Article with tons of diagrams...

Practical or Theoretical ?

Colin Colenso said:
22 Ways to make the Impossible Shot​
http://www.top147.com/magazine/2004007/2004007091316472047.htm

This is one of the articles up on the new edition of www.Cuezine.com
Click to expand...

Have you tried it yourself all the shots sir and makes
all of them even on many attempts ?

The masse shots for me are just incredible.
Even Efren could not probably do all the shots in many attempts.

:confused: :confused:

Unless of course some of them are purely theoritical. :D

Just a newbie seeking some answers. ;)
 
Now it works...

Quite impressive shots. Wouldn't try majority of them in real match situation and many of them can be done only on a new cloth.

But cool diagrams !

"Free your mind !" :p
 
some shots are good conversation pieces, but why would someone shoot 7 rails if you could shoot a short shot off one rail instead? I guess it is only practice, but my basketball coach used to tell me to practice the shots you will shoot in a game, not too much gained from practicing half court shots if you are less than 50 percent from the top of the key, just my two cents
 
jump masse?

i can't remember having seen one in 9 ball or even in a trick shot competition. usually after a jump the ball just jump some more with less altitude or rolls forward. maybe somebody can share one in a pool action.

those are nice suggestions though.
 
I would either jump bank one rail or back first three rails. The ones with masse and jump-masse aren't impossible but they're pretty impossible! What kind of success rate are we talking about for those shots? pretty darn low i would say. I think when facing shots like these a player should always choose to play the shot with the greatest margin of error IMHO. Great ideas tho! A true visionary.

Tim.
 
Several replies in one.

CebuanoNiNoy said:
Have you tried it yourself all the shots sir and makes
all of them even on many attempts ?

The masse shots for me are just incredible.
Even Efren could not probably do all the shots in many attempts.

:confused: :confused:

Unless of course some of them are purely theoritical. :D

Just a newbie seeking some answers. ;)
Click to expand...

I have not tried any of these shots yet, but I will someday soon.

I do know from experience that all these shots (except maybe no.6) are possible but some will require very active rails (cushions) and a fast cloth.

I think my prefered, highest percentage shots would be numbers two, one, three and four in that order. If I knew the table well, I think no.3 would be the highest percentage shot. It makes the 8 ball a big target and the angle is pretty natural if you get the speed and draw right.

All the masse shots are possible, though not easy.

Timbo asked about the jump masse straight back shot. I have seen Mike Massey play this type of shot. I believe he uses a non-standard jump cue tip. One that has more grip than typical jump cues which use very hard tips to aid jumping.

Jeff...you are right, shot no.10 must travel at least 7 rails, and possibly 8 if it comes off the side rail. One heck of a whack that's for sure.

Note: Once I started trying to work out possible solutions, I couldn't stop until I worked out every type I could imagine. Can anyone think of another possible shot that is makeable?
 
Colin Colenso said:
Can anyone think of another possible shot that is makeable?
Click to expand...

I can see two additional jump shots.

First, the most obvious jump, just clear the 9, hitting the 8 as the cue ball descends to the cloth. A straight jump with a controlled trajectory (clear the 9, don't clear the 8).

Second, there is a similar controlled trajectory shot shooting the cue into the closest short rail, and jump off the rail over the 9 but not clearing the 8. (I love this shot as it allows you to escape some pretty tight positions by rails. It's real tough to control where everything ends up, but is often a better gambe than a foul. )

Also, there should be a couple of two or three rail shots into the upper left corner, no ?

Dave
 
DaveK said:
I can see two additional jump shots.

First, the most obvious jump, just clear the 9, hitting the 8 as the cue ball descends to the cloth. A straight jump with a controlled trajectory (clear the 9, don't clear the 8).

Second, there is a similar controlled trajectory shot shooting the cue into the closest short rail, and jump off the rail over the 9 but not clearing the 8. (I love this shot as it allows you to escape some pretty tight positions by rails. It's real tough to control where everything ends up, but is often a better gambe than a foul. )

Also, there should be a couple of two or three rail shots into the upper left corner, no ?

Dave
Click to expand...

The first two you mentioned are possible but I think they are less repeatable than the hardest in my list. Good work though :)

I can't see any additional shots that accord to your last suggestion.

There is another shot off the bottom and side rail that could cut the 8 onto the nine and maybe a similar cut off the near side rail, but they seem a bit trivial. I want shots that come toward a decent width target.
 
One more option would need super slick cloth and maybe a heated table. It is spectacular 3 rail masse. This shot is not so hard for some 3-cushion players.

