative. Sorry about that. I didn't know there was anything particularly special about the three year mark. I was simply making the point that even life-long players continue to improve.

I think if your fundamentals are really good, then reduced play time will not take away much of your ability, unless you play at the highest professional level. I think the better your fundamentals the easier it is to maintain your best play whether you play 30 hours a week or 3. Are you any less capable of riding a bike if you only do it one hour a week vs 30 hours?

So I think as long as you are playing and are actively working to improve your game, then by definition you will continually get better. I think you can only backslide if you rely on poor fundamentals, or if you have a deteriorating physical situation.

Agreed and I think everyone can agree that improvements are smaller and take longer the better you get.

I can see I am more consistent in all areas of my game and I am doing things I could not a year ago. Another guideline I use to measure improvement is my handicap rating in league and tournaments. I set an annual goal to improve and have my handicap raised. So far it has happened every year since I started 5 yrs ago. At some point it will stop or take many yrs to improve enough to get raised.