START(
%HN8Y0%IM4Y2%PH7Z2%UW6D5%VI4Y3%]P3W9%^a0D1%eA6a8%_d5Z5%``2N4
%aX2C7%ba7D8%ce6N4%dd4[0
)END

You can see a similar shot by Semih Sayginer in the 'Free Views' section of www.caromtv.com
 
Colin Colenso said:
I can't see any additional shots that accord to your last suggestion.
Click to expand...

I'll set it up tonight and try. I think there is a three rail kick there, but you hafta just clear the 9 ball. More from DaveKhome a bit later regardless of my success...

You have much better control over your masse action than I if you feel that the straight jump is less repeatable than the various masse/multi-rail shots. The jump off the rail is very difficult to control, but I have developed a cueing technique that limits the power (a pure wrist stroke, no arm whatsoever) and consequently makes the jump action more controlled. It is still far from a reliable shot, I just use it to escape trouble.

Fun thread Colin, thanks ...

BTW, I'd likely try the long>check-off-the-far-short-rail kick as others including yourself suggested. It would be my best shot at it, although the one rail shot might be best (if you miss short and foul, the combination will be messed up in the process).

Dave
 
not world class

I tried the shots, and based on Colins description, I am not a world class trick shot artist, and cannot masse much either ! The first bunch are all fine shots, made a reasonable number. Shot 5 is touchy to say the least, and I could not do 6 and think it impossible. I see how 7 and 8 could work for better players than I, and I have no stroke for 9 and 10 and greatly admire those who do. Practice, practice, practice... but I'll still not spend much time on the jumps and bigger masses.

I see your point about shooting into the upper left corner, making it is near impossible, and the time or two that it was close you should have seen what I left for my opponent :( . Thanks again for everything !


Dave
 
DaveKhome said:
I tried the shots, and based on Colins description, I am not a world class trick shot artist, and cannot masse much either ! The first bunch are all fine shots, made a reasonable number. Shot 5 is touchy to say the least, and I could not do 6 and think it impossible. I see how 7 and 8 could work for better players than I, and I have no stroke for 9 and 10 and greatly admire those who do. Practice, practice, practice... but I'll still not spend much time on the jumps and bigger masses.

I see your point about shooting into the upper left corner, making it is near impossible, and the time or two that it was close you should have seen what I left for my opponent :( . Thanks again for everything !


Dave
Click to expand...
Glad you tried it out Dave:)

To make no.5 you may need to play it with lot of draw and come off the side rail as shown here:
START(%HN8Y0%IM4Y2%PH7Z2%Ur2E6%Vi7C8%WD1U8%XH0Y5%]P9Y4%^W2Z9%eB0b1%_X4Z5%`c0R5%ar9E9%bh9C9%cQ1I0%dC4T5)END

No.6 just may not be possible unless on an extraordinary table which is super fast with sliding top and bottom rails and grippy side rails. You may get more speed using backspin on the shot too, but most tables, I suspect will send the cue ball wide of the 8 ball. The same may be the case on shot no. 10.

Ten shots most players should be able to make are:
1,2,3,4,7,9,10,12,19,22

Try these using the scoring system in the article.

Count the score if you hit the 8. (Saves time setting the shot up).
First attempt success score ten points.
2nd score 7, 3rd score 6, 4th score 5, 5th score 4. If no success in 5 shots move on to next shot without scoring. (loser :p )

50 points is a good target. 70 points is certified angle expert.

Practice these and challenge your friends and jerks who need to be relieved of their money and oversized egos.

Send me ten percent of winnings :D

btw: If LastTwo is reading this, I replied to your PM but it said your account was full.
 
Enjoyed the article a lot, Colin. I can imagine executing most of them, but like Countess Dracula, I find the jump masse pretty hard to imagine. In my thirty eight years around the game, I've never seen the jump masse even attempted.
 
Colin Colenso said:
Glad you tried it out Dave:)

Ten shots most players should be able to make are:
1,2,3,4,7,9,10,12,19,22
Click to expand...

I'm glad I tried them too, shot 3 is one I'll remember !

In shot 5, the corner foul looms large, much up table and I miss on my table. It's touchy ... HEY, you changed shot 5 from a 3 (original) to 4 rail shot (from recent post), makes it a bit closer on my table.

Shot 6 I can't hardly get past the side pocket at the end ... tried a bunch, found it hard to get into the upper right hand two-railer (I look at multi-rail shots as sums of 1, 2, and 3 rail shots). Couldn't find the stroke to get it all the way there either ....

I admire your confidence in 'most players', or maybe I just need to stay away from wagering in halls where you hang out. 10 is a 7 rail shot and 22 is off the side horn ! If I walked into a hall and saw people executing 7 rail shots I'd hide my cues and say I was just in for a drink (make that a double please).

Thanks again Colin, keep up the great work !

Dave (scored 64)
 
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